Yakuza 6, Persona 5, NieR: Automata, Final Fantasy XV, Vakyria: Azure Revolution, Musous on Musous on Musous, VR at TGS, School Girl/Zombie Hunter, PS4 Pro, Super Mario Run, and lots more from this year’s Tokyo Game Show!
Every other week, tune into 8-4 Play for talk about video games, Japan, and Japanese video games, straight from the 8-4 offices in beautiful downtown Tokyo. Hosted by 1UP Japan's own Mark MacDonald, John Ricciardi, and Hiroko Minamoto.
You guys sound like mothers in the 90s. Groping women in video games causes people to grope women in real life? These darn video games turning my kid into a sex criminal!
@zaldar: You want game translations to go back to the quality of early-PS1 and earlier? That's a weird thing to want. I'm all for keeping the content of the games at parity with each other when it gets localized, but asking for a translation instead of localization is pure ignorance about what a localization is.
First time I tried listening to this in a while. Not gonna lie, but there are too many times people are talking over each other or talking all at once for my taste.
The way the people talk about FFXIII you would get the impression that it was the worst game ever made, even though it sits at 82% on Metacritic. I'm currently playing through FFX for the first time and people seem adore that game even though it is just as linear as FFXIII.
@zaldar: You want game translations to go back to the quality of early-PS1 and earlier? That's a weird thing to want. I'm all for keeping the content of the games at parity with each other when it gets localized, but asking for a translation instead of localization is pure ignorance about what a localization is.
localization certainly seems to mean removal of anything that makes something recognizable as being from a different culture. Removal of honorifics from japanese games, removal of anything remotely questionable. Translation does not mean word for word translation not looking at the differences in shades of meaning or language. Example: Ich habe zu meine hause sein. Is (I think it's been awhile) the proper way to say I went to my house in German. A direct word for word translation would be I have to my house been (you can always tell a German as because Sherlock Holmes said they are mean to their verbs). The "correct" translation would be I went home, or I went to my house. I want this I don't want the direct word for word. But if a big part of the plot of the game has to do with Octoberfest I don't want it changed to Halloween since we don't have Octoberfest in America. THAT is what it seems like localization has become.
That comment of Nintendo wants to make next Vita for Japan rather than the next PS4 for Japan hit me hard, especially since how I think Nintendo operates with an intense focus on its home market.
They are so antisex it is ridiculous it makes me sad for any game they localize honestly as they would remove so much. TRANSLATION NOT LOCALIZATION!
Otherwise my god that thumbnail man talk about nightmare fuel
Since I'm not above putting words in to other people's mouths, maybe the panelists don't see the content they objected to as sex but as cheap titillation for a particular demographic? That instead of intimacy, they see provocation? That exposure can perhaps subtle effects? Ah, anyway, back to it.
@zaldar said: But if a big part of the plot of the game has to do with Octoberfest I don't want it changed to Halloween since we don't have Octoberfest in America. THAT is what it seems like localization has become.
The Old Guard way of localization was/is based on taking a property from a foreign land and having it reach the widest possible audience in a new one. And that meant some choice changes, depending on the times. Thanks to the internet making information and commerce more freely available, it is now possible for dedicated fans of foreign art works to access what they want more directly. Not a lot of people can muster that dedication, and that unfortunately means a smaller audience. Cutting to the chase, we have a new and growing way of localization that is clashing with the old, and it's not going to stop for a long while. I can only hope that this can be settle amicably, yeah?
As for the example you brought up, it rings false for me since I think enough people know about Octoberfest, knows it's a thing that exists, or can have it be explained to them in short order. We can not ever discount how vast and pervasive the difference Japan has with the rest of the world. Galapagos Syndrome is real, and I think it applies to much. It would be nice if the enormity of this difference is respected in such discussions.
Side note: Since these "translation vs. localization" stuff have been cropping up frequently in the video game sphere, I just want to throw out a couple of things:
Infernal Affairs <=> The Departed
Let the Right one In <=> Let Me In
Broadchurch <=> Gracepoint
Adaptions and new version shenanigans have happened across all media, so lets not think video games are super special in this regard. And you can put me in the camp that thinks that localized versions of video games are adaptations and new version. I'll concede that with movies the subtitled version is easily accessible and financially feasible, thus all audiences potentially getting the art work they want.
@eribuster: Yes the differences in Japanese and American culture are crazy - Japanese culture is generally a lot better as they don't have this terrible thing against cheap titillation as you call it. Playboy is not evil.
Translated copies SHOULD NOT be new versions but true to the original. You should be bringing the game as it was in the old culture. You are NOT making a the Ring (which stinks) version of Ringu (which is wonderful)- but translating Ringu!
As for the octoberfest I was looking for an example that wasn't Japanese the Japanese one would be the removal of honorifics.
And also - wow not familiar with the Berserk manga are you? As violent and "not fun" as the first anime was it was massively toned down from the manga. The last episode of the anime (with the female sacrifice) was more like the manga. The new series - for all that the CG can be bad - is MUCH closer to the manga feel. As I come to Berserk for dark dark stuff - this is what I want.
@zaldar: Please don't make the mistake of thinking products (e.g. SG/ZH School Girl/Zombie Hunter and some of the more provocative VR demos discussed in this episode) made for a subculture of Japan means that Japanese culture approves of it. They are just better (from our viewpoint anywa) at compartmentalizing then America. Something I wish we could be better at.
In respect to the 8-4 panel, I don't think they would say Playboy is evil. Nor do I recall them saying as such for SG/ZH. Some of the panelists expressed displeasure and distaste to the game's content, and that should be fine for them to say. I don't think such views will get in the way of their professional conduct as localization staff. Though, if you have disagreed with their past efforts, then you are free to think otherwise.
With regards to the Ringu example, this is where movies and video games differ in that it is so much more easier to have a subtitled version of a foreign film. Video games can rarely afford that luxury, sad as we would like it to. As I mentioned above, this is a contentious time between different schools of thought in bringing over Japanese video games to the rest of the world. Actually, it was probably always contentious. While I don't want you to change your belief of a more literal or more true translation, I hope that you will at least understand and maybe respect the practice and history of the localization school of thought that runs counter to your wishes.
I do not understand what the Berserk anime and manga has to do with the above conversation. Between Dark Horse publication of the manga and the Viz Media publication of The Golden Age movie trilogy, Berserk is available to Americans in English without any disagreeable editing (as far as I know). If you wish some Japanese video games got the same treatment, then I agree with you.
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