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SARRISS

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HD-DVD is dead but did Blu-ray win or Sony?

By SARRISS 28 Comments

First I should start by saying I worked at a Video store during the format war in question and ended up adopting both formats out of necessity at the time, which I am and always be fine with, but there is no reason this should have happened and I'll tell you why I think so...
 
Click the Spoiler Warning for a brief history.

SPOILER WARNING: Click here to reveal hidden content.  
 
We all know that Sony is a huge multifaceted company with products in the TV, Desktop/Laptop, Cell Phone (Sony Ericsson) Video game and Movie fields which means they had a lot to gain from owning a current standard format. With the format under there control they can, in theory, get priority with manufacturing their own movies and make money off studios who choose to use the format. Remember how pornography ended up on the VHS before the end of the format war, questionably assisting its victory. DVD also adopted it to much acclaim, but what about Bluray? Sony initially said that pornography had no place on Bluray and refused to help manufacture them, shortly after the adult industry found places that would manufacture it's films. Both produced perfect HD movies and I bet you can tell by the tone of this so far I was more of a fan of HD-DVD. The features of the HD-DVD side were great: PiP Commentary, Menu Bar accessible without movie interruption, Internet connectivity and double sided disc including DVD compatible side. Most of these features were adopted by Sony after Toshiba bowed out. The only real difference was Format Size and Cost, Bluray coming in at 50GB max and HD-DVD 30GB with Bluray being the most expensive.

You may wonder how this relates to video games, well unfortunately not kindly. Microsoft decided to continue its use of DVD in the Xbox 360 which so far has been a win/loss scenario with some recent games requiring multiple discs while disc run fast and are inexpensive. Sony did use Bluray and while including a player for a fraction of the cost of standalone's the games suffer slower runtime (meaning longer load times in some cases) at the cost of huge storage eliminating multiple discs, for now. Some PlayStation 3 games also require mandatory partial installs to assist in runtime but still as of yet have not allowed the installation of an entire disc like the Xbox 360.

Now we look to the future of video games and wonder what Microsoft will do to replace the aging DVD while Sony fines a way to tame the mighty Bluray. Some now speculate Microsoft adopting the Bluray but the complications may cause them to look elsewhere, hopefully HD-DVD. No mater what happens its Sony that wins, making money hand over fist on a format that some can't live without...

What do you think?
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SARRISS

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Edited By SARRISS

First I should start by saying I worked at a Video store during the format war in question and ended up adopting both formats out of necessity at the time, which I am and always be fine with, but there is no reason this should have happened and I'll tell you why I think so...
 
Click the Spoiler Warning for a brief history.

SPOILER WARNING: Click here to reveal hidden content.  
 
We all know that Sony is a huge multifaceted company with products in the TV, Desktop/Laptop, Cell Phone (Sony Ericsson) Video game and Movie fields which means they had a lot to gain from owning a current standard format. With the format under there control they can, in theory, get priority with manufacturing their own movies and make money off studios who choose to use the format. Remember how pornography ended up on the VHS before the end of the format war, questionably assisting its victory. DVD also adopted it to much acclaim, but what about Bluray? Sony initially said that pornography had no place on Bluray and refused to help manufacture them, shortly after the adult industry found places that would manufacture it's films. Both produced perfect HD movies and I bet you can tell by the tone of this so far I was more of a fan of HD-DVD. The features of the HD-DVD side were great: PiP Commentary, Menu Bar accessible without movie interruption, Internet connectivity and double sided disc including DVD compatible side. Most of these features were adopted by Sony after Toshiba bowed out. The only real difference was Format Size and Cost, Bluray coming in at 50GB max and HD-DVD 30GB with Bluray being the most expensive.

You may wonder how this relates to video games, well unfortunately not kindly. Microsoft decided to continue its use of DVD in the Xbox 360 which so far has been a win/loss scenario with some recent games requiring multiple discs while disc run fast and are inexpensive. Sony did use Bluray and while including a player for a fraction of the cost of standalone's the games suffer slower runtime (meaning longer load times in some cases) at the cost of huge storage eliminating multiple discs, for now. Some PlayStation 3 games also require mandatory partial installs to assist in runtime but still as of yet have not allowed the installation of an entire disc like the Xbox 360.

Now we look to the future of video games and wonder what Microsoft will do to replace the aging DVD while Sony fines a way to tame the mighty Bluray. Some now speculate Microsoft adopting the Bluray but the complications may cause them to look elsewhere, hopefully HD-DVD. No mater what happens its Sony that wins, making money hand over fist on a format that some can't live without...

What do you think?
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shiftymagician

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Edited By shiftymagician

<Post Coming>

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zeforgotten

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Edited By zeforgotten

@<Insert Username> 
<Reply Coming>

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deactivated-630b11c195a3b

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Edited By deactivated-630b11c195a3b

I may also post when the time comes....

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MisterChief

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Edited By MisterChief

Great thread. Would read again.

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harvey_the_pooka

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Edited By harvey_the_pooka

I said it before and will say it again: what the fuck! This site is becoming more and more the site of trolls and spammers. And no I do not want to buy dirt cheap Nike shoes!

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SARRISS

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Edited By SARRISS
@MisterChief:  @hidys:  @ZeForgotten:  @ShiftyMagician:  I'm sorry for the wait but for some reason my browser was giving me a hard time posting the whole thing.
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SARRISS

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Edited By SARRISS
@harvey_the_pooka said:
" I said it before and will say it again: what the fuck! This site is becoming more and more the site of trolls and spammers. And no I do not want to buy dirt cheap Nike shoes! "
Sorry to disappoint but I do not offer Nike shoes...
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Revan_NL

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Edited By Revan_NL

SONY-DOES-NOT-OWN-BLURAY
 
Simple as that.

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shiftymagician

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Edited By shiftymagician
@SARRISS said:

" @harvey_the_pooka:  @MisterChief:  @hidys:  @ZeForgotten:  @ShiftyMagician:  I'm sorry for the wait but for some reason my browser was giving me a hard time posting the whole thing. "

What was the problem and what browser were you using?
 
Anyways it was a good read.  Thank god the format wars ended without dragging on for too long, however it will be interesting to see if Microsoft/Toshiba somehow pulls a middle finger and launches another poprietary disc format just to try and start another one.  It will be unlikely though as a lot of the new HD content uses Blu-Ray as the main medium to ship to consumers.  Also, all the Blu-Ray hardware that has been sold since Blu-Ray was officially adopted has solidified the format's long longevity.
 
Microsoft would play nice at least for one console cycle in their next system and utilise Blu-Ray before trying it again with Toshiba or some other company that may be wanting to launch another format to try and win the majority of consumer interests.  
 
EDIT: Also as Revan_NL said, Sony doesn't completely win in this, however they will profit from it regardless as they are the one console platform that combines a game console with a Blu-Ray player.  I can't say for total sales, but here in Australia, people liked that all-in-one solution idea that Sony had going with the PS3.
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SARRISS

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Edited By SARRISS
@ShiftyMagician said:

" @SARRISS said:

" @harvey_the_pooka:  @MisterChief:  @hidys:  @ZeForgotten:  @ShiftyMagician:  I'm sorry for the wait but for some reason my browser was giving me a hard time posting the whole thing. "

What was the problem and what browser were you using?  Anyways it was a good read.  Thank god the format wars ended without dragging on for too long, however it will be interesting to see if Microsoft/Toshiba somehow pulls a middle finger and launches another poprietary disc format just to try and start another one.  It will be unlikely though as a lot of the new HD content uses Blu-Ray as the main medium to ship to consumers.  Also, all the Blu-Ray hardware that has been sold since Blu-Ray was officially adopted has solidified the format's long longevity. Microsoft would play nice at least for one console cycle in their next system and utilise Blu-Ray before trying it again with Toshiba or some other company that may be wanting to launch another format to try and win the majority of consumer interests.    EDIT: Also as Revan_NL said, Sony doesn't completely win in this, however they will profit from it regardless as they are the one console platform that combines a game console with a Blu-Ray player.  I can't say for total sales, but here in Australia, people liked that all-in-one solution idea that Sony had going with the PS3. "
Chrome for some reason would allow me to post if I spent less than 60 seconds on the post. Cleared cookies and compiled in notepad, crisis adverted. 
 
One thing that gets to me is if HD-DVD was around we'd have a better chance of not having unskipable previews, which most didn't have previews at all if not entirely skipable. I cannot see a future where a Sony logo is on a Microsoft console box, they wont allow that, its more likely that they will utilize HD-DVD or create a new format. And yes, Sony Doesn't completely win but it has a new cash flow with a growing demand. 
 
EDIT: If Microsoft pioneers a new format it would be Console centric, I would have to assume as there is no reason to compete in a industry they aren't in.
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DetectiveSpecial

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Edited By DetectiveSpecial
@SARRISS said:


 ........Microsoft decided to continue its use of DVD in the Xbox 360 which so far has been a catch 22 with some recent games requiring multiple discs while disc run fast and are inexpensive.


 
That's cause and effect. That is not a Catch-22. 
Personally, I think Blu-Ray won the battle because it's a new technology. HD-DVD is a reworking of the compression algorithms and disc-layout, and was more a refinement of current DVD technology. 
As pointed out numerous times already, Sony doesn't own Blu-Ray.  
The idea that the porn industry choosing VHS is what led to its success is a fun story, but isn't that true. VHS was fighting BETA, which Sony DID entirely own. While BETA was the superior format, Sony refused to license the tech to anyone outside of the studio system, including the porn industry. 
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SARRISS

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Edited By SARRISS
@DetectiveSpecial said:

" @SARRISS said:


 ........Microsoft decided to continue its use of DVD in the Xbox 360 which so far has been a catch 22 with some recent games requiring multiple discs while disc run fast and are inexpensive.

 That's cause and effect. That is not a Catch-22. Personally, I think Blu-Ray won the battle because it's a new technology. HD-DVD is a reworking of the compression algorithms and disc-layout, and was more a refinement of current DVD technology. As pointed out numerous times already, Sony doesn't own Blu-Ray.  The idea that the porn industry choosing VHS is what led to its success is a fun story, but isn't that true. VHS was fighting BETA, which Sony DID entirely own. While BETA was the superior format, Sony refused to license the tech to anyone outside of the studio system, including the porn industry.  "
 Thank you for the correction.  
 
As far as the adult industry goes it is only a interesting observation that so far they have chosen the winners, thats all. it was not meant as a direct correlation.
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deactivated-630b11c195a3b

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Edited By deactivated-630b11c195a3b
Ultimately it seems like the ps3 could indirectly make Sony more money than either of their previous platforms solely on the basis that it was the main factor in standardizing Blu-ray.
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shiftymagician

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Edited By shiftymagician
@SARRISS:  Man I should check if that happens to me too with Chrome.  I use Firefox primarily, however if it happens to a bunch of people including myself on Chrome, it probably should be reported to the staff via a thread topic for them to have a look to see if it is their end or Chrome's.
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zeforgotten

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Edited By zeforgotten
@SARRISS: Hah, no reason to be sorry. 
I was just copying other peoples fun while I was waiting on whatever it is you wanted to write :P  
 
As for the topic itself.  
I do believe, personally, that Sony "won" with the Blu-ray thing and that they are able to put a little bit of the money earned from Blu-ray sales into their own pockets but it won't last. 
I have no idea when but I think that at some point someone else is gonna come out with something that's "better" (or more hyped) than Blu-ray and then that will be the new thing that everyone wants. 
It would be great if we lived in a world where we only needed one type of disc for all types of media like movies, video games and music but I sadly don't think it's gonna happen. 
 
So who knows, maybe Microsoft could come up with something new and exciting.  
Instead of Blu-ray it's gonna be.. Death-ray or something, I don't know, I'm kinda tired so none of this will make any sense at all and I'm just rambling and might have totally misunderstood what the fuck this was about after writing the word "reason" :P 
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Edited By Hunkulese

Shouldn't you have posted this three years ago?

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SARRISS

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Edited By SARRISS
@ZeForgotten: I still think Microsoft is smart enough to stay out of making hardware unless directly related to their own products or interests. In a lot of ways Bluray and HD-DVD are just a half step forward, both are still disc that use lasers and for the most part with size of the disc its not enough. I was hoping that the size would be enough to contain an entire season of something but with the video quality and multiple audio tracks we find ourselves still plagued with multi-disc TV shows and two disc special edition movies with the extras on a separate disc. HVD looked promising if not entirely impractical at 1TB storage, but do we want to continue using discs at all is the question not to mention if we lose/damage it we lose 1TB of stuff.
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WinterSnowblind

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Edited By WinterSnowblind
@DetectiveSpecial said:
" @SARRISS said:


 ........Microsoft decided to continue its use of DVD in the Xbox 360 which so far has been a catch 22 with some recent games requiring multiple discs while disc run fast and are inexpensive.

 That's cause and effect. That is not a Catch-22. Personally, I think Blu-Ray won the battle because it's a new technology. HD-DVD is a reworking of the compression algorithms and disc-layout, and was more a refinement of current DVD technology. As pointed out numerous times already, Sony doesn't own Blu-Ray.  The idea that the porn industry choosing VHS is what led to its success is a fun story, but isn't that true. VHS was fighting BETA, which Sony DID entirely own. While BETA was the superior format, Sony refused to license the tech to anyone outside of the studio system, including the porn industry.  "

Unlike previous formats like VHS vs BETA though..  Blu-ray won solely because they bought exclusive rights to distribute 90% of movies.  After that, HD-DVD pretty much announced itself dead, as they physically weren't able to release anything. 
 
Can't say I have any experience with HD-DVD to say which was better, but I would have liked to see how this "war" would have played out if this didn't happen.
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Azteck

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Edited By Azteck

I actually wouldn't mind much if the next 360 used an HD-DVD format. Not sure why, but something about it sounds alright with me.

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SARRISS

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Edited By SARRISS
@ShiftyMagician: Its definitely on Chrome's end, it has been reported to Chrome Development and if it happens again I may hit up one of the guys here too.

@WinterSnowblind: Thank you! I hesitated to bring this up but you're right. Of the big 6 Studios each had 3 using the format respectably but once Sony gave incentives and/or lowered the cost for those studios it didn't take long for them to switch sides, including Warner Bros. who was the most important studio backing Toshiba. 
 
@Hunkulese: I was reminded of this while reading Jeff's Formspring, I assure you its been 3 years but its not too late.  
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MikeinSC

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Edited By MikeinSC

I doubt this win is that huge for Sony because I still think physical media for movies is a dying industry.

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EVO

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Edited By EVO
@ZeForgotten said:
" I have no idea when but I think that at some point someone else is gonna come out with something that's "better" (or more hyped) than Blu-ray and then that will be the new thing that everyone wants. "
Nah. I think Blu-Ray will be the last of the physical formats. It's all digital from here.
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Edited By Marcsman

None of the above. 
Laser Discs still rule the world!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Edited By keyhunter
@SARRISS: It's time to bring back cartridges.
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SARRISS

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Edited By SARRISS
@keyhunter: YES! But only if you can top load carts genesis style for crazy crossovers.
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the_OFFICIAL_jAPanese_teaBAG

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Edited By the_OFFICIAL_jAPanese_teaBAG

i remember seeing disk players that had 2 slots that could play blu-ray and hd dvds... 

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Edited By iam3green

sony won with bluray. i think the next xbox is going to use bluray because it's the format to use. sony doesn't technically own bluray. microsoft could use their own format but it won't do any good. it reminds me of what nintendo did with their gamecube. the disc were smaller than a normal disc. i thought it was great to have smaller disc. i thought that was going to be next because of it. peopel are going to use what ever format is the current one.