Uncharted 3: A Big Step Backwards - Combat

Uncharted 3 is a pretty fine looking game... when you have 3 seconds to take it all in before having to spend yet another 20 minutes fighting wave after wave of the same 4 minions who expertly flank you in an areas with barely sufficient cover. Every fight can basically be broken down into the same thing:

• 1st wave: normal dudes who go down pretty easily. There might be a better gun in the mix somewhere. They all seem to have infinite grenades.
• 2nd wave: Bullet sponges. At least two heavily armored dudes with shotguns plus some easy minions for flavor. If you're lucky there will be a grenadier or a sniper or two... just to make it fun.
• 3rd wave: A little bit of everything... especially bullet sponges. A rocket launcher or two, at least 2 snipers, a heavily armored dude, a riot shield guy, maybe a mounted turret. Keeps things interesting.

Seriously, this is how it's been the entire game. Every fight feels exactly the same. I dread finding an open-ish space because I know I'm going to have to slog through another hordes mode. Even in the quasi-stealth sections you know someone is going to spot either you or a body since you can't hide them. As soon the alarm goes up everyone in the world will know exactly where you are and how best to flank you. Oh, and you can't stealth kill armored guys. You'll just run up and punch them in the back... because that's effective.

I purchased my PS3 last fall, mainly for the Uncharted series because of all the great things that I had heard. I have played them all within the past 6 months, so my recollection is pretty fresh, and it has given me the opportunity to really see the progress they've made with the series. I enjoyed the first one, but by the end I was annoyed with the combat. For some reason Naughty Dog thinks that interesting and engaging combat means that guys can take 10 bullets to the head and still keep coming. The entire section leading to the church was frustratingly horrible. I overlooked that though because the story was decent, the locations were interesting, and the puzzles were fun.

That being said I felt they really nailed it with Uncharted 2. That remains one of the greatest gaming experiences I've ever had. I felt they really got the balance between interesting and fun combat, traversal sequences, and engaging puzzles. The combat was fun, not frustrating... at least not until you reached Shambala and the bullet sponges showed up in force. The last hour of that game was where it went down a peg for me, but I still absolutely loved the game overall. I loved the game for the character interactions, and the closing scene was fantastic. It left me with very high expectations for the third one.

Uncharted 3 has been a huge disappointment for me so far. I've finally reached "The Atlantis of the Sands", and just when I thought I had seen the worst the boring and frustrating combat had to offer, now I get fight wave after wave of Ghost Rider wannabes who can take multiple rocket/grenade blasts, can teleport right next to you, can fire magic grenades that can't be thrown back, and required multiple head-shots to kill. This wouldn't be so bad if there were areas of better cover where I could take a few seconds to get health back, but there aren't. Trying to keep these guys from flanking you is an exercise in futility. They teleport right next to you, and even unloading clip after clip of shots right into their faces doesn't seem to be enough to stop these guys before they have killed you. It's more than a little frustrating.

The biggest letdown of this game for me is how they seemed to have lessened what I thought were the best parts of the first two games: the story, the characters, the traversal elements and the puzzles, and only seem to have increased what I have always felt was the worst parts of them: the combat. Sure, the melee combat is more involved, but it's only helpful when there isn't a room full of guys with automatic weapons shooting you in the back while you're playing a repetitive, predictable melee mini-game. Also, the PS3 controller does not handle precision targeting well. Trying to nudge the crosshairs in any direction is painful mini-game in and of itself. I don't know if it's the actual controller or the software interfacing with it, but it's bad. The 360 controller is much better suited for this kind of thing. Then there are the sections where the environment is moving, which makes it even more difficult to target things with any precision. Not enjoyable.

I definitely feel that the combat in Uncharted 3 is its weakest component. There is also just too much of it. Every 10 steps Drake takes seem to lead him into yet another open area filled to the brim with uninteresting minions who just soak up bullets. It got old in the first hour of the game, and it hasn't gotten any better since. Uncharted 3 is a big step backwards in terms of the combat in the series.

Uncharted 3 is a pretty fine looking game... when you have 3 seconds to take it all in before having to spend yet another 20 minutes fighting wave after wave of the same 4 minions who expertly flank you in an areas with barely sufficient cover. Every fight can basically be broken down into the same thing:

• 1st wave: normal dudes who go down pretty easily. There might be a better gun in the mix somewhere. They all seem to have infinite grenades.
• 2nd wave: Bullet sponges. At least two heavily armored dudes with shotguns plus some easy minions for flavor. If you're lucky there will be a grenadier or a sniper or two... just to make it fun.
• 3rd wave: A little bit of everything... especially bullet sponges. A rocket launcher or two, at least 2 snipers, a heavily armored dude, a riot shield guy, maybe a mounted turret. Keeps things interesting.

Seriously, this is how it's been the entire game. Every fight feels exactly the same. I dread finding an open-ish space because I know I'm going to have to slog through another hordes mode. Even in the quasi-stealth sections you know someone is going to spot either you or a body since you can't hide them. As soon the alarm goes up everyone in the world will know exactly where you are and how best to flank you. Oh, and you can't stealth kill armored guys. You'll just run up and punch them in the back... because that's effective.

I purchased my PS3 last fall, mainly for the Uncharted series because of all the great things that I had heard. I have played them all within the past 6 months, so my recollection is pretty fresh, and it has given me the opportunity to really see the progress they've made with the series. I enjoyed the first one, but by the end I was annoyed with the combat. For some reason Naughty Dog thinks that interesting and engaging combat means that guys can take 10 bullets to the head and still keep coming. The entire section leading to the church was frustratingly horrible. I overlooked that though because the story was decent, the locations were interesting, and the puzzles were fun.

That being said I felt they really nailed it with Uncharted 2. That remains one of the greatest gaming experiences I've ever had. I felt they really got the balance between interesting and fun combat, traversal sequences, and engaging puzzles. The combat was fun, not frustrating... at least not until you reached Shambala and the bullet sponges showed up in force. The last hour of that game was where it went down a peg for me, but I still absolutely loved the game overall. I loved the game for the character interactions, and the closing scene was fantastic. It left me with very high expectations for the third one.

Uncharted 3 has been a huge disappointment for me so far. I've finally reached "The Atlantis of the Sands", and just when I thought I had seen the worst the boring and frustrating combat had to offer, now I get fight wave after wave of Ghost Rider wannabes who can take multiple rocket/grenade blasts, can teleport right next to you, can fire magic grenades that can't be thrown back, and required multiple head-shots to kill. This wouldn't be so bad if there were areas of better cover where I could take a few seconds to get health back, but there aren't. Trying to keep these guys from flanking you is an exercise in futility. They teleport right next to you, and even unloading clip after clip of shots right into their faces doesn't seem to be enough to stop these guys before they have killed you. It's more than a little frustrating.

The biggest letdown of this game for me is how they seemed to have lessened what I thought were the best parts of the first two games: the story, the characters, the traversal elements and the puzzles, and only seem to have increased what I have always felt was the worst parts of them: the combat. Sure, the melee combat is more involved, but it's only helpful when there isn't a room full of guys with automatic weapons shooting you in the back while you're playing a repetitive, predictable melee mini-game. Also, the PS3 controller does not handle precision targeting well. Trying to nudge the crosshairs in any direction is painful mini-game in and of itself. I don't know if it's the actual controller or the software interfacing with it, but it's bad. The 360 controller is much better suited for this kind of thing. Then there are the sections where the environment is moving, which makes it even more difficult to target things with any precision. Not enjoyable.

I definitely feel that the combat in Uncharted 3 is its weakest component. There is also just too much of it. Every 10 steps Drake takes seem to lead him into yet another open area filled to the brim with uninteresting minions who just soak up bullets. It got old in the first hour of the game, and it hasn't gotten any better since. Uncharted 3 is a big step backwards in terms of the combat in the series.

I agree the combat is nothing special in Uncharted. I just ended up putting it on easy to make the enemies less bullet spongy. After doing that I got through most of the fights pretty quickly and I really enjoyed the rest of the game. For me the set pieces and story was even better than 2, and my god is this game gorgeous. Definitely the best looking game I have seen on a console, and I think it even rivals games like BF3 and Witcher 2 on PC. But yea, the combat is kind of weak.

I want whatever you are smoking. I do not concur with your assessment.

On the other hand: It's fucking FINE.

I've already talked to death about the many issues that plagued Uncharted 3, so just to keep it short: I agree. If there is any redeemable criticism, though, it's the shooting. ND patched in an ''alternate aiming mode'' in the options, allowing you to play with the much smoother shooting mechanics of Uncharted 2; you have no idea how much that helps. It's worth going through again with that mode on because of how different it can make things feel.

It doesn't begin to remedy anything else of course, but you might at the very least find the combat to be more enjoyable.

The combat, the narrative, the incessant "Drake is climbing something, then a piece of it falls away", the boat chapter.

Uncharted 3 is a game I won't be rushing back to, despite having some mind-blowing set-pieces (though, exploring these a little more often reveals their gameyness).

Uncharted 2 was a masterpiece of the medium. 3 ain't.

I disagree. Both 3 and 2 are very similar games. But it is human nature to judge a sequel with expectations much harsher then the original. That's why 3 gets more flak then 2. How many times have you heard people say the first one was better then the second? It's just something people do, even if it's not true.

I don't know about you guys but this is what I just read:

Whaaa the games too hard whaa I'm bored whaa I don't know how to shoot dudes whaa...

I more or less had problems with the story and writing. The combat was not as good as it was in Uncharted 2 but it was a great game overall.

i agree entirely, had no problems with the first 2, but i get my ass handed to me in the combat sections in this game. Story and setting are great but i find the combat a total slog

 Both 3 and 2 are very similar games. 

@Zenaxzd said:

@LiquidPrince said:

Both 3 and 2 are very similar games.

I pretty much agree with this part of what you said here because 2's combat was just as busted as 3. I really don't understand why ND can not fix the terrible firefights they put you in during both games. The biggest problem with it is they just do not give you a safe zone to stand in, like say Gears of War, heck even Mass Effect 2 did it. The spot you start out when enemies roll out SHOULD ALWAYS be a safe spot from all angles and yet in both UC 2 and 3 there are often times where enemies will flank you right as a fight starts while others are still ahead. It's near impossible to regain HP at times. If they wanted the combat to be a big part of the series, they should of went and played other third person shooters and figured out what works and what doesn't, because there is just too many problems with the fights in UC2 and 3.

I actually prefer not having a safe spot to start off in. Uncharted combat to me has always been more about constant motion and taking advantage of the environment as opposed to cover-based shooting. They probably emphasized this even more in UC3 by reworking the melee combat to work even better in a "never stop moving" kind of way.

@LiquidPrince said:

How many times have you heard people say the first one was better then the second? It's just something people do, even if it's not true.

never

@GetEveryone: Or the "Drake comes around a corner/looks over a ledge and gets grabbed/punched by someone". Happens far too often.

@Zenaxzd said:

@LiquidPrince said:

Both 3 and 2 are very similar games.

I pretty much agree with this part of what you said here because 2's combat was just as busted as 3. I really don't understand why ND can not fix the terrible firefights they put you in during both games. The biggest problem with it is they just do not give you a safe zone to stand in, like say Gears of War, heck even Mass Effect 2 did it. The spot you start out when enemies roll out SHOULD ALWAYS be a safe spot from all angles and yet in both UC 2 and 3 there are often times where enemies will flank you right as a fight starts while others are still ahead. It's near impossible to regain HP at times. If they wanted the combat to be a big part of the series, they should of went and played other third person shooters and figured out what works and what doesn't, because there is just too many problems with the fights in UC2 and 3.

Maybe because in Gears of War and Mass Effect to a lesser extent you move like a walking tank, and thus you need some where to be safe, lest it gets frustrating. The combat in Uncharted is far more fun, because Drake is nimble and he can move around when in danger...

@Zenaxzd said:

@LiquidPrince said:

Both 3 and 2 are very similar games.

I pretty much agree with this part of what you said here because 2's combat was just as busted as 3. I really don't understand why ND can not fix the terrible firefights they put you in during both games. The biggest problem with it is they just do not give you a safe zone to stand in, like say Gears of War, heck even Mass Effect 2 did it. The spot you start out when enemies roll out SHOULD ALWAYS be a safe spot from all angles and yet in both UC 2 and 3 there are often times where enemies will flank you right as a fight starts while others are still ahead. It's near impossible to regain HP at times. If they wanted the combat to be a big part of the series, they should of went and played other third person shooters and figured out what works and what doesn't, because there is just too many problems with the fights in UC2 and 3.

Maybe because in Gears of War and Mass Effect to a lesser extent you move like a walking tank, and thus you need some where to be safe, lest it gets frustrating. The combat in Uncharted is far more fun, because Drake is nimble and he can move around when in danger...

I thought the game was a little tired, but never inferior to the previous 2. Maybe you just got tired of what is basically the same thing for three games back to back?

@l0thar said:

I purchased my PS3 last fall, mainly for the Uncharted series because of all the great things that I had heard. I have played them all within the past 6 months, so my recollection is pretty fresh, and it has given me the opportunity to really see the progress they've made with the series. I enjoyed the first one, but by the end I was annoyed with the combat. For some reason Naughty Dog thinks that interesting and engaging combat means that guys can take 10 bullets to the head and still keep coming. The entire section leading to the church was frustratingly horrible. I overlooked that though because the story was decent, the locations were interesting, and the puzzles were fun.

That being said I felt they really nailed it with Uncharted 2. That remains one of the greatest gaming experiences I've ever had. I felt they really got the balance between interesting and fun combat, traversal sequences, and engaging puzzles. The combat was fun, not frustrating... at least not until you reached Shambala and the bullet sponges showed up in force. The last hour of that game was where it went down a peg for me, but I still absolutely loved the game overall. I loved the game for the character interactions, and the closing scene was fantastic. It left me with very high expectations for the third one.

What happened to your Uncharted 1 & 2 trophies? Did you create a new PSN account just to play Heavy Rain and Uncharted 3?

The Uncharted games have always had terrible combat and very irritating enemies, if not for the mind blowing presentation, the story and the set piece moments of 2 and 3 I wouldn't care to play them at all. I am so glad they are finally moving on to something new, I just really hope ND has actually learned from all their mistakes with Nathan Drakes adventure and Last of Us isn't also filled with bad shooting controls and bullet sponges.

If you don't like it, you should try the game out on Hard like I did. It's stupidly fucking difficult, especially when the shotgun dudes rush you. Insta-kills plus being rushed by everyone? Awesome.

The combat in Uncharted always did kind of suck and feel very average. Uncharted 3 having way more of it made me a sad panda.

Unethical.

I agree, most of the combat sections were repetitive and not fun. It's a shame because I felt the story and location set pieces we're brilliant and an improvement over 2's.

Maybe because in Gears of War and Mass Effect to a lesser extent you move like a walking tank, and thus you need some where to be safe, lest it gets frustrating. The combat in Uncharted is far more fun, because Drake is nimble and he can move around when in danger...

@Icemael said:

@LiquidPrince said:

Maybe because in Gears of War and Mass Effect to a lesser extent you move like a walking tank, and thus you need some where to be safe, lest it gets frustrating. The combat in Uncharted is far more fun, because Drake is nimble and he can move around when in danger...

What? Gears of War and has sharper controls (if you, say, walk forward and then press back on the analogue stick, Fenix will instantly start moving backwards, whereas Drake will take a second to stop for the sake of "realism") and the walking speed is similar, but in Gears you can, you know, run, whereas in Uncharted you can't. If you dodge roll into a run it doesn't even have any startup time.Gears of War perhaps feels slow and stiff at first, but once you learn the controls movement is considerably faster than in Uncharted.

Wait, are you actually trying to convince me that Marcus is more mobile the Drake? Really? Anyways, Uncharted is much more responsive, as soon as you press a button it works instantly. It just looks like it's masked by an animation. You could be doing anything and as soon as you press jump, he will respond. It just has an amazing animation blending.

@DarthOrange said:

I thought the game was a little tired, but never inferior to the previous 2. Maybe you just got tired of what is basically the same thing for three games back to back?

@l0thar said:

I purchased my PS3 last fall, mainly for the Uncharted series because of all the great things that I had heard. I have played them all within the past 6 months, so my recollection is pretty fresh, and it has given me the opportunity to really see the progress they've made with the series. I enjoyed the first one, but by the end I was annoyed with the combat. For some reason Naughty Dog thinks that interesting and engaging combat means that guys can take 10 bullets to the head and still keep coming. The entire section leading to the church was frustratingly horrible. I overlooked that though because the story was decent, the locations were interesting, and the puzzles were fun.

That being said I felt they really nailed it with Uncharted 2. That remains one of the greatest gaming experiences I've ever had. I felt they really got the balance between interesting and fun combat, traversal sequences, and engaging puzzles. The combat was fun, not frustrating... at least not until you reached Shambala and the bullet sponges showed up in force. The last hour of that game was where it went down a peg for me, but I still absolutely loved the game overall. I loved the game for the character interactions, and the closing scene was fantastic. It left me with very high expectations for the third one.

What happened to your Uncharted 1 & 2 trophies? Did you create a new PSN account just to play Heavy Rain and Uncharted 3?

I bought my PS3 after the fallout from the Sony hack, so I didn't want to create a PSN account until I felt it was needed. I thought my trophies would just move over once I created the account, but I discovered that wasn't true unfortunately.

Wait, are you actually trying to convince me that Marcus is more mobile the Drake? Really?

Anyways, Uncharted is much more responsive, as soon as you press a button it works instantly. It just looks like it's masked by an animation. You could be doing anything and as soon as you press jump, he will respond. It just has an amazing animation blending.

The biggest gameplay element that annoys me with Uncharted 3 is that there are sections where they deliberately and explicitly set you up for stealth but most if not pretty much all of these sequences make stealthing the whole room feel like nothing short of impossible. 
 
Furthermore, when one of the guards inevitably spots you, you're not just left with the guards that you weren't able to stealth, oh no, instead they decide they're gonna have 20 more guys come flooding out of the fuckin walls. WTF?!
 
I'll never forget the section in the airfield where the game sets you up to stealth the whole courtyard of enemies and then there's two enemies that have their back to the wall facing your direction with no time based pattern of walking around, meaning you can't (easily) stealth them. I killed everyone besides these two guys. Tried to figure out how to stealth the two of them when their so close and their backs are to the wall, inevitably got seen and suddenly 10 other guys just come hoping over fences and flying out of my asshole and what not for pretty much no fuckin reason. For all of that i would have just shot my way through the courtyard from the start.

@Icemael said:

@LiquidPrince said:

Wait, are you actually trying to convince me that Marcus is more mobile the Drake? Really?

Aside from not being able to climb, Marcus is a faster, more mobile character than Drake. There can be no doubt about it unless you are a terrible Gears of War player incapable of making good use of the roll and the run.

@LiquidPrince said:

Anyways, Uncharted is much more responsive, as soon as you press a button it works instantly. It just looks like it's masked by an animation. You could be doing anything and as soon as you press jump, he will respond. It just has an amazing animation blending.

It has nothing to do with the animation. I've played some of both Gears of War and Uncharted 2 in the past week, and the movement in Uncharted is simply not as sharp. The difference was especially obvious when I played them so closely together.

Considering about 3/4 done Gears 3 on insanity, I don't think I'm a terrible Gears player. I still disagree with you.

I played it on Hard on my first playthrough and I was fine with the boat part everyone was complaining about....  Im not even good at playing games