The Consequences of Bullying Are Inspiring Silent Enemy

Because they will automatically disappear because someone wants to make something that isn't what you want?

@uberdubie: Bingo. You and I are alike. Indistinguishable!

Couldn't agree more. This misses the target for me.

@arjybarjy: I'm sure you could. With your tin-foil hat on!! Amirite?

Lemme talk to you about chemtrails...

I just want the cool games like Street Fighter.

Yes, let's bring even more needless attention to this highly-sensationalized hot-button news topic. Am I "for" bullying? Of course not. What bothers me is how all this "bully awareness" is ultimately just a disingenuous gesture with no real purpose behind it (unless you call merely having "good intentions" a purpose).

It's always exclusively over grade school children, specifically after a mass shooting. So say we live in a dreamworld and all forms of bullying are abolished in schools. School is a utopia and everyone gets along perfectly there. Then these kids get shoved into the real world. But being an adult is unchanged. Their workplace may be FULL of bullying, whether it be from their boss or their co-workers. And that's the lucky few who got a job that they're actually proud of, while others can't even find a job. Drivers on the road flip them off yelling "LEARN HOW TO DRIVE YA DUMB FUCK" for doing nothing wrong. They may have to ease back on paying some bills because they can't afford them, and soon utilities are turned off and perhaps they end up homeless. So... now that they're grown-up, exactly what good did all the warm, fuzzy feelings of bully-awareness and illusions of safety do for them? Who knows. But damn are they screwed.

Adults murder other adults who hurt their feelings every day. Adults kill themselves due to depression every day. But it's not a hot-button topic on the news today so nobody cares about that right now. So even if you don't want to hear "just deal with it" or "you must learn to fend for yourself" because it's just too darned unfair to children or teens... eventually they're going to have to. The world IS a bully. Because unless you're dirt-stinking rich, eventually, there comes a day where nobody is there to coddle you anymore. And there's no way to prove that preparing yourself for this realization at the age of 28 is any less beneficial to a 12 year old.

So, I urge anyone bullying-er, "preaching" bully-awareness: just... stop. The whole bullying campaign is nothing more than that, a political campaign. Making it the subject of a video game only makes it even more reprehensible.

Oh no! My white heteronormality is threatend!

Quick, to the comments field!

I was bullied too. It's probably why I started playing video games so much.

@jdevlin24tgb: Okay, maybe missing the point a little bit here.

We can all agree that the goal is to reduce bullying in general and stop that behavior more effectively when it does start. So the question is how do we achieve that?

Well, bullying is an exceedingly complicated situation, made all the more difficult because those who are bullied are chosen based on some innate characteristic, as opposed to two people who have a disagreement that can be solved, there is no simple solution because the recipient of the bullying has done nothing. That means that the reform must focus on the bully. Discovering the core cause of their behavior and addressing those root problems, along with as much involvement as possible with the bullies' parents to make sure that they can observe and help their child work through their aggressive tendencies.

What we see often (like here on this forum) are instead responses like, "No they are monsters and fucking cowards .... fuck bullies!!!!! They deserve no defense." This demonizing only serves to instill the role of "Bully" in a person, and will never change their terrible behavior. Certainly when the government declares a "War on Bullying", they turn kids into enemy combatants which even more so reinforces a role that they fit into, rather than addressing why they bully in the first place.

This is made even worse when it's that same government who runs the ineffective public school system where bullying thrives, and all they do is demonize rather than change. (Not to say that bullying doesn't exist in private schools of course, but here in the US there are 3 times as many public than private, and violence does occur more in those government run schools).

Basically, when schools turn a blind eye, or worse, make aggressive kids who can be changed into enemies, criminals, and monsters, this real and horrible problem will only get worse.

I wouldn't be surprised most artists, designers, etc. were bullied. As in creating your own worlds is a means of escape.

Hey Jason, your gonna need some help harassing all those goof tards that like this game. Mind if I help?

I seem to be talking quite a bit about gangs recently with that other thread about the people going to SF. I'm going to put this as nicely as I can, but people who didn't grow up in areas with gang violence and think that conventional methods of dealing with "bullies" in the areas they grew up in can be applied to all situations don't know what the fuck they're talking about.

I only had two altercations in high school (that I can remember) with the first one being fairly straight forward. Two guys approached me trying to start shit, but I knew they didn't have any connections so I'd only have to fight them both. I was in all the AP classes so they probably thought I was some nerdy smart guy. I immediately threw down my backpack and said something to the effect of letting them throw the first punch because I was going to put them both in the hospital. They never bothered me again.

The second situation was a bit more complex. A dude who was a wannabe gang banger claimed I did something to his sister (I did not) and wanted to start something. He did it in front of my friends and everyone told me to lay him the fuck out because they had my back. There was no question I'd beat him. The problem was that his back up wasn't so much on the wannabe gang banger side and I didn't want to find out how many of them were legit. I had to take his mad dogging and occasional shoves in hallways for a few days because I knew I couldn't start that. I guess he eventually found out he was mistaken because he stopped a few days later and he never bothered me again.

Bullying isn't always the type of stuff you see on TV. It can have very real and violent consequences if you don't know how to handle yourself properly.

I'm just going to employ a strategy a friend taught me when I see dumb comments.

lol

So then I would know what is best right?

Says the Mental Health Therapist.

Is it a requirement to have been bullied to work on this game? I jest but it is a bit odd that all of the head staff were all bullied. Maybe that's just because I was never bullied nor bullied others. In all seriousness this could be an interesting game and see how they tackle the subject. Hopefully its a better game then Papo & Yo in terms of gameplay.

I think this story will resonate with a lot of people because I think bullying is a more prevalent difficulty that people deal with. Comparing the severity of bullying and the harshness of an abusive family member is not what I'm arguing, but in regards to how many people have been affected by bullying, I think it is a much more widespread problem. The theme of this game will most definitely resonate with a lot of people.

Wah wah wah indie art, pretentious bullshit.. The only game I want that involves bullying is Bully 2.

I'm kidding, Papa Y yo was great. And I'm looking forward to more games that deal with serious issues.

I suppose having been bullied was a requirement for working on the project?

They wouldn't lie about something like that, would they...

In my subjective experience, bullying mostly depends of the environment. I happened to go to three different schools in my life, and one of them was almost completely bullying free, the other I was bullied at, but when we reached high school, people seemed to mature and grow out of it, so it stopped.

This trailer is a bit pretentious, though. The best part of Papo & Yo was how it came out of nowhere.

I plan on bullying the people who like this game.

Could be cool. Papo y Yo made some interesting choices and had beautiful aesthetics, despite its faults. Hopefully Minority Media can use mechanics to demonstrate an emotional journey even more successfully here. They are clearly thinking of even their enemies, with the crows being designed to have a certain uncomfortable vulnerability rather than being purely villainous.

Also, weird crusaders being contrary to avoid empathy and promote false rugged individualism are weird. Please go to a different website. You scare me.

Talk about pandering...

As if bullying stops after adolescence.

The bullied grow up and get jobs, the bullies go into politics.

Sounds like you weren't bullied as a kid.

sarcasm bro, sarcasm.

@zerov2:

Yeah, I know. If only the bullies would stop bullying people or something...

I think this could be good. I've not played Papo y Yo, but I like what it's trying to say while at the same time remaining aesthetically interesting. Sure, the trailer seems to drop an anvil on you, but I'll reserve judgment when the game comes out.

On a similar note, I'm glad that games are tackling serious issues like this. I was a big fan of Depression Quest, and I await other games that tackle the hardships of life as well as the empowerment of escapism.

Comes off a bit trite, and considering the fact that Papa y Yo rested, primarily, on its emotional qualities, doesn't bode well here. I.e.: if the game fails to resonate emotionally, and can't fall back on meaningful gameplay, why should I care? Perhaps I'm being harsh, but bullying doesn't strike me quite as personally, and doesn't feel as personal of a story, as the themes in Papa y Yo. Call it cautiousness.

@hailinel: My guidance counselors were good about seeing both parties separately, then having a group session if they thought it was appropriate. I can't speak to issues of depression, but it would be horrible if somebody identified a child with the symptoms & didn't address the issue with the child's parents.

For me it worked when I pushed back against the assclowns who thought it was funny to pick on the quiet kid & by the time I got into high school I was able to help others who couldn't stand up for themselves. My point was that sometimes people don't know that fighting back is an option. I'm not trying to be dismissive, just saying that I didn't personally have serious issues when bullied.

Life is rough. Bullying happens and it sucks. So does paying taxes, car accidents and mortality.

Looking back on my late teens and early twenties, I invited misery through media. I wanted to watch shows, movies and play games that challenged my experiences in life. But as soon as I had to deal with the intensity of serious debt and the deaths of parents, that made a profound change in me.

I'm not against people developing a game that deals with hard subjects. But I for one play games to escape the bullshit that I have to deal with in the real world. I suppose it relates to your age and your experiences in life. If bullying is a profound issue for you, then hopefully these types of project will do you some good.

hey stop being an e-bully. jerk off

You're oversimplifying things to the extreme.

The problem with bullying, aside from the bullying itself, is the number of people that are aware it occurs but don't do anything about it, or think it's some sort of rite of passage. The "war on bullying" is about raising awareness that this shit is not OK and that it shouldn't be tolerated.

@joshwent: Misbehaved is past tense and implies a singular action of negative behavior. Bullying is repetitive action of ill behavior toward another person for no apparent reason. You call someone a bully because you WANT to "turn the heat up," you want this person to stop behaving the way they are. Because the word "bully" has such a negative meaning behind it, people who are called so might be more inclined to discontinue their bullying. It's inappropriate to make light of the situation by not "heating it up" because then there is no consequence for this sort of awful and hateful behavior. Yes, if there are circumstances at home that are causing one child to bully another as an outlet for their own frustration and anger, those problems need to be explored and remedied, but by no means to we give the bully a pass for mistreating others because they will continue to do so unless told otherwise. She claims that America is a nation of fear. Guess what, bad shit has been happening all over the world since day one, that is nothing new. Sure with the internet and social media, certain hot topics spread like wild fire; but raising awareness on a subject of this magnitude that has been affecting young people for as long as they've existed can only be a good thing.

This ladies ignorance is appalling! She says in regards to bullying victims, "'and now we're not teaching kids, 'you know sometimes you just... I know you're feeling bad and let's help you get over your feelings. But this situation is going to go away if you deal with your feelings and recognize that feelings come and go, and your experience with that doesn't mean that's who you are."' Let me paraphrase: "If you think happy thoughts, you won't get bullied." WHAT?! is this woman RETAR... *ahem*... out of her mind. To stop bullying, you don't tell the kid who's getting bullied to "deal with it" while waving a finger at the bully saying " you're NOT a bully, just don't misbehave, okay?" Bullying victims are victims because they lack the means, be it physically or emotionally, to defend themselves--therefore, they must rely on the help of others.

Yes, when dealing with the impressionable minds of children, we must choose a course of action that is flexible yet firm, but we MUST CHOOSE SOMETHING. Bullying is real, and it's bad.

STOP BULLYING OR I'LL GIVE YOU A SWIRLY! (do people still do that?... if you do, STOP) :)

The idea of being against bullying is ridiculous. Everyone is against bullying, it's like saying you're against the Nazis - well okay, thats really great but so is everybody else.

It completely misses the point. Bullying is a byproduct of many, many things that are wrong with our colture, from horrible parenting rto economic hardship. There are lots of cultural conditions that can transform a child into a 'bully'. Those same exact circumstances may transform another child into a saint. It's all situational.

I think people get frustrated with the 'war against bullying' because it doesn't stand for anything. It's not addressing under-fed children, it's not addressing alcoholic fathers, it's just saying 'DON'T BE MEAN TO US'.

It's horrible to hear about bullying situations that end tragically or with death. Sickening. Unfortunately, it's not going to end just by the general public condemning bullies. I think the video linked above is great, and sheds some light on why this isn't as straightforward a problem as a lot of people think.

If you've been bullied, you know what the best way to get back at those people are? Forget about them. Have a good life. Be happy with yourself and your actions. And if you see them again, grab a beer together.

School guidance counselors love dispensing that sort of rhetoric, which is really unfortunate. It's basically like telling someone with chronic depression to think happy thoughts.

That's why if you can't handle the heat, you get some help instead of trying to take on the bullies when it's going to lead to you getting your ass kicked.

I was bullied a bit as a kid, but I spend more time looking in on those situations. Because of my relationship with my father (who was much more than merely a "bully") I took to defending people who needed the help, and honestly it always ticked me off that the kids being bullied wouldn't just go ASK FOR HELP. Being bullied sucks, I know, I've experienced some pretty rough stuff but I was pretty tough in more ways than one so I could stand up for myself. But I wouldn't have hesitated to ask for help if I needed it. I think if we want to help people who are being bullied, we need to get them to seek help instead of just focusing on the assholes. They aren't the only part of the equation and ultimately putting the solution in the hands of those being bullied would be so much more useful.

Everyone knows that bullies are assholes. More people need to step in, instead of just trying to get the bullies to "knock it off." Honestly the sickest part of watching a kid being bullied is all of the cunt faced cowards who just fucking watch. It's not the fucked up idiot who's just too immature to treat anyone with respect, probably because their parents are idiots as well, that really bother me. Those guys are easy to deal with. It's the little weasels that just sit by and watch.

When I was in high school, I was often the only person stepping in to help with this kind of shit. I ended up standing up to literally the entire football team between classes at some point, entirely on my own. I've even seen kids being assholes in the middle of a class with no one, not even the teacher, doing anything until I got out of my seat and got in the prick's face.

You want to make a game to push a good message about bullying? We don't need to understand where the bullies or the bullied come from or how they feel, because either you are neither a bully or the bullied or you are and already know that shit. There's a ton of material out there already that touches on those subjects. I want to see more people encouraging people who aren't directly involved, the onlookers, to grow a pair and step in, even if you might get hurt or look like an idiot or be seen with the weird kid that no one likes just because he never says much.

If you're being bullied, seek help. I got shit for a few little things, and eventually got a decent bit of shit on the odd occasion because of my sexual orientation. But none of it went very far because someone did something about it. It's not going to be the bully, and chances are they are bullying on the victim because they are confident that the victim couldn't really directly and effectively fight back so it probably won't be them, so seek out help. And if you see some asshole mistreating another person, step the fuck up.

@freedomtown Actually, the reason why bullying is more of a "thing" today's society is because the exceptionally extreme examples are much easier to spread through certain channels. Sure, you could argue that people need thicker skin if it's just some idiots calling you names. But some bullying, a lot in fact, goes beyond that. No one likes being bullied. Hell, even after boot camp, your unit hazing you is going to make you fucking miserable, no matter how hard you think you are. It sucks. Now, in that situation, I'd argue it's different because I see the purpose of that and I understand why it happens so long as it stays within the limits of reason. But when you're 13 years old and every fucking day some asshole is just hammering on you? That's not something you can just "deal with." Maybe you could, maybe I could, but not everyone can.

And not all bullying is easy to deal with. Some of it is ridiculous. It's not just in the movies that assholes tie up kids and shit like that. I've seen a kid having a panic attack because he was tied up to a pole and couldn't move anything but his head. That shit is terrifying for some people. My father once forced me into the corner of a couch to the point I was basically like a tight wad of paper. It was painful, and it was hard to breath, and at the time I was claustrophobic which immediately put me into a pretty intense panic attack. Which he proceeded to tell me was "just a game" and I needed to stop being such a "baby."

There's no excuse for that behavior, and there's not much you can do to not be affected by that. I managed to turn it into something good for myself in the long run. I forced myself to get over my claustrophobia, and now I'm mostly fine. But it was a miserable experience and it never should have happened to me and it should never happen to any kid, at the hands of anyone, father or peer.

People are assholes, and to dismiss that as something someone needs to just deal with is fucking stupid. They aren't doing anything wrong, and you're saying it's on them to just buck up and deal with it? I don't think you really understand what bullying is. Bullying is when someone spends every day convincing you that you are worthless, that you are a disgusting pervert because you're gay or that you're ugly just because you aren't a creepy skeleton that starves yourself or just going beyond hassling, beyond teasing over little things, and just attacking someone on a regular basis, often physically.

When you're talking about some jock athlete asshole or rich prick that thinks he's all that beating up on and abusing some quiet, timid kid and all you have to say is "deal with it," doesn't prove you to be a bad ass or a hard ass or whatever the fuck, it just shows you have no actual connection to reality.

"What, your government, with a military, is oppressing a bunch of untrained and unarmed civilians? DEAL WITH IT YOU PUSSY." That's about the logic you seem to be holding on to.

So they're making Bully 2?

I think the point is that it isn't always as simple as "stand up for yourself".

That things are not always as simple as what the person he responded to made it seem?

Fairly obvious.

Anything that brings light and conversation around the subject cannot hurt.

Doubt this game will grab my interests beyond simply discussing it. It is fascinating to see stories being told through different perspectives. Good for Minority Media, good luck to them.

Lesson learned - never stand up for yourself. Instead, go running to mommy/daddy/teacher/etc, because then you won't get jumped afterwards. Bullies always learn their lesson when the mommy comes to the rescue.

Really, what is your point?

A friend of mine did that in high school, made the guys look like a bunch of idiots.

Then later that day, they jumped him in the parking lot and repeatedly slammed a car door on his head. Just sayin.

I was pushed around when I was younger, but I fixed the problem by standing up for myself. Just sayin.

@marokai: We can't just generalize EVE as a bullying simulator since if that's the case we can pretty much call every other game out there that has a persistent and competitive aspect to be a bullying simulator as well such as popular, multiplayer shooters. Though I can see your point but it's not the entire goal of the game to bully. That's just comes off as being very dismissive.

Just speaking from my own personal experience here, but as someone that was bullied, and rather fiercely, throughout K-12, it was very, very difficult to see those that bullied me as anything other than obsessive monsters that thrived on making me suffer. Of course, I never knew most of them outside of the context of school, so I have no idea what their home lives were like and I'm sure that at least some of what I was put through was a result of their own problems, but from the perspective of someone that doesn't really know these people on that level, bullies are pretty much monsters.

Today, I'm fairly well-adjusted and am living a decent life with a good job, which, from the sound of things back home, is a far cry better than how some of the people that used to torment me turned out. I guess that, in its own way, is a form of revenge. Though I won't lie, I occasionally still fantasize about clubbing one particular bully with a baseball bat. I know it's not healthy, but then, neither is being on the receiving end of bullying for the entirety of childhood and adolescence.

I really am curious to know how this game will end. They could just pull the power fantasy twist where the bullied finally takes it out on the bullies, but that's the easy out.