As a huge fan of MGS4, I really liked this game

Having just finished it in two sittings / one day (running about 9 hours or so), I'm unashamed to say that I was pleasantly surprised by this game. There's terrible stealth sequences, the gunplay isn't fantastic and it's incredibly linear, but... well, Ilike cinematic games. Metal Gear Solid 1 and 4 are my tied favourites, and the latter has definitely copped flack over some of the things this game does wrong as well.

I honestly think this is the first game to truly supplant MGS4 as the posterchild for the "Cinematic Game"

This is pretty much the definition of a "Cinematic Game / Experience"
and that does pose some issues...

• If I were to go by feel, this game is roughly 55% cutscene or scripted sequence. Even things which you could very well have controlled like storming an enemy fortification (with no acrobatics or fanfair).
• To "compensate" for the sheer amount of non-interactive content, The Order has a swathe of seemingly random quicktime events which, in many instances, serve no real purpose. Heck, it gets so bad that in some cases I wouldn't realise I had control back and would stand there waiting for a prompt for me to climb something they apparently expected me to climb normally.
• Not only are there random quicktime events, they inevitably lead to an instant-death on failure rather than branching like some other recent titles. Thankfully they consistently have an autosave right before such events.
• The Order has massive and possibly even unintentional difficulty spikes (looking at you shotgun-dudes and heavies with shotguns). It isn't helped by the passive pattern you can fall into when playing this game, as you are indeed not the largest influence on what is happening most of the time.

But being "Cinematic", to me, somehow absolved it of these issues.

Even with all the problems, I really like what they did with the game overall. The reasons I can point to are some of the same reasons I like good movies. It has some great cinematography. The score is solid, as is the sound mix. The setting is fantastic, and the world feels very lived in. The pacing is breakneck, but with just enough in the way of breathers.

In terms of plot, though it lacks a true payoff, it's also pretty darn fun. It has an almost comic-book-movie-esque quality in its execution and pacing. In my second session, honestly couldn't stop playing because I was legitimately intrigued by how everything was unfolding.

Oh, and this is easily the best looking game (technically speaking) I've seen thus far. What really lets it down is the fluidity of some of the animations, which really stands out when contrasted with the fidelity of the actual visuals. I could go into some of the great art design too, but I’ll leave it there.

This game is essentially an 1800s, Folklore-inspired John Wick - and if that sounds cool to you, it may well be right up your alley.

Is the execution of a plot important to you in a game? Do you like fast-paced action/thrillers? Are you fine with some rough edges on the gameplay side of things when presented with an impressive looking movie/game hybrid?

Then you're like me, and like the concept of a "cinematic game". And I'm pretty sure that's okay - you just have to be comfortable with being in a very small minority.

The Order seems designed for just such people - I can definitely see why some reviewers rated it quite highly whilst the majority hated it (I'd give it 4 stars).

Hey, more power to you. If you enjoyed it then that's great, though funnily enough everything you've written there just makes me want to keep my distance all the more so... Practically nothing in this game sounds appealing to me.

And for the record I also think MGS4 is bad.

@yummylee:

:D - yup, crazies like me are very few in number, and I can definitely understand where you're coming from.

I just hope people who do share my illness aren't put off by the low review scores. This game definitely has its merits if you're looking for something very specific.

mgs4 also had 10 hours of gameplay and was engaging whether you decided to run and gun or sneak. but good for you, human eyes can't see more than 5 hours after all.

Good to see something positive about the Order. Picking up my copy this afternoon.

This thread is weird. OP derides everything about the game, but likes it anyway because it's "cinematic". I feel like that term has lost all meaning at this point.

As someone who considers MGS4 still possibly my favorite game, this post makes me more eager to play this game than I already was.

@sinusoidal: Yeh it has been watered down to nothing, you cant even tell if someone tries to bash a game or praise it when they call it cinematic.

I actually don't mind anything about the game's structure... it just doesn't seem like the story is that interesting and the gameplay is straight forward. It actually looks pretty similar instructure to Max Payne 3, a game I love, but I like it so much because the gameplay is so great and the story is strong. Max Payne 3 had the same transitions to gameplay thing going on and many hated how many cutscenes it had like that (personally I was fine with it for the most part).

I also love MGS4 but that was fun to play and nailed the story aspect. I think Max Payne is a better comparison.

The game has to nail the story if it's going to spend that much time and effort on it though. The gameplay in Max Payne 3 had a lot going on that it doesn't seem like the Order would come anywhere close to.

@selfconfessedcynic: I totally get where you're coming from. Sometimes games--even games with obvious flaws--will just get something, something so particular, so right that it can get you past all the shortcomings that skew the court of public opinion.

I'll probably end up liking The Order when I get around to it. Though, I'm thankful I didn't jump on it at full price.

@historyinrust: Isn't that the argument people who actually like Destiny use? Like, they all admit it is sorta trash, but they still love it anyway.

Personally, I am pretty interested to play The Order, but only after I clear my backlog a bit.

I already got it for it for my birthday .So i cant really go back on it hope i like it :)

I love games love linear games that focus on story, but I'm not sure if the story here would interest me. It sounds decent, but I'll probably wait until it drops in price a good bit before picking it up.

If this game had top notch action throughout and really memorable moments that benefitted from it being a tightly put together campaign, I'd be all for it.

Unfortunately all reviews seem to point the opposite. I will wait until this is dirt cheap or free.

Why do you have to be jerks?

@selfconfessedcynic: I am really liking The Order too. About a hour in I was worried at first cause it starts pretty slow but I feel it picks up a lot in the second half of game. The stealth sections I have played so far haven't bothered me at all but that is probably cause I didn't die on them at all. They were pretty simple and the QTE stuff I can take it or leave it. I can see where the low review scores are coming from but for some reason I can't put this game down. I can honestly say I will play the game a few more times all the way through before putting it up for a while.

@selfconfessedcynic: Oh yeah one thing I will say I really don't like about this game. It has to be the damn shotgun wielding guys in armor. Those guys can be a bitch.

So is the story good overall but just doesn't have an ending?

No one is allowed to enjoy a game I haven't played. NO ONE!

From what I've seen of 1886, I think MGS4 is a lot more rich in the gameplay departement; with the zillion guns, items, unlockables, and octocamo. So yeah, this game would supplant MGS4 in the cinematic experience department.

@wakkaflakkachimmichonga:

If you know what to do and skip the cutscenes, MGS4 has around 5 hours of gameplay.

Don't get me wrong though, I fucking love me some MGS.

@heltom92: Skipping cutscenes and darting directly to the end of each level would imply second+ playthough though so that 5 hours doesn't really much. MGS4 took me 18 on my first playthrough

@heltom92: You dont measure gameplay by how long it takes to speedrun it. Alot of the gameplay in MGS is explore different things and strategies and if you just run past that its fine but its still there in the game and adds up to more than 5hours.

I'm enjoying myself so far as well. Also a huge fan of MGS4. This game is an absolute visual marvel, one of the best looking games I have ever seen. Loving the gunplay too, the impact from the weapons feels so good.

@heltom92: it's 10 hours of gameplay. multiple people have timed it.

I liked the gameplay. Shooting felt nice and the story was decent. The ending felt a little bit abrupt. I guess that they wish to make a sequel.

Didnt actually check how long it took me to finish the game. Played it on hard difficulty which is the difficulty that I play all singleplayer fps games. Tends to make those games last longer.

I've only played an hour of it so far, but I like what I've seen.

Also MGS4 is awesome.

im really curious to see more regular player reaction to the game, as there continues to be a divide between reviewers and regular players.

The more I hear about it the less I want to give it a shot. Especially when comparing it to things I dislike about MGS4, which to me is the weakest MGS by a huge margin (still enjoyed it in spite of itself).

I'd be curious to see how the crossover between fans of the Order and fans of Heavy Rain stack up, I could see that going either way. Anyone want to throw their opinion at me?

Movies and films can't (or shouldn't ) be compared. Comparing the order to John Wick, for example, missing the essential point that you're not playing John Wick, you can enjoy scenes from John Wick and they can feel different because of the way they are shot or composed. But in a game, you also have consider gameplay alongside story and visuals. If your gameplay. is route, it won't matter how flashy your visuals are. Conversely, amazing gameplay is what keeps the classics alive, long after their looks have faded.

At some point, I will pick it up, it might not be great...but...well why not. Hell, its not broken; which is a HUGE accomplishment in the last few months with Triple-A games to not be broken. I think a lot of peoople who were never going to buy it anyway are piling on the game for not being more than okay. Yet, I'd rather support 'okay' working games, rather than 'good' broken games that never seem to get fixed.

I think their argument is that certain elements are underwhelming or are tacit detriments to the product as a whole but they find themselves enjoying the experience because of one or two key successes. Destiny fans defend what works really well in the game they champion. I don't think anyone who's really behind the game is going to call it trash through and through.

I have a biiiiig blog stewing in my mind, and I hope to get around to it sooner than later, but the gist is that, indeed, "cinematic" means nothing anymore. Still, there are games that have used filmic elements really well. For example, the shot composition in the early Resident Evil and Silent Hill series served to not only add to the sense of drama, claustrophobia, and fear, but to also direct players to important puzzle solutions. And the God of War series used intentional camera angles to give its world tons of flavor in the background while the gameplay remained interrupted.

The problem is when people start calling the cut scenes in a game "cinematic", because... of course they fucking are. They're movies. If a book came with a DVD inside it and asked you to play it instead of reading at a given time, you wouldn't really say, "Wow! This book is really cinematic!". You'd much more likely say, "What the fuck is a movie doing in my book?".

Uh huh.

I don't understand why every new game needs to advance the genre. People enjoyed Uncharted 3 and Last of Us which are both incredibly derivative... and Last of Us was game of the year...

Being the best looking game so far it doesnt only advance the genre but it advances this generation. The supersmooth transitions between cutscenes and gameplay all done in engine is also very impressive. Not to mention the game works out of the box as shuld be.

I do think that something that get's lost in the conversation about 1886 is how fantastic the cinematography is. Every shot in the prologue is goddamn fantastic.

The thing that really bums me out about conversations about The Order is that it reminds me that games are products first and art/media second. As much fun as I usually have with activity-packed open world games, I definitely miss games like this. I don't think the Order is a great product, but I think it is a damn fine piece of media.

@rethla: @contimaloris: Y'all are right but wasting your breath (fingers?). Some people aren't interested in a conversation about The Order. It's just garbage to them.

I thought GTAV had excellent cutscene transitions but The Order does seem smoother. A minor thing but it will be cool when this is more of a standard across the board (which just seems like a matter of time). I have heard some people say it is a little funny because you may not always know when a custscene is happening, so that's an interesting side effect.

The only good thing about The Order is the cutscene transitioning, which does not need black bars to be achieved.

Even the visuals leave a bad taste in my mouth. It makes me think of Doom 3, it looks pretty good in its dark and gloomy environments but how good does it really look? Probably not all that great if things were brighter, the fact they had to use black bars to get the level of visuals it has is pretty concerning in itself as it really does not look that great. It's working with tiny levels, using black bars to decrease what it needs to render and also only runs at 30 fps? Hmm....hopefully CD Projekt and Naughty Dog will show them how to achieve a technical showcase on a console - properly this time.

Edit - AH! The voice acting is also good. I'm not surprised at how the game turned out though, I'll still continue not giving money to developers putting black bars in games and giving bullshit reasoning for it.

But is it bullshit reasoning if that's what's required for it to look as good as it does (and the way the devs want it to look) at this point in the PS4's life cycle?

Even if it wherent a graphics powerhouse developers certanly are in their right to make games in whatever aspect ratio they want. Speaking of advancing the genre games with this perspective are very rare and especially when its well done. I think the wide shots looks amazing and they simply aint possible to do in 16:9, if you cant stand the black bars then buy an 2.35:1 tv or skip it all together its your loss.

@kasaioni: @wakkaflakkachimmichonga:

Don't get me wrong, there's a lot MGS4 does right that this game doesn't (or any other game recently for that matter), but for the purpose of this argument, I'm focussing on its method of storytelling and delivery. Specifically the ratio of gameplay to cutscenes, etc.

@artisanbreads:

I actually haven't played Max Payne 3 (I wasn't a big PC guy when the first two came out and never got around to any of them). Sounds like a solid comparison too.

I would say that aside from the ending itself (which leaves a lot hanging, my guess would be to have the option open for a sequel), the story is very well handled. The characters have good (though simple) arcs, the mystery is intriguing, the pacing is great, etc.

It isn't a The Last of Us or Mass Effect, but hey, what is?

Ah...

See I had written it off until you said that, still a 6 hour game is not worth what they're asking for so I'll maybe try it in 3 years.

Bought it today, planning on using the "7-day satisfaction guaranteed" GameStop thing to exchange it for PSN credit once I finish it.

I think it's only fair for a game that "screams" rental, I'm sure I'll enjoy the hell out of it regardless but it's really just a stand-in until BloodBorne next month.

@lethalki11ler: What gamespot thing is that? I don't think I have heard of such a policy.

@dudeglove: Do you overly cynical people get joy from talking down at people for liking things they like? Christ. Grow up. It's like I'm in youtube comments.

That's how movies usually work.

I enjoy jokes.

Glad you enjoy it, I might get it at some point when I eventually get a PS4. I think it's a game that I'll enjoy as long as I find the story/characters interesting, I do like the occasional cinematic game and QTEs don't really bother me. I also really don't understand why people hate the black bars so much, I've watched and played things with black bars and usually find that within a few minutes I forget they're there, they've certainly never bothered me.

I get why people wouldn't like it and I can't be sure I'll like it, but it does seem this game is getting a disproportionate amount of hate imo.