Double Fine Returns to Kickstarter With Massive Chalice

Fuck yes Brad Muir. This game sounds like it really has potential to something you can sink hours and hours into. Did anyone else notice how much Brad Muir's doodles looked like Brad Muir? What an egomaniac.

Does he need to do a kickstarter? Do the double fine crew not have enough connections to get a game published? I love double fine, and I enjoy Brad Muir and his face, but if I amgoign to donate I would like to be sure that they exhausted every possible avenue before starting another kickstarter.

@djou: As I said in my post, it's fine if you enjoy the X-Com approach, but I find it shallow. I'll wait on more information but based on what has been said it sounds less like Fire Emblem and more like a simulator, if that makes sense. Especially with the amount of unique characters you could get out of selective breeding, I doubt they can give them all a sentence of backstory, which is disappointing. To be honest, I'd rather just drop the whole generation warfare thing and have unique characters instead. Even Awakening was a little disappointing in this regard, even casual-er than that is meh.

On the other hand, Muir's great, I may be wrong on all accounts. I hope this game does really well.

sure why not.

Well, Brad did spend an entire year trying to sell his Brazen pitch to publishers, but none would accept it. If they won't even take a risk on a monster hunter style game, they definitely wouldn't accept this oddity. I think their return to kickstarter is fairly well justified to keep that team working on something interesting.

@beard_of_zeus: The reference was made in the first few minutes of the first episode that came out nearly a week ago and it takes all of 30 seconds to put in that text on a video.

@endurancefun: once these games start coming out and if they aren't total garbage, I think I'll prefer getting my games this way, atleast from established developers, long preorders at fairly significant discounts with all the money going to the developer seems pretty cool and you'd hope that after awhile based on the game actually selling after it's released, that those funds will be used to finance future projects.

@splodge: Did you actually watch their pitch video?

Personally do not like seeing well known companies who could fund a game normally like everyone else instead abuse kickstarter to get more profit at lower risk since they don't have to pay back the cost and are still going to charge for the game. Especially so early on when they have nothing really to show and clearly haven't even really tried to get this game funded through normal means, and they haven't even released their other kickstarter game yet. Lame imo but I'm sure lots of people will throw money at them and I always get flamed by fanboys for this opinion, o well.

Thank you for making me watch that. It was pure awesome.

@darkest4: Perhaps they just prefer making games in this way rather then via "normal means". I don't believe there's anything malicious or nefarious intended in the vast majority of kickstarter projects. It's messy and unfamiliar for all involved, to be sure. There's layers of risk and opportunity for frustration and disappointment on both sides, but the goal for making a kind of niche sounding game with the help of a bunch of passionate people is very appealing for all kinds of developers and the audience.

An independent studio like DoubleFine can be buried with just one bad game, seemingly. They almost were already. This new mode of kickstarter seems far more advantageous to them.

Self-publishing is the future! <3

I'm starting a kickstarter to attempt to raise 10,000 dollars that I can invest in @mrmooear's kickstarter and hang out with the man himself. :D!

@darkest4:

I can understand where you're coming from, but is it really so bizarre that a development studio would want to self-publish rather then put themselves under the money-yoke of the publisher? Even the best publishers will take the lion's share of the profits. With so much skin in the game, and a publisher stuck on that money-yoke there is serious danger of creative drift to accommodate the necessary sales.

Look at Fuze. Even without publisher forcing them, focus tests said the original art style 'looked like a game for my little brother' Better push the art towards gritty and realistic. Resources down the drain, original vision diluted, all chasing the 'mainstream' of sales.

Kickstarter is smaller scale and there's no more money coming, so there's no space to move the game around trying to fill the biggest mainstream space. You get a creator, they ask for enough to make a game and we see what we get. What's the thrust of the arguement really? That developers who have a well known name should be *honor bound* to put themselves in the power of publishers? Just because you have 'good credit' doesn't mean you're honor bound to live outside your means.

They're not draining money from other kickstarters, in fact, during their first kickstarter tons of other kickstarters noticed the "DoubleFine Bump" since there were so many more people visiting the kickstarter page, tons of other kickstarters suddenly had new eyes browsing the site and donating. That doesn't even count things like the Kicking it Forwards project and such many successful games have signed up to do.

So they're helping themselves, they're helping other kickstarters, they're helping the 'art' of the genre (by removing the impulse to homogenize) and they're helping dedicated gamers by resurrecting 'dead' genres that can't be smash hits on an accountant's RoI page. Besides which, some of the best games coming up were kickstarter projects (Take a look at Shadowrun Returns)

Why should we tell them they should stay away? The only thing they're not helping is the current publisher model which is threatening to topple the whole industry under expanding mega-budgets.

Personally? Sign me up for Team :D

Mmm, that makes sense- I only played a little bit of the first FFT on the PS1 and skipped it to play the upgraded version on the PSP. They added other cameo characters like Luso from FFTA2, so I assumed Cloud was just another additional character. Good to know!

You will get "flamed" for not seeming to understand what kickstarter is and why they are using it. Most companies that pay to get games made tend to make the deal if they keep the IP for the game...as the joke about Iron Brigade would show and explain. Funding it this way means they can make the exact game they want to make and they keep the IP to the game...its a win-win for everyone.

Edit: I guess I should also add odds are no company would fund the game as it's not a known IP so they don't think they would make any money from it.

We've got to get this guy playing 4x games.

I have no problem with this business model, the fans get to preorder from Double Fine and all the money (apart from the kickstarter cut) goes to the developer.

This IS standing on their own two feet. At this point in the console cycle, a PC-led tactical strategy game? Would any publisher ever fund that? Fuck no. Kickstarter gives them exactly the independence you're joking about.

I've already been all in when i saw that thumbnail on the frontpage!

That kickstarter video is funny tho, Brad didn't paint anything there (i think?) and i wonder how many takes they did need until he caught that pen :D

Based on the pitch video, this is the game that finally sucks me into Kickstarter.

I was hoping for a bit more in terms of information but I've enjoyed most of the DF games (I thought Stacking was a little too dull) and who could say no to Brad's constant :D face and I really like the sound of the game they want to make. I only pledged $20 this time though unlike the $110 I did for DF Adventure.

Dbag facial hair... nice.

Will the backer rewards contain a reunion CD recorded by Brad Muir's ska band?

Either Double Fine gets money from us to fund their game (while also getting copies of it) or they get loans and funding from publishers who will own the rights to their work. Seeing as Tim will never be getting rights to any of his Lucas Arts creations since Disney is a greedy corporation who will never sell them, it's good that they will be releasing IP's they own. Although I've really only liked Psychonauts out of all their games since DF's founding, this and the Broken Age look fantastic and I will gladly support the team by funding their games as well as buying my copy at the same time!

This sounds great as fuck!!! Would totally play this!

I hope they add stretch goals to make it available on consoles or handhelds.

This sounds like it could be a cool fit on 3ds or Vita.

this game sounds like a pain in the ass

You mean like X-Com Enemy Unknown or the Hereos of Might and Magic games or Civilization? You act as if tactical strategy games are some niche thing on PCs.

a strategy rpg closely in the vein of FFT is a rare beast, something i've been thirsting for for years on PC, and yeah is somewhat niche. double fine can deliver on games, this is just a better way to 1. gauge interest on pet projects and 2. try to facilitate this kind of project without all the publisher overhead.

but i was mostly taking issue with the overdramatic reaction of the OP. if you don't agree with what DF is doing, vote with your wallet and don't back it.

as for me, i'm 90% confident this will be the first thing i ever back on Kickstarter.

Why would you not include a link to the Kickstarter project in question?

SO into this. Cross generational everything guys!! First person shooter dating sims, zombie survival children skill merging, I just don't even care.

Did you not click on where it says Massive Chalice ?

@paindamnation: Huh, thought I had checked all of the links. Ne'ermind then.

The OP is 100% correct in his assessment of the ethical implication of this type of journalism. He's not saying GB is actively trying to deceive their audience, but there is a very obvious reason why they selected this specific story to write about. In fact, having any relationship, other than a profesional one, with the people one is reporting on is a tough, debated ethical issue within all realms of journalism.

That being said, I think the last outlet we have to worry about is GB. They are extremely upfront about everything they do, and their relationship with developers makes sense when you think about the level of information and insite they are trying to bring to the table that many other outlets can't. Plus, I actually consider GB more entertainment than journalism in the first place. It's basically just a bunch of dudes making entertaining videos and giving their opinions on stuff occasionally. I don't expect them to be the most professional outlet in the world, and in a way they almost openly don't care about attempting any kind of objectivism.

It's a complicated issue that can't be summed up in a paragraph or two. Even while I'm writing this I'm going back and forth on my assessment of it. These kinds of issues have been debated for a long time, and will be debated well into the future.

I'd much rather them focus more on the game then the guys behind it. That video convinced me not to back it even though I love all the games referenced that DF was drawing influence from. I realize the video was supposed to be low rent and terrible but my skin was crawling through the entire thing. However I have no doubt the game will get funded and I'll get it one day.

I never get tired of this scene.

Sure it can, I don't even need a paragraph. Ready? Here we go....

"Do you trust them, or not?"

That's really all it boils down to. If you trust them, keep on visiting and reading, if you don't... well no reason to stick around. GB lets everyone know who their friends are, they don't pretend to know everything about every genre, or even to like every genre. (jrpg coverage here barely even exists, and that's totally fine. I'd rather the gb guys not cover stuff then pretend they're informed about the state of those games when they're not.) They've got press accounts, so they don't feel the money pinch for games as much, but otherwise they're a pretty normal group of gamer friends.

Personally I think it's a great way to go about things. The GB guys let you know who they are and who they're friends with, what they like and don't like, and with all that information we get to make an informed decision about everything they say. The answer isn't to be some sort of bubble-child 'no human interactions' robot of perfect nonbias, it's to let people know who and why you are and give an opinion based on that. That's the fundamental idea of this site. Whether you give them the time of day does indeed boil down to a very simple question.


"Do you trust them, or not?"

@shingro: Whether or not any of us trust them is not even the same question as whether or not their actions are ethical. Also, in ethics, personal feelings about whether something are right or wrong is irrelevant. What matters is the claim along with logic and evidence to support it.

That was some damn fine (double) shilling, I'm sick of kickstarters but I'm sold.

If Broken Age never comes out I have got my moneys worth just from the behind the scenes stuff. £15 is a small price to pay to get more Brad Muir on my screen.

pulled a pcgamer on me and had me click what felt like every link trying to find the actual kickstarter page.

Couldn't you have just gone to Kickstarter.com and entered "Massive Chalice" into the search box?

I've only back a few things on Kickstarter, but anything Double Fine wants to make has me. Never played a game if theirs I didn't like.

Absolutely, but that's not exactly easier than is the link to it was more apparent. Hope you don't think I'm making a big deal about this because I really don't care.

Nah, I didn't think so.

I'm loving that sweet MAME cab at 3:30. Somebody put a lot of love and hard work building that thing... either that or it's a just gutted MK2 cab. Either way, it's effing sweet.

Can we get a vote on just having a different picture of Brad on the homepage each week?

He makes me smile :)

They should do a web series in the style of their pitch video chronicling the daily routine at Double Fine.

a couple people did. thank you!