Buyer's Remorse - She Burns!

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Posted by Yummylee (21499 posts) -

I was relatively optimistic towards Amalur for a while after hearing about how it's meant to be an Elder Scrolls-ish RPG with ''God of War'' like combat. The trailers enticed me all the more, and even the demo left me feeling cautiously positive. But then... I dunno... after around 5 hours of playing (on Friday... mostly been playing Gears 3 instead) my stomach gradually began to sink as I couldn't help but notice how damn dated this thing is across its entirety.

I mean, I understand they weren't aiming to actually make a new Elder Scrolls, but the world is so terribly static (the taverns in particular are so depressingly inanimate and empty), the character models are so poorly detailed--often paired with equally terrifying and hilarious facial and mid-dialogue animations--you'll often encounter people who look just like your own character (thanks in no small part to the relative simplicity of the character creator and the shallow selection of races--basically two human races and 2 elves), and the ''world'' from what I can tell is basically made up of a lot of pretty corridors with towns in the middle. And some instanced off dungeons.

And your character.. now I don't hold any grudges against silent protagonists (even if they are becoming tougher to tolerate as the years go by), but it's the fact that they don't allow you to birth some sort of personality via the dialogue options you can choose your character to say that I vehemently dislike, which leaves the protagonist as the emptiest of slates with but an occasional blink just to prove that your character is in fact alive during conversations. At least Link actually animates, and games like Dragon Age: Origins had some brilliantly clever/humorous dialogue options for you choose from to build an identity. Your own race doesn't even factor into things either far as I can tell; having some bartender telling me not to worry about the upstairs healer because she's some... dark elf, or whatever stupid name they needlessly conjured up to make their world appear more unique, when I myself am also a dark elf just ripped me out of believing my character was actually somebody rather than just a player avatar.

Oh, and the combat isn't even all that good! It can be pretty satisfying to swing my massive flaming hammer around, but the combat is nowhere near as deep as I was hoping. You can't even bloody jump! Playing on hard mode, the game is also pretty frustrating... because of how easy it is! For a lot of battles, all I quite literally do is smash the square button over and over. Sure, there'll be sub boss battles that provide some opposition, but otherwise against all the random mobs, and even some of the humanoid boss battles who'll flinch after every attack, I can just rest and mash the square button and I'm sorted. Then there's nagging issues like why can I only do special stealth kills with daggers? Or why must my bow take up my second weapon spot when I'm naturally going to want to have a bow equipped anyway. If they really wanted to allow a little more combat puzzazz, they should of given you a third spot solely for a ranged weapon; that way you could have two melee weapon spots to mix up your attacks and not have to sacrifice a ranged weapon--or be forced to continually change your secondary weapon. Oh, and the way your shield just appears is silly, and it specifically irks me because I often like to see my character with his shield equipped too. For a game that's all about making your character look awesome, it's surprising that they passed over the tick box about allowing my character to strut around with a sword 'n' shield like a baws.

The cartoony style I do like, though, as I do the Destiny system - which is probably the only shining beacon of creativity the game showcases. And to be fair, I've only played a small amount thus far... but after looking over the ''moves'' list, there's really not that much else to look forward to as regards to expanding my attack patterns. If the game stays as easy as it has thus far as well then I won't even need to use any ''tactics'' besides ole faithful.

The world is just so bloody boring and it leaves me with little desire to learn more; and these days it also takes just a little more than some ''loot lust'' to push me further--especially when the game's this easy, when a green weapon is already all I need to do the job swiftly.. Frankly, the entire game feels like its sole purpose was to act as the precursor for the MMO; it'll set up the lore and the races and what have you, and then they begin with the real game. I mean seriously, how can a game with this many huge names tagged to the development evidently suffer from what looks have been a fairly low budget?

Maybe the game does hold some surprises down the line, though; maybe it'll eventually rise to be a game I'll at least finish. But as of now, it's left me with a soul crushingly bad first-impression and the mere thought of heading back in doesn't exactly have me tearing with excitement. It's overall shallow, derivative to a frightening degree and something I really wish I hadn't put £38 towards. On the bright side, Gears 3 is pretty fucking awesome. Really dislike the submarine and end boss segments, though. But otherwise, its 5 stars is well deserved.

-------------------------------------------------------------

TL;DR

God Dammit

#1 Edited by Yummylee (21499 posts) -

I was relatively optimistic towards Amalur for a while after hearing about how it's meant to be an Elder Scrolls-ish RPG with ''God of War'' like combat. The trailers enticed me all the more, and even the demo left me feeling cautiously positive. But then... I dunno... after around 5 hours of playing (on Friday... mostly been playing Gears 3 instead) my stomach gradually began to sink as I couldn't help but notice how damn dated this thing is across its entirety.

I mean, I understand they weren't aiming to actually make a new Elder Scrolls, but the world is so terribly static (the taverns in particular are so depressingly inanimate and empty), the character models are so poorly detailed--often paired with equally terrifying and hilarious facial and mid-dialogue animations--you'll often encounter people who look just like your own character (thanks in no small part to the relative simplicity of the character creator and the shallow selection of races--basically two human races and 2 elves), and the ''world'' from what I can tell is basically made up of a lot of pretty corridors with towns in the middle. And some instanced off dungeons.

And your character.. now I don't hold any grudges against silent protagonists (even if they are becoming tougher to tolerate as the years go by), but it's the fact that they don't allow you to birth some sort of personality via the dialogue options you can choose your character to say that I vehemently dislike, which leaves the protagonist as the emptiest of slates with but an occasional blink just to prove that your character is in fact alive during conversations. At least Link actually animates, and games like Dragon Age: Origins had some brilliantly clever/humorous dialogue options for you choose from to build an identity. Your own race doesn't even factor into things either far as I can tell; having some bartender telling me not to worry about the upstairs healer because she's some... dark elf, or whatever stupid name they needlessly conjured up to make their world appear more unique, when I myself am also a dark elf just ripped me out of believing my character was actually somebody rather than just a player avatar.

Oh, and the combat isn't even all that good! It can be pretty satisfying to swing my massive flaming hammer around, but the combat is nowhere near as deep as I was hoping. You can't even bloody jump! Playing on hard mode, the game is also pretty frustrating... because of how easy it is! For a lot of battles, all I quite literally do is smash the square button over and over. Sure, there'll be sub boss battles that provide some opposition, but otherwise against all the random mobs, and even some of the humanoid boss battles who'll flinch after every attack, I can just rest and mash the square button and I'm sorted. Then there's nagging issues like why can I only do special stealth kills with daggers? Or why must my bow take up my second weapon spot when I'm naturally going to want to have a bow equipped anyway. If they really wanted to allow a little more combat puzzazz, they should of given you a third spot solely for a ranged weapon; that way you could have two melee weapon spots to mix up your attacks and not have to sacrifice a ranged weapon--or be forced to continually change your secondary weapon. Oh, and the way your shield just appears is silly, and it specifically irks me because I often like to see my character with his shield equipped too. For a game that's all about making your character look awesome, it's surprising that they passed over the tick box about allowing my character to strut around with a sword 'n' shield like a baws.

The cartoony style I do like, though, as I do the Destiny system - which is probably the only shining beacon of creativity the game showcases. And to be fair, I've only played a small amount thus far... but after looking over the ''moves'' list, there's really not that much else to look forward to as regards to expanding my attack patterns. If the game stays as easy as it has thus far as well then I won't even need to use any ''tactics'' besides ole faithful.

The world is just so bloody boring and it leaves me with little desire to learn more; and these days it also takes just a little more than some ''loot lust'' to push me further--especially when the game's this easy, when a green weapon is already all I need to do the job swiftly.. Frankly, the entire game feels like its sole purpose was to act as the precursor for the MMO; it'll set up the lore and the races and what have you, and then they begin with the real game. I mean seriously, how can a game with this many huge names tagged to the development evidently suffer from what looks have been a fairly low budget?

Maybe the game does hold some surprises down the line, though; maybe it'll eventually rise to be a game I'll at least finish. But as of now, it's left me with a soul crushingly bad first-impression and the mere thought of heading back in doesn't exactly have me tearing with excitement. It's overall shallow, derivative to a frightening degree and something I really wish I hadn't put £38 towards. On the bright side, Gears 3 is pretty fucking awesome. Really dislike the submarine and end boss segments, though. But otherwise, its 5 stars is well deserved.

-------------------------------------------------------------

TL;DR

God Dammit

#2 Posted by h0lgr (908 posts) -

I agree with pretty much all of the things you say here. It feels empty and shallow and weak.

#3 Edited by Venatio (4491 posts) -

Agreed, I don't really get how this got 4 stars from Jeff, but gotta respect a man's opinion I guess

I played a couple of hours of it and I got really bored, I wanted something to tide me over until Mass Effect 3 comes out but this just wasn't even good enough for that, I actually just replayed Mass Effect 2 instead because that game is so much better with the dialog, conversations, story and animations

I realise this game didn't have the budget or tech of a Mass Effect 2 but damn I can't go back to how this game handles that sort of stuff

#4 Posted by Marz (5648 posts) -

After the 15 hour mark i just decided to just do the main story and skip all the side quests and i'm enjoying the game more myself. The main story is getting alot more interesting but i think it's all the side stuff that brings down this game's entertainment level ( at least for me).

#5 Edited by AndrewB (7577 posts) -

My only experience being with the demo, the only part I found redeeming was the combat. It reminded me a lot of Fable, and I loved Fable (at least Fable 2). Bu then, seeing the quick look, if the way you can stun enemies infinitely and break the combat completely works for all the tough enemies, that wouldn't be enough to stay appealing. And the nits you pick about the secondary weapon slot make sense for someone playing this beyond a 30 minute investment.

Then I heard that the open world was that MMO-style of oversized corridors sectioned off into different areas. That was actually the first tick against the game that I had. That's more ambitious than asomething like a Fable, but I was expecting something more along the lines of Morrowind or Skyrim.

Then I noticed the silent protagonist... even in a game I love, like DA:Origins, it feels weird going back to lengthy text responses without a voice to them. I don't want to feel like I'm holding that against this game alone, but for some reason it really stood out to me.

I can't say I'm sad to have a reason to avoid KOA:R ("core"?) though. I sunk so much time into Skyrim that I burned out on it and probably won't pick it up again for at least a year. If I wanted to play any other open-world game, it would be Saints Row the Third at this point, and I'm already kicking myself for *not* picking it up when it was cheap.

@Abyssfull said:

I mean seriously, how can a game with this many huge names tagged to the development evidently suffer from what looks of been a fairly low budget?

I feel that way about every game that Obsidian has ever made. Except I guess I wouldn't argue that this game has more high-profile, outside of the gaming industry talent names behind it.

#6 Posted by Fallen189 (4987 posts) -

Take it back then

#7 Posted by StrikeALight (1114 posts) -

@h0lgr said:

I agree with pretty much all of the things you say here. It feels empty and shallow and weak.

That was my fear, and was forced to cancel my pre-order after watching the quick look.

I don't think I've seen a new fantasy IP look so bland and derivative (outside of MMORPGs)

#8 Edited by Seppli (10251 posts) -

@Abyssfull:

For me, pretty much the opposite holds true. I forced myself to listen to every line of VO and immerse myself in the lore. Roleplaying conversations by chosing talking points appropriate to whatever dialog came before. I guess much of my character's personality is just me playing myself - I'm just that bland non-emotional objective-driven hero-type. I'm falling for Amalur hard. Pretty much every sidequest and character is a lot deeper than you'd think at first glance. With their own personalities and background stories, which become apparent by talking to them some more. The books are quite excellent too, reading them is my pleasure. It's your own fault, if you don't invest into it with time and some effort really. It's nowhere near as flat as you make it sound.

The bow comes into its own later down the line with its AoE ability and shotgun-like scattershot. That said - I too would love 3 dedicated buttons, one reserved for a ranged option, but it is what it is. Combat is snazzy and snappy and if you care about your combat performance and dispose of the opposition in style, rather than just mindlessly spamming you basic attack, there's a lot of stylish 3rd person action combat to be had. Even if it ain't that challenging, it certainly is enjoyable - and no where near as broken as most other games with deep RPG progression mechanics become. A mindless one-hit-kill game like Skyrim this becomes not. If you actually use your special moves and abilities and weave in your parries and blocks and all that jazz, you can have a tonne of fun with it. Again, it's only shallow if you play cheap. The game doesn't punish you for playing cheap - true enough. If you take some pride in your combat though - let's say roleplay a kick-ass rogue who toys with his foes - you can and will have a tonne of fun. Just keep yourself from exploiting the Fateshift mechanic too much. It truely makes the game way too easy and cheap.

As for the worldbuiling. Yes - it is dense and 'gamey' rather than open and authentic, though it feels to me more like a 16-bit era open world - as found in games like Secret of Mana and its ilk - and not at all like an MMO. I fucking love it to death for that. To everyone his own I guess.

I totally agree that it's far from perfectly executed, but that doesn't stop me from saying, Kingdoms of Amalur : Reckoning is my favorite action RPG of the last 5 years. I can't imagine a formula of core gameplay mechanics more suited to please me. Purely as a game I'm playing, and not judging for its many flaws, it's a perfect 10 for me. I love it.

TL;DR

I strongly disagree with your opinion

#9 Posted by Ares42 (2621 posts) -

The new attacks actually do help somewhat, although it's  dependant on what weapon you're using. However, they are doled out WAY too slow, and there's just not enough of them. Instead of each tier being "new attack, then your new attack does more damage" they should've at least had developing special attacks (first skill gives special attack, second gives a followup on the special, and third gives a finisher).

#10 Posted by yoshisaur (2701 posts) -

@Seppli said:

@Abyssfull:

For me, pretty much the opposite holds true. I forced myself to listen to every line of VO and immerse myself in the lore. Roleplaying conversations by chosing talking points appropriate to whatever dialog came before. I guess much of my character's personality is just me playing myself - I'm just that bland non-emotional objective-driven hero-type. I'm falling for Amalur hard. Pretty much every sidequest and character is a lot deeper than you'd think at first glance. With their own personalities and background stories, which become apparent by talking to them some more. The books are quite excellent too, reading them is my pleasure. It's your own fault, if you don't invest into it with time and some effort really. It's nowhere near as flat as you make it sound.

The bow comes into its own later down the line with its AoE ability and shotgun-like scattershot. That said - I too would love 3 dedicated buttons, one reserved for a ranged option, but it is what it is. Combat is snazzy and snappy and if you care about your combat performance and dispose of the opposition in style, rather than just mindlessly spamming you basic attack, there's a lot of stylish 3rd person action combat to be had. Even if it ain't that challenging, it certainly is enjoyable - and no where near as broken as most other games with deep RPG progression mechanics become. A mindless one-hit-kill game like Skyrim this becomes not. If you actually use your special moves and abilities and weave in your parries and blocks and all that jazz, you can have a tonne of fun with it. Again, it's only shallow if you play cheap. The game doesn't punish you for playing cheap - true enough. If you take some pride in your combat though - let's say roleplay a kick-ass rogue who toys with his foes - you can and will have a tonne of fun. Just keep yourself from exploiting the Fateshift mechanic too much. It truely makes the game way too easy and cheap.

As for the worldbuiling. Yes - it is dense and 'gamey' rather than open and authentic, though it feels to me more like 16-bit era open world as found in games like Secret of Mana and its ilk and not at all like an MMO. I fucking love it to death for that. To everyone his own I guess.

I totally agree that it's far from perfectly executed, but that doesn't stop me from saying, Kingdoms of Amalur : Reckoning is my favorite action RPG of the last 5 years. I can't imagine a formula of core gameplay mechanics more suited to please me. Purely as a game I'm playing, and not judging for its many flaws, it's a perfect 10 for me. I love it.

TL;DR

I strongly disagree with your opinion

Sometimes I really think people expect too much out of games and that is the reason people get all frustrated when it finally releases. I pretty much agree with everything you listed, and I guess I could be a little biased in saying I am an R.A. Salvatore fan boy.

#11 Posted by MikeGosot (3227 posts) -

Repeat after me: "I should've bought The Darkness II instead." And that's all i have to say, because i've bought The Darkness II instead of KoA:R.

#12 Posted by h0lgr (908 posts) -
@MikeGosot said:
Repeat after me: "I should've bought The Darkness II instead." And that's all i have to say, because i've bought The Darkness II instead of KoA:R.
So did I! And what a masterful decision it was, agreed my good sir?
Myeees, quite!
#13 Posted by MikeGosot (3227 posts) -
@h0lgr said:
@MikeGosot said:
Repeat after me: "I should've bought The Darkness II instead." And that's all i have to say, because i've bought The Darkness II instead of KoA:R.
So did I! And what a masterful decision it was, agreed my good sir? Myeees, quite!
Of course i agree, my great sir. There's a special charm in murdering people with car doors. A special charm that is lacking in KoA:R.
#14 Posted by AlmostApollo (71 posts) -

@MikeGosot said:

Repeat after me: "I should've bought The Darkness II instead." And that's all i have to say, because i've bought The Darkness II instead of KoA:R.

I got both. Loved The Darkness II (SO GOOD), but I'm having a really good time in Amalur. It seems to me like all your problems with Amalur are direct design decisions that were done completely intentionally, not mistakes that just happened. I guess the game just isn't for you. It happens.

#15 Posted by Yummylee (21499 posts) -

@Seppli: I listen to everybody as well; i've read a few notes that I've encountered, I've done a fair few side-quests (I haven't actually touched the main story after meeting Ardath, which I should remedy given how the story is meant to be pretty decent according to Jeff) and I've listened to everything everyone that I've talked to has to say. But again, the conversations are dull as my character just stands there as I'm wilted down by exposition dump after exposition dump. The voice acting is solid (though there's a somewhat annoying over-abundance of Greg Ellis), but the stories are poorly presented even if they do house some intrigue. The Fae at least sound somewhat interesting, but they haven't sparked enough for me to want to purposely learn more about them.

Also I don't even get much of a chance to play snappy and have fun with ''combos'' because the majority of the enemies die so quickly--like after a straight 3 square combo from my hammer. And sure, the combat isn't broken, but it feels incredibly pointless and shallow when all I need to do is just press square to victory with barely a scratch. The enemies who essentially just let me hit them over and over are hardly fun to fight, no matter if I decide to purposely mix up some tactics just for the Hell of it. It's simply poor enemy AI, which is a major downfall for when they attempt to broaden the combat palette as they have done. Also I never use the Fateshift either because I never need to. None of that is my own fault for simply not using the tools at my disposal, it's the games fault for not giving me any opportunities (as of yet) required to use them.

But hey, it's s'all good that you're at least enjoying it. And I'll admit I'm not quite done with it yet... I plan to invest a few more hours to solidify my decision and hope that there'll be something that grabs me down the line. Hopefully @Ares42's assertion will ring true as the game goes on.

@ccampb89: It is unfair to expect a 2012 game not to have an open-world design from 2006, and combat (which was the sole aspect they were promoting to allow KoA to stand out) that has less depth than the original 2001 DMC?

The comparisons to Fable people have made are also apt in some regards, but Fable also had a lot more variety to it with a great deal more character and wit. Fable games genuinely look and feel like they share relatively unique world to lose yourself in. Not to mention that Fable 3 (which I didn't particularly enjoy that much, but speaking solely for the world) looks better, and the world is so much more characteristic with people who you could almost believe actually live lives in Albion. In KoA, everyone here look more they're just decoration, with the primary purpose to hand out quests. I mean I say again, the Inn's in particular are almost depressing for how little life they portray as people just sit or stand there with all the empty space in-between.

#16 Posted by Grissefar (2842 posts) -

So why did you buy it? It's not like there's a shortage of demos, Quick Looks or live streams so it should hardly come as a surprise that the game is boring.

#17 Edited by Yummylee (21499 posts) -

@MikeGosot said:

Repeat after me: "I should've bought The Darkness II instead." And that's all i have to say, because i've bought The Darkness II instead of KoA:R.

Or rather ''I should have put my money towards Silent Hill: Downpour... if it weren't for those meddling kids!''

@AlmostApollo said:

@MikeGosot said:

Repeat after me: "I should've bought The Darkness II instead." And that's all i have to say, because i've bought The Darkness II instead of KoA:R.

I got both. Loved The Darkness II (SO GOOD), but I'm having a really good time in Amalur. It seems to me like all your problems with Amalur are direct design decisions that were done completely intentionally, not mistakes that just happened. I guess the game just isn't for you. It happens.

Actually this is a game that should of been exactly for me. I'm a big fan of action rpg's and it's the Elder Scrolls combat that's always stood out as the biggest criticism (btw, I also haven't played Skyrim yet, so this has nothing to do with me being burned out). To have a game vaguely resemble an Elder Scrolls with, in their words, ''God of War combat'' sounds incredible. But again, everything about this game is dated beyond belief, to the graphics, the NPC interactions/AI, the character creation and while the combat may be somewhat innovative for this genre, it's nowhere near enough to pull itself back up from everything else that's lacking. I wouldn't even mind the combat if everything else actually met the standards of a 2012 game. The amount of effort put forward for the game's promotion would make you think this was going to be like Elder Fable or something.

Power to the people who feel they've spent their monies worth and all that, but for me... I feel like I'd of been better off if I stuck with Darksiders II for my action/rpg loot-hoardin'.

@Grissefar said:

So why did you buy it? It's not like there's a shortage of demos, Quick Looks or live streams so it should hardly come as a surprise that the game is boring.

I was definitely starting to become skeptical during the quick-look... but by that time it was already too late - game had shipped. As for the demo, I dunno why, but I just felt like it held some solid foundation for it to grow into something great down the lines. I only played it once, though; it's because of how easy the game has stuck across the hours and how quickly the combat devolved into lazy button mashing.

#18 Posted by Klei (1768 posts) -

@Fallen189 said:

Take it back then

This man not only reeks wisdom, he speaks with it.

#19 Posted by themangalist (1731 posts) -

@Seppli said:

@Abyssfull:

For me, pretty much the opposite holds true. I forced myself to listen to every line of VO and immerse myself in the lore. Roleplaying conversations by chosing talking points appropriate to whatever dialog came before. I guess much of my character's personality is just me playing myself - I'm just that bland non-emotional objective-driven hero-type. I'm falling for Amalur hard. Pretty much every sidequest and character is a lot deeper than you'd think at first glance. With their own personalities and background stories, which become apparent by talking to them some more. The books are quite excellent too, reading them is my pleasure. It's your own fault, if you don't invest into it with time and some effort really. It's nowhere near as flat as you make it sound.

The bow comes into its own later down the line with its AoE ability and shotgun-like scattershot. That said - I too would love 3 dedicated buttons, one reserved for a ranged option, but it is what it is. Combat is snazzy and snappy and if you care about your combat performance and dispose of the opposition in style, rather than just mindlessly spamming you basic attack, there's a lot of stylish 3rd person action combat to be had. Even if it ain't that challenging, it certainly is enjoyable - and no where near as broken as most other games with deep RPG progression mechanics become. A mindless one-hit-kill game like Skyrim this becomes not. If you actually use your special moves and abilities and weave in your parries and blocks and all that jazz, you can have a tonne of fun with it. Again, it's only shallow if you play cheap. The game doesn't punish you for playing cheap - true enough. If you take some pride in your combat though - let's say roleplay a kick-ass rogue who toys with his foes - you can and will have a tonne of fun. Just keep yourself from exploiting the Fateshift mechanic too much. It truely makes the game way too easy and cheap.

As for the worldbuiling. Yes - it is dense and 'gamey' rather than open and authentic, though it feels to me more like a 16-bit era open world - as found in games like Secret of Mana and its ilk - and not at all like an MMO. I fucking love it to death for that. To everyone his own I guess.

I totally agree that it's far from perfectly executed, but that doesn't stop me from saying, Kingdoms of Amalur : Reckoning is my favorite action RPG of the last 5 years. I can't imagine a formula of core gameplay mechanics more suited to please me. Purely as a game I'm playing, and not judging for its many flaws, it's a perfect 10 for me. I love it.

TL;DR

I strongly disagree with your opinion

And you tried to convince me about this game... The combat looks alright, but otherwise I am not impressed by this game at all. I agree with all the points the OP raised, and it just seems we have extremely different tastes in gaming. Also, if you're not judging the flaws of a game at all, of course it'd be a 10.

#20 Posted by Yummylee (21499 posts) -

@Klei said:

@Fallen189 said:

Take it back then

This man not only reeks wisdom, he speaks with it.

Obviously that had crossed my mind... but I rarely ever return games. I'm not exactly a collector who strives to own all the shit, but I still enjoy watching my shelves fill. I still have a US copy--which I can't even play--alongside my PAL copy of Deadly Premonition.

#21 Posted by Napalm (9020 posts) -

@Abyssfull: For me, where it broke was the awful menu system, and the fact that the every piece of interaction you have with a character is a fucking info dump. It's never just like, a couple sentences. They just keep talking and talking and talking, let you select a response, and then keep talking and talking and talking. Talk about not understanding how to put the most pertinent information out there. It's just a verbal torrent of shit you don't care about. And for me, the menu system is completely terrible. The menu scrolling is abominably slow, and there's no auto-scrolling for if you want to go in a specific direction. An example is the character creation. I have to hit left every time I want to go left. I can't just hold it down and quickly go through the other options I don't care about. I've also noticed this in the gear menu as well. There's a slight delay when scrolling. Now granted, it's not that fast, but when coming off of Skyrim and getting used to how fast I can go through windows, it is physically, literally, painful to just scroll.

How were these options not even considered? How did somebody say, "yeah, it's totally supposed to work like that. Great!" The menu system is clunky, and in a game where that menu is key, the game already broke for me. Also, the game has shitty unarmed combat, so I'm pretty much already out.

#22 Edited by Seppli (10251 posts) -

@Abyssfull:

Prevention is key to my enjoyment of combat.

I went with Finesse, because it seemed like the least powerful specialization in the demo, with the highest TTK (time to kill) combat. I refrain from crafting gear to keep lootdrops and treasure chests interesting and my weaponry from being overpowered. I'm lvl 18 and I'm just about finishing up the dreamy forrest zone right now and my weapons are all lvl 6-7. I do a lot of rolling around and parrying and juggling and setting up general bad assery with my skills. Finesse skills are not about raw damage output, but rather about setting up the enemy with traps and bombs or lunging to their backside. I'm like 3x higher in lvl than I am supposed to be and combat is far from being 'faceroll' everything (at least in the dungeons, since they got lvl-scaling), even if I'm in no real risk of failure. Every now and then there's a room set-up for some ninja stealth action, which is done pretty darn well too.

Because I knew that difficulty is rather low and learned from reviews and forum post what's OP, I skewed my combat experience to be the most enjoyable. To me that's going pure Finesse and disregard crafting equipment, to keep gear and content on a level. It worked out thus far. I'm having a blast. I'll do my experimenting and crafting once I reach level cap and the final questing zone.

#23 Posted by pweidman (2325 posts) -

Reckoning is not ground breaking or even great, but it's damn fun anyway. I guess my expectations weren't so high. It strikes me as the perfectly timed comfort gaming action rpg with endless loot to find, and endless hybrid characters to design. It'll scratch that itch for months I bet, at least until Torchlight 2 or Diablo 3 release. Plenty of value here in that case alone. Plus it feels like a perfect change up from Skyrim, which I completely dropped after one character and about 100 hrs.

#24 Posted by Seppli (10251 posts) -

@pweidman said:

Reckoning is not ground breaking or even great, but it's damn fun anyway. I guess my expectations weren't so high. It strikes me as the perfectly timed comfort gaming action rpg with endless loot to find, and endless hybrid characters to design. It'll scratch that itch for months I bet, at least until Torchlight 2 or Diablo 3 release. Plenty of value here in that case alone. Plus it feels like a perfect change up from Skyrim, which I completely dropped after one character and about 100 hrs.

I'd go as far as labeling KoA:R - The Anit-Skyrim. For me at least, it's a great thing for a game to be.

#25 Posted by buft (3315 posts) -

I didn't buy it, i played the demo and it was fun but after reading reviews and watching the quick look i decided to hold back until it was cheaper.

I'm still looking forward to playing it but at $60 i figure i'd be better served continuing on my Witcher playthrough until Mass Effect 3 comes out.

#26 Posted by Klei (1768 posts) -
@Abyssfull said:


                   

@Klei said:

@Fallen189 said:

Take it back then

This man not only reeks wisdom, he speaks with it.

Obviously that had crossed my mind... but I rarely ever return games. I'm not exactly a collector who strives to own all the shit, but I still enjoy watching my shelves fill. I still have a US copy--which I can't even play--alongside my PAL copy of Deadly Premonition.



                   

               

I am exactly like you. Although I used to trade games a lot six or seven years ago, I calmed down. Now I have a good collection, but whenever I KNOW I won't be playing a game much, like the recent FF XIII-2, I trade it in.
#27 Posted by Seppli (10251 posts) -

@Seppli said:

@pweidman said:

Reckoning is not ground breaking or even great, but it's damn fun anyway. I guess my expectations weren't so high. It strikes me as the perfectly timed comfort gaming action rpg with endless loot to find, and endless hybrid characters to design. It'll scratch that itch for months I bet, at least until Torchlight 2 or Diablo 3 release. Plenty of value here in that case alone. Plus it feels like a perfect change up from Skyrim, which I completely dropped after one character and about 100 hrs.

I'd go as far as labeling KoA:R - The Anit-Skyrim. For me at least, it's a great thing for a game to be.

KoA:R is the game to Skyrim's simulation.

#28 Posted by AlmostApollo (71 posts) -

@Abyssfull: I'm not saying that the concept isn't for you, I'm saying that the design of it isn't for you. All of the criticisms you have are factual, but they're rooted in design decisions. They're entirely intentional, so while the general idea of the game may be for you, the actual design isn't.

#29 Posted by Alexandruxx (228 posts) -

I get the feeling. Same thing happened to me.

#30 Posted by LethalKi11ler (1406 posts) -

@Abyssfull: I was lucky enough to kinda get that feeling from the demo, thus preventing me from getting the full game. I feel you pain though

#31 Posted by hughesman (312 posts) -

Is there a higher difficulty then "hard"? I was holding off on this game but if it really is too easy on hard i might just forget it all together.

#32 Posted by Tennmuerti (8073 posts) -

@hughesman said:

Is there a higher difficulty then "hard"? I was holding off on this game but if it really is too easy on hard i might just forget it all together.

No.

#33 Posted by SonicFire (821 posts) -

Yeah, nothing I've seen about the game looks terribly compelling. I usually devour RPGs like that one, but really, I see nothing that's going to want me to invest in that world. I don't see wanting to play anything till ME3 comes out.

Well, that and the Silent Hill HD collection, but that's neither here nor there.

#34 Posted by Encephalon (1242 posts) -

I see where you're coming from. However, when I was presented with the opportunity to get it for around $40, I kinda shrugged and said "okay, this will waste my time until ME3." I'm finding myself in a FFXIII situation where the reduced price is mitigating its shortcomings.

#35 Posted by MikkaQ (10283 posts) -

The game feels kinda shallow, but the core mechanics of questing and fighting are fun enough to keep me going despite the boring story. It's a good game to play music, podcasts, or movies over.

#36 Posted by Nux (2330 posts) -

@Marz said:

After the 15 hour mark i just decided to just do the main story and skip all the side quests and i'm enjoying the game more myself. The main story is getting alot more interesting but i think it's all the side stuff that brings down this game's entertainment level ( at least for me).

I'm starting to feel the same way around the 15 hour mark aswell. I do however find myself doing the faction quests a lot more though. They're pretty good.

#37 Posted by AlexW00d (6235 posts) -

I had no expectations whatsoever going in to the demo and I still found it bland and boring, so yay me, I guess.

#38 Posted by dragonzord (811 posts) -

Works fine for me. Gets the terrible taste that Skyrim left in my mouth, out. Also, it has yet to lock up after 20+ hours.

#39 Posted by SuperWristBands (2266 posts) -

My play-style is killing me in this game. I try to do the least important quests before the slightly more important ones, then I do the story. So far in the side quests its been a bunch of shit except for the Widow one (or whatever it was called). Nice that it ended in a boss. I'm probably going to just do the faction quests now but I really don't want to miss out on something like the quest I mentioned.
 
As for Hard Mode. It seems hard-ish. I haven't died but I have used quite a few potions... so it's kinda like normal mode from an older game, maybe?

#40 Posted by Zelyre (1174 posts) -

I wish I could play it long enough to formulate an opinion.

KoA's FOV is so low I get a headache after playing for 15 minutes. The constantly moving camera doesn't help one bit.

Forcing the FOV to 75 lets me play for a while, but every cutscene becomes graphically broken. I see through the world, I can't see my character in menus.

I want to play the game, it seems fun enough, and after hearing Curt Shilling, I want to support his company; he claims they want to make a game for gamers and are listening to the community. I knew the game had a broken FOV, was as challenging as 2+2, and had a story as exciting as Star Wars ep1's, and yet I bought it on a hope that they'll fix it sooner rather than later.

I guess I like buying promises. That's what disposable income does to you. :(

#41 Posted by Giantstalker (1628 posts) -

I was considering buying this game, but then ALL THREE VERSIONS of the demo hardlocked on me at some point - on the PC, PS3, and Xbox.

Not my kind of game.

#42 Posted by ArbitraryWater (11622 posts) -

Well, this basically confirmed my decision to not buy the game new in any capacity. If I'm ever curious, I know it'll be $10 on Steam in like 2 years during a sale.

#43 Posted by WilltheMagicAsian (1544 posts) -

@ArbitraryWater: Two years? I'd say by Black Friday.

#44 Posted by Demoskinos (14763 posts) -

@Grissefar: In the end I don't think ANY of that matters. Plenty of times where shitty demos misrepresented a game and plenty of times where you don't get the same experience PLAYING a game as you do watching it. Now, that doesn't hold true for all games mind you but I tend to ignore all of it anyways and just do a gut check when it comes time to buy.

#45 Posted by Hizang (8532 posts) -

That sucks, I was going to get that next week, oh well.

#46 Edited by Ares42 (2621 posts) -
@Abyssfull said:

But hey, it's s'all good that you're at least enjoying it. And I'll admit I'm not quite done with it yet... I plan to invest a few more hours to solidify my decision and hope that there'll be something that grabs me down the line. Hopefully @Ares42's assertion will ring true as the game goes on.
I wouldn't hold my breath if I were you, while getting the new moves are nice (getting the dodge move was a god-send for me), it's still more of a "less annoying" rather than "more fun" thing. The move-set is just too small and even if you have 2-3 moves that are situationally better most of the time you will end up just doing the standard attack-combo since none of the specials actually do more damage. At least that's the experience I have using Greatswords, might be different with faeblades or daggers, but from what I've seen most special-moves are just 1-2 hits, meaning the quad-hit you get out the default combo comes out better.
 

@Seppli

said:

@Abyssfull:

Prevention is key to my enjoyment of combat.

I went with Finesse, because it seemed like the least powerful specialization in the demo, with the highest TTK (time to kill) combat. I refrain from crafting gear to keep lootdrops and treasure chests interesting and my weaponry from being overpowered. I'm lvl 18 and I'm just about finishing up the dreamy forrest zone right now and my weapons are all lvl 6-7. I do a lot of rolling around and parrying and juggling and setting up general bad assery with my skills. Finesse skills are not about raw damage output, but rather about setting up the enemy with traps and bombs or lunging to their backside. I'm like 3x higher in lvl than I am supposed to be and combat is far from being 'faceroll' everything (at least in the dungeons, since they got lvl-scaling), even if I'm in no real risk of failure. Every now and then there's a room set-up for some ninja stealth action, which is done pretty darn well too.

Because I knew that difficulty is rather low and learned from reviews and forum post what's OP, I skewed my combat experience to be the most enjoyable. To me that's going pure Finesse and disregard crafting equipment, to keep gear and content on a level. It worked out thus far. I'm having a blast. I'll do my experimenting and crafting once I reach level cap and the final questing zone.

This is probably the best advice to take, but like Skyrim my aboslutely biggest complaint too. These games are supposedly so great because for their free-form "do what you want" style of play, but if you make some wrong choices you just end up breaking the game. Without doing much research or anything I decided I wanted to play BattleMage, swinging around a big sword and casting spells just sounded cool (also, I've never been much of a "rogue-guy"), but ofc it turns out that the Might Sorcery combo is just retardedly overpowered. Got the most armor in the game, the most resistance, even more damage reduction from shield, and to top it off all damage taken = mana and mana = health through heal. And ofc I also love to play around with crafting, which again, well ye... don't need to go into it :P It just makes it really hard to find enjoyment in the game when you have to purposefully make "bad" desicions or the game becomes too simple to even show a hint of it's deeper mechanics.
 
Ofc, I could just reset my skills, but at this point it's just gonna be annoying to play either mage or warrior as it's gonna be basically just the same as I'm playing now, just with even less abilities.
#47 Posted by MooseyMcMan (10898 posts) -

I haven't played the final game, but that pretty much sums up my thoughts after playing the demo.

Moderator
#48 Posted by EmuLeader (558 posts) -

@Marz said:

After the 15 hour mark i just decided to just do the main story and skip all the side quests and i'm enjoying the game more myself. The main story is getting alot more interesting but i think it's all the side stuff that brings down this game's entertainment level ( at least for me).

This is the exact advice Jeff gave during the Quick Look. He said that the main quest and major side quests (such as faction quests) were very well written and all around great. He said the best thing you can do is to skip all the generic side quests (such as fetch this, kill 5 rabbits, etc.) and the experience will be much better. The only time he recommending doing those was if you needed a little more exp. Have not played it myself, but from you, and others I have talked to, this advice seems to hold very true.

#49 Posted by bunnymud (717 posts) -

I am fully enjoying this game. Aside from a couple of minor annoyances, it is hard to put down.

#50 Posted by jetsetwillie (857 posts) -

to feel buyers remorse i need to of spend a decent amount of cash £150+ really, like when i bought a PSP.

a £35 game is not worth me getting bothered about to be honest.

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