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#1 Edited by TopCat88 (174 posts) -

The BBC (UK) is reporting that Xbox One users have been suspended or have had LIVE functionality removed from their accounts for uploading game clips with the user swearing in them. The Fuck. How do you define 'excessive swearing'?

BBC News story

Surely there must be a way to curate these uploads into 'explicit' and 'non explicit' sections if that's the way they want to go. Even if they force the user to pick which it is before it will upload. Games swear, people swear, you shouldn't be punished for it.

It seems like more avoidable bad press for the XONE and its continually disappointing for someone like me who is/was planning to buy one around March next year. This isn't a reason not to buy it, but it's another reason to question my decision.

How does everyone feel about this? Or are we all past caring?

#2 Posted by big_jon (5709 posts) -

Are you seriously surprized about this? Go figure an Xbox live doesn't want swearing all over their videos... You can't swear in a profile or gamertag so why is this any different?

#3 Posted by big_jon (5709 posts) -

It's really funny how entitled people are getting, making issues out of small things like this because they somehow feel that it infringes on their rights. A service that is hosted by a massive technology company that is intended to be used in the average household by the whole family.

#4 Posted by geirr (2477 posts) -

Leave it to Microsoft to continuously thwart and be ashamed of their own consumers.

#5 Posted by TopCat88 (174 posts) -

@big_jon said:

It's really funny how entitled people are getting, making issues out of small things like this because they somehow feel that it infringes on their rights. A service that is hosted by a massive technology company that is intended to be used in the average household by the whole family.

If think swearing is a part of language and who are they trying to protect! You can swear on Youtube, Giant Bomb and many other places online. Games have swearing in them too! What's the problem. Also, as I said, they can tag uploads containing swearing and that's a much better way to go.

#6 Posted by Baillie (4039 posts) -

@big_jon said:

It's really funny how entitled people are getting, making issues out of small things like this because they somehow feel that it infringes on their rights. A service that is hosted by a massive technology company that is intended to be used in the average household by the whole family.

Ugh. What are you even talking about? They shouldn't be doing this.

#7 Posted by Hailinel (23927 posts) -

@topcat88 said:

@big_jon said:

It's really funny how entitled people are getting, making issues out of small things like this because they somehow feel that it infringes on their rights. A service that is hosted by a massive technology company that is intended to be used in the average household by the whole family.

If think swearing is a part of language and who are they trying to protect! You can swear on Youtube, Giant Bomb and many other places online. Games have swearing in them too! What's the problem. Also, as I said, they can tag uploads containing swearing and that's a much better way to go.

Or, you know, you can just clean up your language and not swear when on camera.

#8 Posted by Cincaid (2953 posts) -

@topcat88: I'm quite sure the user had his privilege to post videos on Upload Studios removed; not banned from Live. Still a shitty thing to do (in my opinion, at least have the option to mark videos with age gates, or something), but being banned from Live and being banned from Upload Studios is two different things completely.

And to play devil's advocate: You agree to terms of service when uploading videos to Upload Studios. Those terms include "do not swear" (in other wording, of course), and you agreed to those terms. When you break terms, no matter how stupid, you're likely to have your usage removed from the application.

#9 Edited by mlarrabee (2886 posts) -

@topcat88: "How do you define 'excessive swearing'?" Well, since it's Microsoft's service and one has to agree to the terms of use before using it, I'd say Microsoft gets to define that.

Considering XBL's current reputation as a haven for racist, sexist, religionist twits, I imagine Microsoft wants to make it a more family-friendly destination, and the launch of a new generation is the perfect time to do that. How well they'll blend banning profanity with chainsawing locusts in GoW 4 remains to be seen, and I say that with not insignificant irony.

#10 Edited by Doctorchimp (4069 posts) -

@hailinel said:

@topcat88 said:

@big_jon said:

It's really funny how entitled people are getting, making issues out of small things like this because they somehow feel that it infringes on their rights. A service that is hosted by a massive technology company that is intended to be used in the average household by the whole family.

If think swearing is a part of language and who are they trying to protect! You can swear on Youtube, Giant Bomb and many other places online. Games have swearing in them too! What's the problem. Also, as I said, they can tag uploads containing swearing and that's a much better way to go.

Or, you know, you can just clean up your language and not swear when on camera.

I left a job cause I had a boss freak out when I swore...

This seems like bullshit, and the BBC being in the UK must think that's pretty absurd.

#11 Edited by TopCat88 (174 posts) -

@hailinel: Better pass the memo to Jeff, Brad, Vinny, Drew, Alex and Patrick. They seems to have misunderstood the internet.

@cincaid: I agree with you that it is in their ToS not to swear, but should it be?

I think it's a slippery slope if you ban something from a service because a theoretical child might see/hear it and that would somehow be bad. I'm over 18 and comfortable swearing, all of my friends feel the same (on Live and in real life). Why should we be restricted because somebody else MIGHT see it and MIGHT be offended.

#12 Posted by Hailinel (23927 posts) -

@topcat88 said:

@hailinel: Better pass the memo to Jeff, Brad, Vinny, Drew, Alex and Patrick. They seems to have misunderstood the internet.

Giant Bomb isn't Xbox Live. When you use XBL, you agree to use it by Microsoft's rules.

#13 Posted by TopCat88 (174 posts) -

@hailinel: I agree that that is the case, but should it be the case. I think this is a flawed policy, lazily implemented and would stop me from using the Upload Studio service at all if there was a chance I would accidentally break the ToS.

#14 Posted by audioBusting (1477 posts) -

Harsh. Isn't there an age requirement to use the service in the first place? I guess they have the right to do it, but this just makes me not want to buy an Xbox even more.

#15 Posted by Cincaid (2953 posts) -

@topcat88: The one thing that they should do is let users mark their videos as adult content, or something along those lines. And frankly, I can understand both the user's viewpoint as well as Microsoft's viewpoint. As someone else said here earlier; Microsoft is clearly trying to make their XONE a 'family friendly'-machine, and if underage people have access to videos with swearing (or worse) it paints Microsoft in a bad way. However, I think you can already set up parental control on your machines, why not bring that over to Upload Studio somehow? And well, just because you're fine with swearing on camera, doesn't mean that everyone are fine with watching you do so. Users should have the ability to mark their videos with appropriate warnings (swearing, nudity in game play, and so on).

And again: the user wasn't banned from Live, he just had his privilege to post videos removed.

#17 Edited by TyCobb (1945 posts) -

Good.

#18 Posted by matti00 (668 posts) -

I don't think it's the worst thing in the world like some people do, but swearing is a pretty common thing for a lot of people. Even if you don't see this as a bad thing, they should have had something in place to deal with it other than stonewalling you for your everyday language.

Especially weird when you juxtapose that with the occasionally violent nature of video games. Between swearing and violence, I know which one upsets me more.

#19 Edited by HH (599 posts) -

this fits in with their notions of a kinect / tv family audience, don't alienate the moms!

Jack Tretton should hold a press conference and go... "Fuck that shit." *applause and cheering* "You can say whatever the motherfuck you want on psn" *whooping and applause*

#20 Posted by Oldirtybearon (4602 posts) -

Getting suspended/banned from using the upload video/commentary functionality is one thing. After all, if Microsoft want to be Super Cunts about it, they can. Still, that's not what's happening. People are losing all of their Xbox Live functionality because of this. That's fucking stupid. I'd be fucking infuriated if that happened to me. It's especially dumb when you consider how easy it would be to allow the uploader to slap and "Explicit" tag on their videos in order to filter them out from the poor wittle children. Cunts.

Point blank, Microsoft is not my mom. They don't get a say in how much "foul language" I do or don't use. The fact that they're trying to "clean up" Live is a good thing, the way that they're going about it is fucking retarded.

#21 Edited by MB (12020 posts) -

I just read the story, and it seems to be based on something someone read on a "gaming forum"...as in, anecdotal evidence at best. Seems like a non-story at this point. Microsoft commented on their general policy and that's all.

This reminds me of the story that started to circulate about the Foxconn intern who allegedly sabotaged PS4 consoles coming out of the factory. It was based on nothing more than some nobody with one post who wrote something about it on the IGN forums, then another nobody who had his own gaming news website wrote a "story" about it.

Moderator
#22 Edited by Brodehouse (9599 posts) -

Unfortunately, when you ask people to be creative and express themselves using your technology, sometimes they do that.

#23 Edited by OtakuGamer (1224 posts) -

@topcat88: You are fined one credit for a violation of the Verbal Morality Statute.

#24 Posted by HiroKedyn (32 posts) -

@otakugamer: Maybe you can help me out with this. How do you use the 3 seashells?

#25 Edited by Counterclockwork87 (607 posts) -

Swearing usually makes you sound like an idiot, so I could use some banned accounts for losers who curse every 3 seconds.

Your vocabulary is a wonderful thing. Please expand it.

#26 Edited by ProfessorEss (7281 posts) -

I imagine most of the gaming community will rage regardless of how this plays out. Ban them all and Microsoft's screwing the customer. Leave them all and Microsoft's not doing enough quality control.

Everything is a conspiracy wrapped in a catastrophe. It's all white noise to me at this point.

#27 Edited by Muttinus_Rump (814 posts) -

Oh thank heavens, now the children don't have to hear those naughty naughty words. Fuck.

#28 Posted by PimblyCharles (1318 posts) -

Well there goes XBox Live for the entire GB staff :)

#29 Posted by cloudymusic (1051 posts) -

So...if the user uploads a clip that contains a lot of in-game swearing (i.e. almost any M-rated game) that's OK, but it's only a problem if the players themselves are swearing? Seems like a weird distinction.

#30 Posted by benpicko (2000 posts) -

Swearing usually makes you sound like an idiot, so I could use some banned accounts for losers who curse every 3 seconds.

Your vocabulary is a wonderful thing. Please expand it.

Except most people do swear in real life and shouldn't be forced to let a company dictate what they can and cannot say lest they get banned from the infrastructure that they paid to be a part of. If I want to swear up a storm, I'm going to. What's next, purging users from Xbox Live for voicing opinions not inline with Microsoft's?

#31 Posted by Hailinel (23927 posts) -

@benpicko said:

@counterclockwork87 said:

Swearing usually makes you sound like an idiot, so I could use some banned accounts for losers who curse every 3 seconds.

Your vocabulary is a wonderful thing. Please expand it.

Except most people do swear in real life and shouldn't be forced to let a company dictate what they can and cannot say lest they get banned from the infrastructure that they paid to be a part of. If I want to swear up a storm, I'm going to. What's next, purging users from Xbox Live for voicing opinions not inline with Microsoft's?

It's not about voicing opinions not in line with Microsoft's. It's about using language that isn't coarse and littered with curses every three words. The way you speak when among friends isn't how you speak when at work or while addressing teachers or that girl you want to date. Xbox Live has a well-deserved reputation for the proliferation of foul-mouthed twelve-year-olds, and that's not something that deserves a badge of honor.

If you can't restrain yourself to at least use more polite language when using Upload Studios, maybe you shouldn't be using it at all.

#32 Posted by EarlessShrimp (1631 posts) -

Won't somebody please think of the children?!

#33 Edited by YukoAsho (2001 posts) -

I think it's a bit heavy-handed on MS' part. People cuss in the heat of the moment, and we tend to be in the heat of the moment a lot when playing games. Yeah, too much of it can make a person seem of lower intelligence, but damn if I want someone carefully measuring themselves while talking extolling the levels of amazing of something spectacular s/he did/saw in a game.

I know if I got banned from a service every-time I was like "HOLY SHIT!" I'd be on no services at all by the time it was all said and done. Considering the levels of violence and coarse language in modern gaming, banning someone from cussing in a headshot video seems astronomically hypocritical. If nothing else, when did Microsoft become Nintendo?

Won't somebody please think of the children?!

Forget the children, won't someone please think of Mr. Torgue?

#34 Posted by pweidman (2299 posts) -

If this is even a 'story', the associated angry internet is all moot anyway. TOS. Read it and know it will be enforced. That and have some self control when the camera is on.

#35 Posted by alwaysbebombing (1539 posts) -

Well, shit.

#36 Edited by Counterclockwork87 (607 posts) -

You all realize this is in their terms of service, it's their platform. You can't just go on CNN and start swearing up a storm, you will get kicked off and never again allowed on the network. You have the right to swear but not on someone else's service if they don't want you too. CNN aren't mandated by the FCC to do anything, they decide they won't allow cursing to uphold a certain brand and keep advertisers happy. Simply put, you look like an idiot having a bunch of videos of gamers cursing up a storm getting headshots. It lowers the quality of your product and Microsoft wants to hold itself to a certain standard. If you're too childish to provide some insightful commentary to your gaming then upload your videos on a different service. I realize the Giant Bomb crew curses, but they do it on their own video player and they don't talk anywhere near the way a lot of these guys who upload stuff do.

#37 Edited by spraynardtatum (2610 posts) -

fuck this bullshit

#38 Posted by HiroKedyn (32 posts) -

@yukoasho: Poor Mr. Torgue, he's like the father that I always wanted to have.

MS isn't being heavy handed, if they banned an account for just cursing once in a video, that would be heavy handed. It is in the ToS that many forums and services use that we have all agreed to. Heavy handed is town 10 minutes north of me, if you are in public and curse, just once, and a cop hears you, they write you a ticket. A lot of places have profanity laws on the books, they just usually don't enforce them. We have the right to limited free speech, inciting a riot, hate speech and profanity are not covered by that.

#39 Posted by Turtlebird95 (2311 posts) -

Nintendo once again being a parent to its user base. When are they gonna - OH SHIT! This is Xbox?! Well that's new.

I don't have an Xbox One but if what they say about everyone can see those videos is true, I can understand why some moderation would be required. If nothing else it could... uh... expand some people's vocabulary?

#40 Posted by Mike17032 (72 posts) -

@big_jon said:

Are you seriously surprized about this? Go figure an Xbox live doesn't want swearing all over their videos... You can't swear in a profile or gamertag so why is this any different?

Because I am sure many of these videos are of games that have profanity (and much worse) in the game itself?

#41 Posted by Mike17032 (72 posts) -

@yukoasho: Poor Mr. Torgue, he's like the father that I always wanted to have.

MS isn't being heavy handed, if they banned an account for just cursing once in a video, that would be heavy handed. It is in the ToS that many forums and services use that we have all agreed to. Heavy handed is town 10 minutes north of me, if you are in public and curse, just once, and a cop hears you, they write you a ticket. A lot of places have profanity laws on the books, they just usually don't enforce them. We have the right to limited free speech, inciting a riot, hate speech and profanity are not covered by that.

Hope you are not in the US, as those kinds of laws have been ruled unconstitutional as they violate the first amendment. That is why they don't get enforced, because anyone who appeals will win.

#42 Edited by HiroKedyn (32 posts) -

@mike17032: actually I do, and I know 2 people who were ticketed for it and they didn't win in court, up to a $250 fine. It's part of the public intoxication law here.

#43 Posted by HerbieBug (4212 posts) -

Cocksucking motherfuckers, man. :/

#44 Edited by spraynardtatum (2610 posts) -

This is unbelievable to me....How is this real?

#45 Posted by Nethlem (385 posts) -

People this isn't even half the story, because it looks like it does not only affect upload studio/content published by users, it seems to even affect the Skype app or content that users did not even publish:

http://www.polygon.com/2013/11/25/5143542/report-xbox-one-skype-upload-studio-users-banned-for-swearing

http://www.reddit.com/r/xboxone/comments/1rd0su/psa_for_upload_studio_do_not_use_any_profanity/cdm0v2c

And before anybody goes "Oh this is tinfoil-hat bullshit that nobody should take serious! They would never monitor my private communications!" better take a look at the Xbox Live ToS

“You should not expect any level of privacy concerning your use of the live communication features (for example, voice chat, video and communications in live-hosted gameplay sessions) offered through the Xbox Live/Games for Windows-Live service. We may monitor these communications to the extent permitted by law.”

“Microsoft may review game clips for violations of the Xbox Live Code of Conduct. This review may take place even when the game clip sharing is set to Block.”

The fun also doesn't stop there, it goes on with the Skype Privacy Policies:

“Skype may gather and use information about you, including (but not limited to) information in the following categories…Content of instant messaging communications, voicemails, and video messages (please see section 12);”

“Skype collects and uses, or has third party service providers acting on Skype’s behalf collecting and using, personal data relating to you, as permitted or necessary to…protect your and Skype’s interests, including in particular to enforce our Terms of Service and prevent and fight against fraud,”

Also all this isn't just some theoretical ToS bullshit put there by lawyers, so MS has their asses on the save side in some freak accident. It's been practiced for months and has been especially forced since MS took over Skype: http://arstechnica.com/security/2013/05/think-your-skype-messages-get-end-to-end-encryption-think-again/
Even Snowden leaked some stuff regarding all this: http://blogs.computerworld.com/privacy/22477/new-snowden-revelation-shows-skype-may-be-privacys-biggest-enemy

But you guys just keep buying that glamorized piece of DRM hardware, that comes complete with the "most advanced consumer grade camera/mic" that you place in the middle of your living room, don't mind that all this is sold and run by a corporation known for it's questionable ties to the intelligence community. I guess not too many Gamers have read 1984, otherwise people would recognize a fucking Telescreen for what it is!

#46 Edited by spraynardtatum (2610 posts) -

@nethlem said:

People this isn't even half the story, because it looks like it does not only affect upload studio/content published by users, it seems to even affect the Skype app or content that users did not even publish:

http://www.polygon.com/2013/11/25/5143542/report-xbox-one-skype-upload-studio-users-banned-for-swearing

http://www.reddit.com/r/xboxone/comments/1rd0su/psa_for_upload_studio_do_not_use_any_profanity/cdm0v2c

And before anybody goes "Oh this is tinfoil-hat bullshit that nobody should take serious! They would never monitor my private communications!" better take a look at the Xbox Live ToS

“You should not expect any level of privacy concerning your use of the live communication features (for example, voice chat, video and communications in live-hosted gameplay sessions) offered through the Xbox Live/Games for Windows-Live service. We may monitor these communications to the extent permitted by law.”

“Microsoft may review game clips for violations of the Xbox Live Code of Conduct. This review may take place even when the game clip sharing is set to Block.”

The fun also doesn't stop there, it goes on with the Skype Privacy Policies:

“Skype may gather and use information about you, including (but not limited to) information in the following categories…Content of instant messaging communications, voicemails, and video messages (please see section 12);”

“Skype collects and uses, or has third party service providers acting on Skype’s behalf collecting and using, personal data relating to you, as permitted or necessary to…protect your and Skype’s interests, including in particular to enforce our Terms of Service and prevent and fight against fraud,”

Also all this isn't just some theoretical ToS bullshit put there by lawyers, so MS has their asses on the save side in some freak accident. It's been practiced for months and has been especially forced since MS took over Skype:

http://arstechnica.com/security/2013/05/think-your-skype-messages-get-end-to-end-encryption-think-again/

Even Snowden leaked some stuff regarding all this:

http://blogs.computerworld.com/privacy/22477/new-snowden-revelation-shows-skype-may-be-privacys-biggest-enemy

But you guys just keep buying that glamorized piece of

DRM hardware

, that comes complete with the "most advanced consumer grade camera/mic" that you place in the middle of your living room, don't mind that all this is sold and run by a corporation known for it's questionable ties to the intelligence community. I guess not too many Gamers have read 1984, otherwise people would recognize a fucking

Telescreen

for what it is!

Congratulations Microsoft. You have just created the worst video game console in history.

#47 Edited by KaneRobot (1424 posts) -

If the game being uploaded is rated M, it's complete fucking garbage that someone would get banned for their language on a video. If it's rated E or T, I could see some restrictions in place.

At this point, Microsoft deserves all the bad press they get. They should know better by now. And this is coming from someone who generally prefers the Xbone to the PS4.

#48 Edited by Canteu (2821 posts) -

The Xbox One is a bad deal.

#49 Posted by TheManWithNoPlan (5249 posts) -

Sounds fucked up.

#50 Edited by crithon (3081 posts) -

I feel the Giantbomb crew are the best guys to test this, they swear like sailors