Fixing Mirrors Edge

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Edited By vidiot

A strange, yet understandable combination of work and finals for my classes I think slowed my normal activity here. It's difficult to gauge, all I know is that I have this huge hankering to sit and write...and write....and write...
 
In terms of what game stuff I've been doing: Yup, still with the new computer. I need to get back to the 360 though, as I sorta left my progress in TBOGT to focus on all the crazy new stuff that I've been gaming. 
 
I've been thinking deeply about the year in general. I'm surprised and happy about Sony's new-found momentum over the last year. There was a lot of surprises (and disappointments) this year software wise. Who would have thought that one of the best games this year would star Batman? Yes, yes, it is Batman, but well... I don't think it's controversial to state that the game could have gone either way.
 
I'm going on a tangent. Gotta refocus and... go on another tangent?... 
 
Do you know that Final Fantasy XIII is being released in Japan in only a few days? And over here in only a couple months? I feel weird. It's like when Killzone 2 finally came out, and I'm all like: Wow, it actually exists and stuff.
 

 Vidiot's Brain Dump: Side-effects include running at bright red objects.
 Vidiot's Brain Dump: Side-effects include running at bright red objects.
 

Reflection


The good news is that no matter how overtaken I am from...Life...I'm entrenched enough online to usually keep up to date. One article in particular a few days ago caught my eye and I've been thinking about it ever since in the back of my mind. Specifically an interview with the head of EA John Riccitiello with Kotaku. There were a few things that caught my attention:
  1. There will be a Mirrors Edge 2
  2. Apparently the design of this game is in a serious work in progress.
Interview highlights:
 


 "We're still working through things like how to best deal with Mirror's Edge 2," he said during a Wednesday morning interview in New York. "There are some things we learned about that [first] game. It was, I think, a massively innovative product. To be honest with you, I think it's a game that deserves to come back." 

"Innovation doesn't mean it all works the first time," he said. "If it did everyone would do it."

And that kind of talk brought him back to Mirror's Edge and its future. He got specific about design decisions relevant to the original team at Mirror's Edge DICE and whoever is on the case — he didn't specify DICE or otherwise — who are pondering a sequel:

"I think Mirror's Edge was a fascinatingly original world.Fascinatingly original art direction. Music and sound design was great. I think the gameplay mechanic was a blast, but was intermittent and the levels didn't work. You found yourself scratching at walls at times, looking for what to do. Sometimes you had a roll going, downhill, slide, jump, slide, jump and then you just got stopped. It sort of got in the way of the fun.

"It was like we couldn't quite decide if we were building Portal or a runner. And I don't think the consumer was ready to switch it up quite that way. You could say it was a sharp and great innovation. I believe that it was. You have to figure out what to do from here if you want it to be a five million seller vs. a one-million unit seller.

"I've had several very lively debates with the dev team. And they are working on it. But there's a couple of different directions you could go.

"You could say: This thing needs to be more traditional. It's first-person game. There's a lot of successful FPS products out there that do really well. We could move in that direction.

"Or [you could say]: This was never about guns. It was about its stark originality. Maybe we can back away from some of those [older] things… and emphasize the smooth play and puzzles and move it toward, if you will, a Portal.

"And they're both valid. Innovation is a lot of times about getting so far, stepping back, assessing and then moving forward. And that's what I'm proud is happening at EA every day."


See that part there where I dropped the bold? That is the part that got my attention.
 
Before I talk about that specifically, I find this interview actually more telling that I initially thought. There is nothing that I admittedly disagree with, but I do find one aspect very interesting. His quote on "innovation" that I'm going to re-post.

 "Innovation doesn't mean it all works the first time," he said. "If it did everyone would do it."  

 In regards to Mirrors Edge, for me this makes my brain wander.
 
 Yeah, this didn't work as well some individuals thought.
 Yeah, this didn't work as well some individuals thought.
For me innovation is not a singular concept, something that cant nailed down or replicated easily with videogames. It's something that should come natural to game design: a new idea. What part of Mirrors Edge was innovative? The mechanics? Running and jumping have been around since forever. The art style? I felt like it was kind of a sad reflection and reminder that games without color seem to flood the current gaming market. The story? Those 2D E-Surance commercial style cutscenes were the butt of jokes, taking literal form at the end of Ryan's video review. The plot was pretty standard shallow-game-popcorn-fare, nothing that was quite memorable.
 
Was Mirrors Edge innovative? Or was it trying to be innovative? Think about that quote from the scary head of EA guy for a second before you jump in.  

Presenting platforming in a first person perspective, a concept that had previously been shunned due to the perspective's limitations. It seemed like a lot of what was Mirrors Edge was, at least from a game play mechanics perspective, counter to the traditional first person game. The game stressed trying to be different on to you. Certain aspects worked wonderfully. The neon color scheme of the city was just awesome, and there are some simply breathtaking moments of escape in the game. 
 
And while mechanics have been done before, there was enough from a presentation perspective, specifically making running and jumping work (for the most part, I'll talk about it's failings in just a bit.) from a first person perspective was more than enough to be deemed "innovative" by me at least. 
 
 

The problems.

 
But Mirrors Edge had a laundry list of problems, some of which the interview touched on. Simply: When you weren't running, you weren't having fun. And even when you were running, Mirrors Edge still had more of it's share of problems. Specific prescission platforming is difficult at first person. 
 
Yes absolutely, even with bright red objects telling you where to go, there were moments of sheer frustration trying to decipher where you were supposed to go due to awkward level design trying to replicate a difficulty. Speaking of difficulty, the combat from a hand-to-hand perspective was either fun or brought you to tears and the moments that the game encouraged you to pick up a gun just bit. Who like's dieing a lot?
 
There were a lot of very specific problems in this game's core design initially. The heart may have been in the right place, but it's execution was faulty being hampered by problems and concepts that don't gel with the goal of this game's design. Speaking of which, what is Mirrors Edge underlying design?
 

Some people shoot guns. I run. . .Bitch.


Making you feel like a bad-ass parkour runner. Not the bad-ass that carries twelve guns, smokes twelve packs a day and like's to say "Fuck" every other line while kick-butting an alien. I'm talking about the bad-ass that is an entity almost similar to that of the fucking wind. A person that can run and dive over the sides of buildings with ease and decimate enemies, who are stupid enough to get in your way from point A to point B, in the same graceful fashion. Running, picking up momentum, hearing the gun shots whizzing behind you and taking out the solider with a single fast one move maneuver, without skipping a beat in regards to your speed. That's Mirrors Edge. 
 
Does gun play belong in Mirrors Edge? Maybe. But not in the manner that one might think. Everything should be focused on speed, including the weapons regarding how you handle them mechanically. Stopping and gunning didn't work the last time, as well it wont the next time because it's counter to what the design is. Unless they change the design. 
 

Fixing the Mirror.


Unless Mirror's Edge 2 has another game plan completely, which is what I think the big debate over where to go regarding this sequel is, for now at least we can start and acknowledge and face it's multiple problems. Through a process of gameplay mechanic adaptation, we can perhaps add some new ideas, we can also take a look at how a sequel can reinvent itself. 
 
A quick run down:
 
You die too often. A combination of either poor level design, or not fine-tuning your mechanics enough, or both, regardless you saw death quite a bit in Mirrors Edge.
 The line between making something fun and challenging is a difficult one to navigate.
 The line between making something fun and challenging is a difficult one to navigate.
It's understandable, your leaping off of bottomless pits, almost all the time. To replicate the danger of Parkour, Faith and risking life and limb go hand in hand. Fun story, Prince of Persia was released roughly the same time as Mirror's Edge. It was blasted a bit for being too easy, yet, it was quite fun and scored quite favorably. Like it or not, there are quite a bit of pro's of at least experimenting in making your game "easy". Look at BioShock. VitaChamber anyone? You need to find a balance. 
 
Make the combat flow with the general mechanics. Mirror's Edge had a bunch of punches and kicks, but nothing was more satisfying than the one button disarm. It makes sense. The effectiveness of Faith's abilities from a mechanic perspective. The rest of the combat felt...well off. There was a trophy to do a wall run/kick to the back of the head that I got, and I only did that to get that trophy. That's not a good application.
 
Go guns or go home? Personally for me, a Mirrors Edge without using guns would make sense. If gunplay is route they wish to take, it needs to be well thought out and addressed. Simply making this game into something akin to a full blown shooter is a bit unsettling unless it was addressed in congress with it's mechanics and themes. 
 
The Story: Fix it. What are in these packages I'm delivering? Why are they important? Why is the government evil? The only thing I see horrible that they have done is making a really clean city. Enough with this ontological metaphorical narrative loops that go nowhere. You can stop and tell me the context and purpose of what I do. It's not that hard. Somewhere between game design and storytelling, I get the feeling sometime designers get freaked over the concept of cut-scenes over interactivity. Whatever works work, just remember your context. Valve stuck Alyx Vance with you in the Halflife episodes to tell you what the hell was going on, Gears of War 2 had a lengthy speech that hit all the necessary points. A goofy animated riot that's put down without any real indication why, against an evil government that likes cameras...Or something... Is not as effective. It wouldn't be bad also to give Faith a personality.
 
Time Trials: Did anyone really get into this? All the achievements associated with Time Trials except for Chapter 1 are considered "Rare" on GiantBomb. There was a few DLC maps that were released latter, did anyone really bite?
 

Expanding.

 
Who likes openworld? From the look of a bunch games recently, I take it a bunch of you do. Would Mirrors Edge benefit from open-world design? I think it could help killing the down time that might eventually appear. I've seen this suggestion a bunch, and I personally like it a bit.
 
So for the guys at DICE. Keep your head leveled, because somewhere within this mess is something awesome. I'm curious to see how the current design division will eventually evolve, until then we can make wild suggestions and proclamations.
 
If Mirror's Edge 2 doesn't have flying pigs I will be deeply disappointed.
 
I fucking mean it: FLYING PIGS! They shoot acid out of their eyes after drinking energy drinks. You gotta hunt them! By throwing Slim Jims at em! They die out of irony!
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#1  Edited By vidiot

A strange, yet understandable combination of work and finals for my classes I think slowed my normal activity here. It's difficult to gauge, all I know is that I have this huge hankering to sit and write...and write....and write...
 
In terms of what game stuff I've been doing: Yup, still with the new computer. I need to get back to the 360 though, as I sorta left my progress in TBOGT to focus on all the crazy new stuff that I've been gaming. 
 
I've been thinking deeply about the year in general. I'm surprised and happy about Sony's new-found momentum over the last year. There was a lot of surprises (and disappointments) this year software wise. Who would have thought that one of the best games this year would star Batman? Yes, yes, it is Batman, but well... I don't think it's controversial to state that the game could have gone either way.
 
I'm going on a tangent. Gotta refocus and... go on another tangent?... 
 
Do you know that Final Fantasy XIII is being released in Japan in only a few days? And over here in only a couple months? I feel weird. It's like when Killzone 2 finally came out, and I'm all like: Wow, it actually exists and stuff.
 

 Vidiot's Brain Dump: Side-effects include running at bright red objects.
 Vidiot's Brain Dump: Side-effects include running at bright red objects.
 

Reflection


The good news is that no matter how overtaken I am from...Life...I'm entrenched enough online to usually keep up to date. One article in particular a few days ago caught my eye and I've been thinking about it ever since in the back of my mind. Specifically an interview with the head of EA John Riccitiello with Kotaku. There were a few things that caught my attention:
  1. There will be a Mirrors Edge 2
  2. Apparently the design of this game is in a serious work in progress.
Interview highlights:
 


 "We're still working through things like how to best deal with Mirror's Edge 2," he said during a Wednesday morning interview in New York. "There are some things we learned about that [first] game. It was, I think, a massively innovative product. To be honest with you, I think it's a game that deserves to come back." 

"Innovation doesn't mean it all works the first time," he said. "If it did everyone would do it."

And that kind of talk brought him back to Mirror's Edge and its future. He got specific about design decisions relevant to the original team at Mirror's Edge DICE and whoever is on the case — he didn't specify DICE or otherwise — who are pondering a sequel:

"I think Mirror's Edge was a fascinatingly original world.Fascinatingly original art direction. Music and sound design was great. I think the gameplay mechanic was a blast, but was intermittent and the levels didn't work. You found yourself scratching at walls at times, looking for what to do. Sometimes you had a roll going, downhill, slide, jump, slide, jump and then you just got stopped. It sort of got in the way of the fun.

"It was like we couldn't quite decide if we were building Portal or a runner. And I don't think the consumer was ready to switch it up quite that way. You could say it was a sharp and great innovation. I believe that it was. You have to figure out what to do from here if you want it to be a five million seller vs. a one-million unit seller.

"I've had several very lively debates with the dev team. And they are working on it. But there's a couple of different directions you could go.

"You could say: This thing needs to be more traditional. It's first-person game. There's a lot of successful FPS products out there that do really well. We could move in that direction.

"Or [you could say]: This was never about guns. It was about its stark originality. Maybe we can back away from some of those [older] things… and emphasize the smooth play and puzzles and move it toward, if you will, a Portal.

"And they're both valid. Innovation is a lot of times about getting so far, stepping back, assessing and then moving forward. And that's what I'm proud is happening at EA every day."


See that part there where I dropped the bold? That is the part that got my attention.
 
Before I talk about that specifically, I find this interview actually more telling that I initially thought. There is nothing that I admittedly disagree with, but I do find one aspect very interesting. His quote on "innovation" that I'm going to re-post.

 "Innovation doesn't mean it all works the first time," he said. "If it did everyone would do it."  

 In regards to Mirrors Edge, for me this makes my brain wander.
 
 Yeah, this didn't work as well some individuals thought.
 Yeah, this didn't work as well some individuals thought.
For me innovation is not a singular concept, something that cant nailed down or replicated easily with videogames. It's something that should come natural to game design: a new idea. What part of Mirrors Edge was innovative? The mechanics? Running and jumping have been around since forever. The art style? I felt like it was kind of a sad reflection and reminder that games without color seem to flood the current gaming market. The story? Those 2D E-Surance commercial style cutscenes were the butt of jokes, taking literal form at the end of Ryan's video review. The plot was pretty standard shallow-game-popcorn-fare, nothing that was quite memorable.
 
Was Mirrors Edge innovative? Or was it trying to be innovative? Think about that quote from the scary head of EA guy for a second before you jump in.  

Presenting platforming in a first person perspective, a concept that had previously been shunned due to the perspective's limitations. It seemed like a lot of what was Mirrors Edge was, at least from a game play mechanics perspective, counter to the traditional first person game. The game stressed trying to be different on to you. Certain aspects worked wonderfully. The neon color scheme of the city was just awesome, and there are some simply breathtaking moments of escape in the game. 
 
And while mechanics have been done before, there was enough from a presentation perspective, specifically making running and jumping work (for the most part, I'll talk about it's failings in just a bit.) from a first person perspective was more than enough to be deemed "innovative" by me at least. 
 
 

The problems.

 
But Mirrors Edge had a laundry list of problems, some of which the interview touched on. Simply: When you weren't running, you weren't having fun. And even when you were running, Mirrors Edge still had more of it's share of problems. Specific prescission platforming is difficult at first person. 
 
Yes absolutely, even with bright red objects telling you where to go, there were moments of sheer frustration trying to decipher where you were supposed to go due to awkward level design trying to replicate a difficulty. Speaking of difficulty, the combat from a hand-to-hand perspective was either fun or brought you to tears and the moments that the game encouraged you to pick up a gun just bit. Who like's dieing a lot?
 
There were a lot of very specific problems in this game's core design initially. The heart may have been in the right place, but it's execution was faulty being hampered by problems and concepts that don't gel with the goal of this game's design. Speaking of which, what is Mirrors Edge underlying design?
 

Some people shoot guns. I run. . .Bitch.


Making you feel like a bad-ass parkour runner. Not the bad-ass that carries twelve guns, smokes twelve packs a day and like's to say "Fuck" every other line while kick-butting an alien. I'm talking about the bad-ass that is an entity almost similar to that of the fucking wind. A person that can run and dive over the sides of buildings with ease and decimate enemies, who are stupid enough to get in your way from point A to point B, in the same graceful fashion. Running, picking up momentum, hearing the gun shots whizzing behind you and taking out the solider with a single fast one move maneuver, without skipping a beat in regards to your speed. That's Mirrors Edge. 
 
Does gun play belong in Mirrors Edge? Maybe. But not in the manner that one might think. Everything should be focused on speed, including the weapons regarding how you handle them mechanically. Stopping and gunning didn't work the last time, as well it wont the next time because it's counter to what the design is. Unless they change the design. 
 

Fixing the Mirror.


Unless Mirror's Edge 2 has another game plan completely, which is what I think the big debate over where to go regarding this sequel is, for now at least we can start and acknowledge and face it's multiple problems. Through a process of gameplay mechanic adaptation, we can perhaps add some new ideas, we can also take a look at how a sequel can reinvent itself. 
 
A quick run down:
 
You die too often. A combination of either poor level design, or not fine-tuning your mechanics enough, or both, regardless you saw death quite a bit in Mirrors Edge.
 The line between making something fun and challenging is a difficult one to navigate.
 The line between making something fun and challenging is a difficult one to navigate.
It's understandable, your leaping off of bottomless pits, almost all the time. To replicate the danger of Parkour, Faith and risking life and limb go hand in hand. Fun story, Prince of Persia was released roughly the same time as Mirror's Edge. It was blasted a bit for being too easy, yet, it was quite fun and scored quite favorably. Like it or not, there are quite a bit of pro's of at least experimenting in making your game "easy". Look at BioShock. VitaChamber anyone? You need to find a balance. 
 
Make the combat flow with the general mechanics. Mirror's Edge had a bunch of punches and kicks, but nothing was more satisfying than the one button disarm. It makes sense. The effectiveness of Faith's abilities from a mechanic perspective. The rest of the combat felt...well off. There was a trophy to do a wall run/kick to the back of the head that I got, and I only did that to get that trophy. That's not a good application.
 
Go guns or go home? Personally for me, a Mirrors Edge without using guns would make sense. If gunplay is route they wish to take, it needs to be well thought out and addressed. Simply making this game into something akin to a full blown shooter is a bit unsettling unless it was addressed in congress with it's mechanics and themes. 
 
The Story: Fix it. What are in these packages I'm delivering? Why are they important? Why is the government evil? The only thing I see horrible that they have done is making a really clean city. Enough with this ontological metaphorical narrative loops that go nowhere. You can stop and tell me the context and purpose of what I do. It's not that hard. Somewhere between game design and storytelling, I get the feeling sometime designers get freaked over the concept of cut-scenes over interactivity. Whatever works work, just remember your context. Valve stuck Alyx Vance with you in the Halflife episodes to tell you what the hell was going on, Gears of War 2 had a lengthy speech that hit all the necessary points. A goofy animated riot that's put down without any real indication why, against an evil government that likes cameras...Or something... Is not as effective. It wouldn't be bad also to give Faith a personality.
 
Time Trials: Did anyone really get into this? All the achievements associated with Time Trials except for Chapter 1 are considered "Rare" on GiantBomb. There was a few DLC maps that were released latter, did anyone really bite?
 

Expanding.

 
Who likes openworld? From the look of a bunch games recently, I take it a bunch of you do. Would Mirrors Edge benefit from open-world design? I think it could help killing the down time that might eventually appear. I've seen this suggestion a bunch, and I personally like it a bit.
 
So for the guys at DICE. Keep your head leveled, because somewhere within this mess is something awesome. I'm curious to see how the current design division will eventually evolve, until then we can make wild suggestions and proclamations.
 
If Mirror's Edge 2 doesn't have flying pigs I will be deeply disappointed.
 
I fucking mean it: FLYING PIGS! They shoot acid out of their eyes after drinking energy drinks. You gotta hunt them! By throwing Slim Jims at em! They die out of irony!
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Symphony

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#2  Edited By Symphony

Good read and suggestions. I enjoyed disarming guys and slamming them in the face with their shotgun but honestly, I felt Faith should have just chucked the weapon aside at that point and moved on, not having the option to use it.  Shooting really isn't needed in the game (as proven by the fact I have the achievement for finishing the game without shooting anyone, neener) and hopefully doesn't show up again in the 2nd one.
 
Fixing the story would be great. And yeah Time Trials were something I think I touched once then ignored, MW2 Spec Ops would make for a perfect fit as a secondary mode in Mirror's Edge 2, in my opinion -- make it from point A to point B without alerting the cops, find X number of bags and survive to the delivery point, get from point a to b in a certain amount of time, etc etc. There's tons of different challenges they could have.

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#3  Edited By Hot_Karl

Ab-so-lute-ly correct. Every single thing that you listed as a problem with the original game, those were the exact faults I had with the game. The poor level design, the lame fighting mechanics, the frustrating gameplay, the weak story- I wanted to like Mirror's Edge so much, but for every one or two things it did right, it did something else completely wrong.
 
One thing I would like to see (that might make the game impossible in scope) would be making the game's routes far less linear. I found that there was pretty much only one right way to go through a level, and the game, instead of rewarding you for using your creativity in order to find a new route, instead punished you from veering off the beaten path by having said path filled with unstoppable enemies or unreachable plateaus. This was my biggest gripe about the game. It frustrated me to no end.
 
What's great about there being a Mirror's Edge 2 is that all these problems in the first game can be easily identified and fixed for the next one. There's a rock solid idea & concept behind this game, it's just muddled underneath a bunch of poor design choices.

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StaticFalconar

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#4  Edited By StaticFalconar

Mirror's edge to me was like Portal. 
 
Sure, it rests on one giimmick, but its a fun one. I totally don't mind dieing a lot since I also died a lot in mario trying to make a jump. 
 
 
Forget the guns, and perhaps give me a somewhat better story. 
 
Mirror's edge should be treated like a puzzle game in the same vain that Portal was as well. The difficulty setting should indeed be based on how creative you are in using the objects around you. 
 
If they do indeed turn it more into a traditional FPS game, I wouldn't be interested in ME2 then.

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#5  Edited By dethfish

Sometimes I feel I'm the only person who really liked Mirrors Edge. The things I think that could make it better would be a better story and cut scenes. The story was pretty bad in the first game and so were the characters. I didn't really give a shit about anything that was happening, I just wanted to jump across rooftops some more. 
 
Having NO GUNS would be nice too. I'm not sure if guns should be completely removed from the game, like maybe enemies can still have them, but I think the player shouldn't be able to use them. It was much more fun to sprint towards an enemy and kick them in the face than just shoot them. I would also like to see more enemies who just chase you. I thought those parts were awesome.

Something that helps guide players better through levels could also help. Maybe just a big fat arrow at the top of the screen.
 
As for the time trials, I was pretty hooked on them for a while. It was frustrating when I couldn't do it right but so awesome when I nailed it, which kind of sums up all of Mirrors Edge for me actually. I never bought the DLC though.

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#6  Edited By OhdK

You're not alone Dethfish, I really loved Mirrors Edge. Despite all the valid problems, running is still fun, and although the story didn't really take full advantage of the world, I still found the entire surreal, saturated, lonely atmosphere on rooftops to be completely intoxicating. There's nothing like that anywhere on the market. It reminds me of lounging alone behind the school on sunny afternoons.  This was accentuated by the great, chill music.
 
Those were my favorite parts of the whole enterprise. As long as they keep the atmosphere and the wonderful sense of momentum, I'm sold for ME 2 (that always makes me think of Mass Effect)

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#7  Edited By Meowayne

As bearer of the "Test of Faith" achievement for that game, I don't think it needs any fixing. Maybe introduce a rewind-button for people to stop whining.

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#8  Edited By Linkyshinks

"The art style? I felt like it was kind of a sad reflection and reminder that games without color seem to flood the current gaming market."    


 It was unnervingly clean and void of colour because the developers wanted to imply the society below was almost puritanical, and that it came at a cost.     
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Meowayne

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#9  Edited By Meowayne

I thought it was beautiful. Interesting how differently these things can be perceived. 
Portal was "unnervingly clean". Mirror's Edge? Beautiful.

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#10  Edited By GunstarRed

I think it needed a tiny bit of auto-grab a little like Assassins creed because I found a lot of my deaths came from jumping to a ledge (or usually a pole) and missing it by a fraction of an inch only to watch myself fall past it for a few seconds to my death... there should be a kind of save-grab button. 
 
there were some weird switching surfaces moments that were a little frustrating also... I knew where to go but doing it just felt fiddly and awkward. two sequences stand out jumping across some poles under the trains to a switch and in the mall where you have to wallrun-swing and then jump over to a vent under a hail of gunfire. both of these points made me want to give up. I never trusted the wallrun , I always felt I was going to undershoot my target and when things went right It felt more like luck than skill. 
 
I also liked the shooting, the idea of it anyway. I had a lot more fun using the guns on my hard playthrough than my no-gun playthrough on normal a little bit of momentum after disarming enemies going into shooting would have been pretty awesome as those sections always felt a little run-shoot-run-shoot.
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#11  Edited By emkeighcameron

The single, biggest problem I had with Mirror's Edge was that when I finally survived a particularly difficult section, or finally traversed a particularly nasty set of jumps, I WOULDN'T KNOW WHAT I DID DIFFERENTLY from the other 9,352 times I had tried it.
 
You raise a lot of good points, and I hope the MiE2 improves on its predecessor in these ways. Mirror's Edge was one of those games that could have been so god-damn awesome, if only it had been fine-tuned more. 

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vidiot

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#12  Edited By vidiot

I have to dive in before I sleep. Curse all of you. 2:38 AM, stupid time with it's going forward and stuff. *grumble*grumble*grumble*
 
@Meowayne said:

" Maybe introduce a rewind-button for people to stop whining. "

Clarification: "Whining" is when I type a thread that consists of all caps and provide no reasons for my opinions, let alone offer suggestions. Now it's almost 3 in the morning! *grumble*grumble*grumble*
 
@Linkyshinks said:

"

"The art style? I felt like it was kind of a sad reflection and reminder that games without color seem to flood the current gaming market."    


 It was unnervingly clean and void of colour because the developers wanted to imply the society below was almost puritanical, and that it came at a cost.      "

I'm not disagreeing, that's exactly contextually in the narrative how it's supposed to be perceived. But it never gelled with me at all: So it's clean, bright and not dirty, what "cost" has transpired here? Given were not shown much in terms of reasons for why the government is bad, we have to rely on the ambiguous (not a bad thing if used correctly.) and even this is not as clear as it should. In terms of conveying narrative: This could be better.
 
I would also like to include that I personally liked the art style. Referring to the lack of color in games hearkens back to a previous blog post in which I praised Uncharted 2 and it's use of a color palate.
  
@Dethfish77 said:

"Maybe just a big fat arrow at the top of the screen.  As for the time trials, I was pretty hooked on them for a while. It was frustrating when I couldn't do it right but so awesome when I nailed it, which kind of sums up all of Mirrors Edge for me actually. I never bought the DLC though. "

Funny thing regarding the arrow, I remember some interviews a while back before the game was released in which they considered Mirrors Edge similar to that of a racing game. While it would be kinda intrusive, I think a better way of navigating you around would be great.
 
@marioncobretti said:

" I think it needed a tiny bit of auto-grab a little like Asssassins creed because I found a lot of my deaths came from jumping to a ledge (or usually a pole) and missing it by a fraction of an inch only to watch myself fall past it for a few seconds to my death... there should be a kind of save-grab button. 

Not a bad idea by any means, I think at least an option to turn on or off would be appreciated. 
 
@VinceNotVance said:

"One thing I would like to see (that might make the game impossible in scope) would be making the game's routes far less linear. I found that there was pretty much only one right way to go through a level, and the game, instead of rewarding you for using your creativity in order to find a new route, instead punished you from veering off the beaten path by having said path filled with unstoppable enemies or unreachable plateaus. This was my biggest gripe about the game. It frustrated me to no end."

I've heard "open world" be used a lot in comments all over online. I like the idea of a nonlinear design routine, you saw a bit, and I do mean a "bit", of that in the game but not in the slightest in regards to branching paths which I think would be interesting.
 
@Symphony said:

"Fixing the story would be great. And yeah Time Trials were something I think I touched once then ignored, MW2 Spec Ops would make for a perfect fit as a secondary mode in Mirror's Edge 2, in my opinion -- make it from point A to point B without alerting the cops, find X number of bags and survive to the delivery point, get from point a to b in a certain amount of time, etc etc. There's tons of different challenges they could have. "

There are a ton of different ideas one can have, regarding sticking a mode in to not get you the full amount of achievements in a game :P
Yeah, that Spec Ops idea sounds awesome, especially if it was Co-Op. I didn't touch on multiplayer here, but I can see some form of it or another perhaps happening. 
 
Oh, and before I go for the night:
@Symphony said:

"Shooting really isn't needed in the game (as proven by the fact I have the achievement for finishing the game without shooting anyone, neener) 

@Meowayne said:

" As bearer of the "Test of Faith" achievement for that game, I don't think it needs any fixing.


@marioncobretti said:

"I had a lot more fun using the guns on my hard playthrough than my no-gun playthrough on normal a little bit of momentum after disarming enemies going into shooting would have been pretty awesome as those sections always felt a little run-shoot-run-shoot. "

 


Test of Faith
40 points
Complete the game without shooting an enemy
0 comments
Mirror's Edge
April 2, 2009
I AM SPECIAL TOO!!!
 
/sleeps on keyboard.
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Whisperkill

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#14  Edited By Whisperkill

What makes you think the level design is poor? I thought it was rather good. 
 
I bought the DLC and also played the timetrials
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Hamst3r

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#15  Edited By Hamst3r
@Whisperkill: I found the levels to be quite good as well, though there were a few sections where I got hopelessly lost for at least 10 or 20 minutes. One of those was the Atrium. A friend brought over the 360 version and we couldn't figure out how to get off the ground level, even with the Runner Vision stuff on. On my own play through later I had Runner Vision off and it wasn't too bad overall, but there were still some weird spots where things just didn't make any sense.
 
One level design type issue was the doors on the rooftops. IIRC, you couldn't run up the walls if there was a closed door there. Doesn't make any sense to me. It's a solid surface and it's not like the door is all that inset from the wall. It just looks like another flat surface to run up, but it doesn't work. So before I learned that, I figured I just couldn't run up those particular walls.
 
Another weird one is on the first stage when you make your first jump across a gap and grab onto the pipe on the wall. There are two pipes. I couldn't grab onto the higher one on the left. I had to aim for the lower one on the right. The thing is, the left one looks absolutely reachable. It's like you hit it by jumping at it, but because you're not supposed to do it that way, you just slide off. I retried it several times and couldn't, yet it totally looks like you can. There were a few spots like that.
 
Oh, I think I got lost in the warehouse area too, but whatever.
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#16  Edited By Emilio

Some ideas:  
 
1. Remove all use of weapons 
2. Remove animated cut scenes 
3. Remove whatever story the game had ( didn't pay attention, only wanted to run around ) 
4. Remove quicktime events ( at that first boss or whatever, I gave up and never finished the game )

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#17  Edited By Binman88

The only problems I had with the game stemmed from the inclusion of some frustrating combat, especially that one section about three quarters of the way through the game in a warehouse with about 5 guys shooting at you. Apart from that, I loved almost everything else about the game. I don't quite see why navigating the levels was so hard for some people.

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#18  Edited By vidiot
@Hamst3r said:
" @Whisperkill: I found the levels to be quite good as well, though there were a few sections where I got hopelessly lost for at least 10 or 20 minutes. One of those was the Atrium. A friend brought over the 360 version and we couldn't figure out how to get off the ground level, even with the Runner Vision stuff on. On my own play through later I had Runner Vision off and it wasn't too bad overall, but there were still some weird spots where things just didn't make any sense. One level design type issue was the doors on the rooftops. IIRC, you couldn't run up the walls if there was a closed door there. Doesn't make any sense to me. It's a solid surface and it's not like the door is all that inset from the wall. It just looks like another flat surface to run up, but it doesn't work. So before I learned that, I figured I just couldn't run up those particular walls. Another weird one is on the first stage when you make your first jump across a gap and grab onto the pipe on the wall. There are two pipes. I couldn't grab onto the higher one on the left. I had to aim for the lower one on the right. The thing is, the left one looks absolutely reachable. It's like you hit it by jumping at it, but because you're not supposed to do it that way, you just slide off. I retried it several times and couldn't, yet it totally looks like you can. There were a few spots like that.  Oh, I think I got lost in the warehouse area too, but whatever. "
*wakes from keyboard*
 
That's bad design. There are moments of sure brilliance in this game, where it's quite clear in terms of the direction your supposed to go, as well as great presentation of being chased. It is not consistent, and when it does break down, it breaks down hard. I too had a similar problem when I brought the game over to a friends and we all took turns simply trying to get out of an area, finally resorting to looking up a solution online. It was pretty ludicrous. Play-testing can curb this problem. Pushing the character in the right direction is quite a complicated feat, and it is more difficult than some people may realize. There were a few commentary tracks from HL2 Episode 2 that dealt with this problem, trying to simply make something happen and suggesting to the player that they should look, and walk, in this general direction. 
 
I assumed in the blog, the reasoning for such moments of confusion was to imply a difficulty. Was exploration a part of Mirrors Edge's design? This problem was not just shared by me, you and scary-face-head of EA. The reason why he cited it in the interview was that it was a common problem with reviewers. This can be something that can be fixed.
 
Which is great, because as a lot of people have said here: There is quite the room for fixing stuff, it's quite doable. The suggestions here so far don't sound far fetched at all, I would like to see Mirrors Edge turn into a viable franchise.