Yet Another Highschool Shooting

School shootings are horrible, and as much as i love Americans (just like any people) I can't help but wonder why does it constantly have these kinds of attacks as if its some backwater middle-eastern country! I guess its the same thing that happened to GB-there's a lot of people, so there's a lost a-holes who go around with guns saying its their right. Sorry to hear it though :(

Some decent parenting and schooling would take care of this in no time. Sometimes I think the government wants the school system so stupid and broken that kids will want to bring guns in, so they can step in and take more of our rights away.
 
It all makes sense now... It alllllll makes sense...

This is when the next day that GTA is on the front cover saying how video games made this happen, I think thats what happended with the columbine incident too.

@phrali: Those analogies are terrible.

@WaylonJennings: I really liked your post. When you compare the U.S. to other countries that have about equal access to firearms, it just shows that the U.S. has an issue with violence that is arising from our culture.

I go out to the shooting range about once a month and maintain my proficiency. I'll be picking up a gun for private carry (probably a CZ-75 Compact 9mm) and getting my license in the fall.

We shouldn't be making this tragedy about gun control (although it does play a part), instead, we should be thinking about all the other types of prevention that could have been used here.

@Turambar said:

http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/sheriff-shooting-ohio-school-victims-unknown-15799648#.T0wSa_Wibao The shooter injured 5 students before being chased from school grounds, and unfortunately one has died in the hospital since then. The other 4 are fortunately in stable condition. I heard it over the radio on my way to my student teaching session at a middle school, and bringing it up at the beginning of homeroom lead to quite a discussion.

what about the Elementary school shooting in bremerton, wa about a third grader shooting a girl in the stomach?

@LordXavierBritish said:

@Stonyman65 said:

@Demoskinos said:

@Animasta: The argument isn't that it "wouldn't happen" but if there were personnel who had access to firearms the shooter could be gunned down and lives saved. If only the shooter has a gun more people are going to die before he is stopped. People are going to have guns regardless. The only way to defend yourself from guns is with guns. Fight fire with fire and all that jazz.

And that is exactly why so many shootings and mass murders happen in Gun Free Zones or Weapon Free Zones - it's basically a sign that says "Come kill us, we can't do anything about it"

Try doing that shit in the middle of a Police station or a gun store where there are a shit load of armed people. Never happens. Why? Because the first person who tries something gets killed.

Who the fuck would try to shoot up a police station.

The Terminator

@Fajita_Jim: So your saying every time I take a piss, Im wasting ammunition? What have I done...

@eugenesaxe said:

@MasturbatingestBear said:

I will never understand how someone can defend possession of guns in this day.

Here's the kicker: I love engaging gun nuts on this topic. I once posted: Give me one common-sense reason to not tighten gun laws, and you can't use the Constitution. I got exactly zero replies. Pretty much says it all.

You will never, ever get rid of every gun, and if you made it illegal, then people would just have to hide it. How does that help in any way shape or form? Also, the vast, VAST majority of gun crimes are commited with an illegal gun, so there's very, very little evidence that legal gun ownership is a major factor in gun crime - it's an extremely small one at best.

Also I'm not a gun nut. I live in Canada and I'm happy they aren't legal here. There's just flaws in this argument.

@Vinny_Says: you would be surprised

Improving Gunlaws is fine and dandy but it doesn't change the fact that the people that do this didn't buy the gun, or have the permit. outlawing crap don't really seem to work, it just makes things harder for the normal person. "puff puff" but if there is a market someone will sell it. but alas, this isn't a gun argument thread.

It's sad to hear about the kid dying, and the others that were hurt in the shooting. I also feel sorry for the kid who felt he was driven to this, some people are troubled its part of the human condition. I'll agree with the person above that says the biggest issue is the school system. High school sucks for most, specially the "stereotypical" nerd person that this site caters too.

@Sackmanjones said:

People fucking suck

Hell is other people

@jking47 said:

@coakroach said:

I dont know why these discussions always revolve around gun control law.

I want to know why a teenager entered such a disturbed mental state that he decided that his best option was to go on a murder spree at his own high school.

This tbh, its the real issue at hand. Even if he could not get access to guns, its not hard to find/build something dangerous.

But the effort involved is often much more and would be a deterrent

I guess the human mind is built for conflict, we have always been fighting wars against other people as long as history has been recorded.

Now when we don't send everyone to war and we get psychologically stressed more and more by how modern society works, I guess some people ends up needing to end the conflict and guns are an effective way to do that.

Hell, sometimes I have wanted to just take a gun to school - but I'm too socially polite to do that - and here in Denmark it isn't as easy to get a gun anyway...

@Demoskinos said:

@phrali: Yes, your logic is fucking retarded. I agree. The base issue here is people murdering people which has happened since the dawn of fucking time and will continue until our species dies off the choice of weapon is irrelevant. There are laws in place against murdering people. Also, what part of banning guns makes gun violence worse do you not understand? Seriously. There is research out there go read it. I'm not pulling these statistics out of my ass 40% jump in the UK for armed robberies AFTER guns were banned.

There are plenty of law abiding citizens who own guns and don't go on killing sprees. Again, guns don't kill people. People kill people. But this logic won't sink in because people who have irrational fear of guns never listen or care to listen. GUNS EVIL DURRRR DURRR. Nice caveman logic.

Irrational fear of some equipment that makes it much easier to kill other people?

It is much easier to stop a dude with a hammer or a knife, than a dude with a ranged weapon.

We are a tool using species. Of course you have to consider the tools we use.

Ease is the issue with guns; ease of access and ease of use (at least to fire, probs not to aim).

And statistics do not count for shit because the way they are presented is so easy to manipulate. All you have to do is pick the statistic that suits your agenda and obfuscate all the others that don't. You can t possibly explain the effects of such a far reaching nation wide decision with one number. Societal models aren't that simplistic.

Another shooting, and what's the first post? Random gun control blabber. Surprise.

Clearly this has nothing to do with videogames, cause if that guy had been a proper gamer, he'd had have a higher K/D than 1 in 5...

I don't care about someone keeping guns in their home or something, what bothers me is the fact that you can carry handguns in public. What the fuck is that? I'm never going to the United States...that shit creeps me right out.

Either way, people need to look at fixing the school system that let the kid become that unhinged rather than bitch about politics. I think we need to give teachers more authority to curb bullying. Something more than detention needs to happen.

Pertinent. The coverage of these shootings is always atrocious.

You could blame video games, or you could blame how easy it is for kids to get a hand on a firearm. Over here we have fist fights at schools...

@allworkandlowpay said:

Another shooting, and what's the first post? Random gun control blabber. Surprise.

A shooting at a school should defiently provoke for better gun conrol "blabber". Guns arent cool its such a pussy weapon try hunting a boar with a knife instead of from a safe distance.

@MonetaryDread said:

@MasturbatingestBear said:

I will never understand how someone can defend possession of guns in this day.

Easy. I like to hunt instead of paying for grossly overpriced meat from the supermarket. At the local meat shop a 6 ounce steak of White Tailed Elk costs almost $10, I hunted one myself, took it to a butcher, and then I had something like 80 pounds of meat in my freezer.

Plus, eating meat that you hunted yourself just makes you feel more satisfied, it is like it triggers some primal response hidden in our monkey - hunter-gatherer DNA.

Then you have to look at the societal reasons as to why there are so many deaths. In the USA there were 10.27 firearm related deaths per 100,000 citizens and 4.4 of those were homicides. Yet in Canada ( a nation with a higher percentage of gun owners), there were 4.78 gun deaths per 100,000 citizens and .78 of those were homicides. Most other gun deaths in both nations were suicides, and those people were probably going to kill themselves anyways, guns were just the method they chose.

How much does it cost for ammunition and weapons? hunting license? energy and time investment?

I am if u practiced enough, a bow and arrow would be just as effective in your hunt. If its also about hunting, then wouldnt u get more reward and satisfaction with that instead?

@Stonyman65: So maybe America should invest in bullet proof vest for everyone, bullet proof glass? Maybe train teachers to disarm and take down those students? I mean if u cant stop the problem, protect everyone as best u can? Of course i already realize that what i suggested probably wont work and could be abused, like local gangs might farm out vests for themselves.

@Turambar said:

@Napalm said:

Hey guys, I know what will fix this: a better education system. Seriously. It's beep in the dumper for twenty years.

If you want to turn back time and change the past so that teachers weren't completely stripped of their role as a disciplinary figure, then be my guest. Schools can preach about how bullying is bad, but any actual behavior changing policy will have to come from the parents as they demanded sole ownership of that role.

What... the fuck are you talking about? I said the education system. Better teachers, better material.

@MasturbatingestBear said:

I will never understand how someone can defend possession of guns in this day.

Better get rid of knives, axes, bows and a hundred other items that can easily be used to kill. Not to mention the fact that a quick internet search can yield information on how to (a) build your own gun or (b) build your own bomb.

Every time one of these shootings happens, people pop up and want to blame the weapon used. How about we take a look at what our society is doing to push these kids down this path? I am not making excuses for these killers, but these kids are hurting and no one around them notices or cares. That is a far more serious problem in my eyes than people having access to guns. If the kids brought an axe to school and started chopping, would people still focus on the weapon?

For the record, I am not a gun person, but I know plenty of gun owners and none of them have ever shot anyone.

@jerseyscum said:

All the other kids with the pumped up kicks,You better run, better run, outrun my gun!

All the other kids with the pumped up kicks,You better run, better run, faster than my bullet!

This.

@super2j said:

@Stonyman65: So maybe America should invest in bullet proof vest for everyone, bullet proof glass? Maybe train teachers to disarm and take down those students? I mean if u cant stop the problem, protect everyone as best u can? Of course i already realize that what i suggested probably wont work and could be abused, like local gangs might farm out vests for themselves.

Bulletproof vests and the like would be unrealistic (and illegal since only Law Enforcement/Military are allowed to have them), but other than that the training would be a great idea. If more people knew how to defend and take care of themselves, the world would be a safer place. The problem is that people have become so reliant on the powers that be to help them that when they can't get help things break down. The whole protectionist culture that has formed is really causing problems. People need to learn how to take care of themselves.

@Pinworm45 said:

@eugenesaxe said:

@MasturbatingestBear said:

I will never understand how someone can defend possession of guns in this day.

Here's the kicker: I love engaging gun nuts on this topic. I once posted: Give me one common-sense reason to not tighten gun laws, and you can't use the Constitution. I got exactly zero replies. Pretty much says it all.

You will never, ever get rid of every gun, and if you made it illegal, then people would just have to hide it. How does that help in any way shape or form? Also, the vast, VAST majority of gun crimes are commited with an illegal gun, so there's very, very little evidence that legal gun ownership is a major factor in gun crime - it's an extremely small one at best.

Also I'm not a gun nut. I live in Canada and I'm happy they aren't legal here. There's just flaws in this argument.

Do you know where the illegal guns come from? People buying them legally and selling them to the bad guys (happens every day in every state). People breaking into a legal owner's house and stealing them (buying that gun for personal protection doesn'r help much when burglars normally only hit homes where nobody's in at the time, but it sure makes a nice lil bonus for the robber). People buying them illegally from a legal gun dealer.

Reduce the methods illegal guns are obtained. Drastically reduce the number of "legal" owners and the conditions under which they can apply for/obtain licenses. Stiff mandatory sentences for possession of an illegal weapon, like 30 years and no early out for possession, life if possession during a felony. Sure, there's no perfect answer, but treating illegal handguns as a bigger threat than pot would be a good start.

Every point so far has been moot. You know how you stop this shit from happening?

BEING A GOOD FUCKING PARENT YOU FUCKING IDIOTS.

@Sooty: Obviously you are ignorant to the statistical changes in armed robbery and shootings that happened after the UK, Australia banned weapons. Maybe you should do a little research, inform yourself a bit. Shootings went UP.....

Uh, not about gun control.

A third student has died. Two are in the hospital still, one in critical condition.

@Sooty: Obviously you are ignorant to the statistical changes in armed robbery and shootings that happened after the UK, Australia banned weapons. Maybe you should do a little research, inform yourself a bit. Shootings went UP.....

@MasturbatingestBear said:

I will never understand how someone can defend possession of guns in this day.

Better get rid of knives, axes, bows and a hundred other items that can easily be used to kill. Not to mention the fact that a quick internet search can yield information on how to (a) build your own gun or (b) build your own bomb.

@Sooty said:

@c0kemusheen said:

@Sooty: Obviously you are ignorant to the statistical changes in armed robbery and shootings that happened after the UK, Australia banned weapons. Maybe you should do a little research, inform yourself a bit. Shootings went UP.....

If you don't think school shootings would happen less if guns were difficult to acquire then I don't really know what to say to you people. The fact is, the average person can easily get a gun in America. In other countries this is simply not the case and it will of course contribute to crime. Edit: Also, firearm crime stats in the UK usually include airsoft guns.

If you think controlling guns will ever work, your an idiot, also, raise your fuck face kids right and there wont be issues. I'm tired of people blaming the fact that guns are around, and they don't have the balls to say, you failed as a parent, and now your kid is killing my kid, thanks dicks.

@Sooty said:

@c0kemusheen said:

@Sooty: Obviously you are ignorant to the statistical changes in armed robbery and shootings that happened after the UK, Australia banned weapons. Maybe you should do a little research, inform yourself a bit. Shootings went UP.....

If you don't think school shootings would happen less if guns were difficult to acquire then I don't really know what to say to you people. The fact is, the average person can easily get a gun in America. In other countries this is simply not the case and it will of course contribute to crime. Edit: Also, firearm crime stats in the UK usually include airsoft guns.

If you think controlling guns will ever work, your an idiot

@Sooty: What will change that fact is BETTER PARENTS not failing at controlling guns.

@Sooty: What will change that fact is BETTER PARENTS not failing at controlling guns.

@Sooty: Yet again, BETTER PARENTS stops crazies from day one. Also, what proof do you have of this fabled "gun control" doing anything other than taking guns away from people who are law abiding and insuring only criminals have them?

@MasturbatingestBear: i think any body who wants one should be able to get a gun the trick is just make ammo like $1000 per bullet and that way you no they probably deserved it

@Sooty said:

Controlling guns still helps stop the crazies from easily initiating a massacre. I'm leaving it at that. I have nothing else to add here, saying guns aren't a key factor in this is retarded. There's people that have awful parents in the UK but you don't hear about 5+ school shootings every year there do you? No, you don't. I wonder why.

Your an idiot for thinking guns are the issue here. People are the issue. If they don't have guns they will use what ever they can, chainsaws axes swords knifes cars poison etc. I've had access to guns from the second grade till now. I was picked on for being white, etc. Did I go and shoot my school up even though I would of loved to ( I hate racist people ) No. Why? Because I was raised right. There are always signs of this shit before hand and they are missed by neglectful parents. This isn't some fucking fairytale, this is the real world. Bad people are out there and they do what the fuck they want. They WILL find a way to kill people. Guns are just an easy way to do it. Taking guns away wouldn't work in the first place in the USA, and it clearly didn't work in the UK because by some fucking grace of god criminals still have GUNS. If you could find me a place in the world where the ban worked I'd be all for it.

But the other issue is this. Idiots with cars kill people. Lets take those away from everyone. Idiots who get drunk are violent, lets ban alcohol. Do you get my point? I never said guns aren't a key factor, I said its a MOOT fucking point. If your child is raised right in the first place. Suddenly guns aren't an issue are they? If parents cared enough about raising a child and not about the god damned fucking world around them they would see their sons and daughters look in their eye before they go to school to kill. Its not rocket science. Idiots are the problem.

People should get licensed to have a fucking child. That way idiots wouldn't breed killers into the world.

The problem is, America runs on fear.

Just watch Fox news. If HALF of what they said was true, it wouldn't be safe to even look out your window. The problem is, people buy into the crap they try to peddle, and you end up with people who are so afraid of their own shadow that they're willing to recklessly kill another person. See, they NEED guns because what if a crazy rapist invades their home and tries to steal their guns? Never mind that that's never happened to them or anyone they know, Fox news said it happened to a lady a few years ago, so they MUST be next! These people barely leave their own house let alone go out and mingle with people that don't exist within their own tiny communities. They never realize that the vast majority of people out there are just like them, and not insane murderers/rapists/robbers.

Plus these people are delusional. They always think that if they were ever in a situation where it would be necessary to use a firearm, they're going to magically turn into The Punisher, but the fact is, they're pussies. Hell, why do you think they think they need a gun for protection in the first place? Never mind the fact that shooting at a paper target is MUCH easier than shooting a human, physically and mentally.

So you have kids raised by these frightened morons, and since kids are very perceptive, they become neurotic. Combine that with their parents suggesting to them that it's okay to murder people to defend yourself from people you perceive as threats, and it becomes easy to see why kids snap and bring their parents guns to school to kill the people who harass them.

Also, what's with gun nuts having weird torture fetishes? They're always daydreaming about people coming to try to torture and rape them to death. I never think about what I would do in that situation because it's so incredibly unlikely to happen to me that it's not even worth thinking about.

Also I like the people in the thread saying that it'd be too hard to ban guns, so we might as well just forget it. That's so idiotic I don't even know where to start. Anything that's hard isn't worth doing apparently.

I'm not sure if I should be worried that there's rumors of one going to happen at my high school next month. Bit coincidental considering this just happened..

@Whamola said:

Also I like the people in the thread saying that it'd be too hard to ban guns, so we might as well just forget it. That's so idiotic I don't even know where to start. Anything that's hard isn't worth doing apparently.

Its not that its to hard, its that people give no fucks and it wont work. People WILL have guns, and since they will, you might as well not piss people off by trying to take them away. Think about it, you want to piss people off, by trying to take their guns.... people pissed off.... with guns... the very problem in the first place if your a spineless punk who wont admit that the real problem is idiots failing to raise kids. People having guns isn't the issue here. Idiots with guns is the problem, coupled with those idiots raising idiot kids. Why punish the majority for the minority?

IQ test for guns, and having kids would literally solve the problem in a generation or two.

@BigChickenDinner said: "...IQ test for guns..."

But that would ban the entire conservative party from owning guns, and they're they only people dumb enough to really care about owning guns in the first place!

What you said essentially agrees with what I said though. If people weren't obsessed with owning guns to fight an invisible army of super villains, they wouldn't teach their kids that it's okay to use deadly weapons to kill people who they view as threats. Of course, if these people WEREN'T such terrible parents, they wouldn't own guns in the first place.

So I guess what I'm saying is we should probably ban guns. Yeah, if you wanted a gun bad enough you could probably get one, but guess what? The people who want guns that bad have them illegally anyway. Banning guns would definitely almost eliminate school shootings completely.

@Whamola said:

@BigChickenDinner said: "...IQ test for guns..."

But that would ban the entire conservative party from owning guns, and they're they only people dumb enough to really care about owning guns in the first place!

What you said essentially agrees with what I said though. If people weren't obsessed with owning guns to fight an invisible army of super villains, they wouldn't teach their kids that it's okay to use deadly weapons to kill people who they view as threats. Of course, if these people WEREN'T such terrible parents, they wouldn't own guns in the first place.

So I guess what I'm saying is we should probably ban guns. Yeah, if you wanted a gun bad enough you could probably get one, but guess what? The people who want guns that bad have them illegally anyway. Banning guns would definitely almost eliminate school shootings completely.

What is dangerous here is your thinking that 1) Passing a law that bans gun would magically make guns disappear and 2) highschool kids who have access to Crack Cocaine and other highly illegal items couldn't find a gun on the street.

I don't understand the logic you use when you say banning guns will stop school violence in the USA. The problem is clearly not guns in the USA . Its the people in the USA. This country fucking SUCKS.

How many times must this happen? At what point is the explanation, the shooter was emotionally and mentally unstable, no longer enough? He/she was one bad egg cannot be a valid explanation anymore. One would think that a re-evaluation of the way kids are treated in school would have occurred by now. I do not mean anti-bullying campaigns because those clearly have not sufficed. Until someone takes a long hard look at the way our society is socially educating children I don't think we can move on from tragedies like this. I do not claim to have the answer, but I am beginning to think we are asking the wrong questions.

Two more died in the hospital yesterday, the whole thing is terrible.

@BigChickenDinner: So you mean to tell me that a kid from a middle to lower-middle class family purchasing an illegal firearm on a teenager's income is AS EASY as just grabbing one from his dad's gun closet?

We agree that America is really fucked up right now, but how is allowing fucked up people to have deadly weapons a good idea? When people are not acting responsibly, they should not have tools that help them act even more irresponsibly. America can have their guns back once we:

1. Get an actual labor party

2. Completely restructure the school system

3. Re-educate the conservatives

4. Establish a livable minimum wage

5. join the rest of the first world in reaching scientific literacy

6. become a secular society

7. greatly down-size our military

8. and so on, etc.

@Whamola said:

@BigChickenDinner said: "...IQ test for guns..."

But that would ban the entire conservative party from owning guns, and they're they only people dumb enough to really care about owning guns in the first place!

What you said essentially agrees with what I said though. If people weren't obsessed with owning guns to fight an invisible army of super villains, they wouldn't teach their kids that it's okay to use deadly weapons to kill people who they view as threats. Of course, if these people WEREN'T such terrible parents, they wouldn't own guns in the first place.

So I guess what I'm saying is we should probably ban guns. Yeah, if you wanted a gun bad enough you could probably get one, but guess what? The people who want guns that bad have them illegally anyway. Banning guns would definitely almost eliminate school shootings completely.

So you want a war...on guns? Your naive in thinking you could ban guns from a country and have them all go away.

How do you feel about America's war on drugs?

So you want a war...on guns? Your naive in thinking you could ban guns from a country and have them all go away.

How do you feel about America's war on drugs?

3. Re-educate the conservatives

@MonetaryDread said:

I will never understand how someone can defend possession of guns in this day.

Easy. I like to hunt instead of paying for grossly overpriced meat from the supermarket. At the local meat shop a 6 ounce steak of White Tailed Elk costs almost $10, I hunted one myself, took it to a butcher, and then I had something like 80 pounds of meat in my freezer.

Plus, eating meat that you hunted yourself just makes you feel more satisfied, it is like it triggers some primal response hidden in our monkey - hunter-gatherer DNA.

Then you have to look at the societal reasons as to why there are so many deaths. In the USA there were 10.27 firearm related deaths per 100,000 citizens and 4.4 of those were homicides. Yet in Canada ( a nation with a higher percentage of gun owners), there were 4.78 gun deaths per 100,000 citizens and .78 of those were homicides. Most other gun deaths in both nations were suicides, and those people were probably going to kill themselves anyways, guns were just the method they chose.

It tastes better than supermarket meat :)

Also, guns are bad cause they can kill pplz k? Other weapons that can kill pplz is not bad cause they is not guns.

More people have been killed by cars than by guns. Thus, cars should be illegal.

@Questionable said:

Gee America? what a suprise.

Must be all dem Halo's and fox news.

It was George Bush's fault.

@Whamola said:

@BigChickenDinner said: "...IQ test for guns..."

But that would ban the entire conservative party from owning guns, and they're they only people dumb enough to really care about owning guns in the first place!

Grow up, yeah?

I don't know why Democrats resort to insulting the intelligence of conservatives. It is unfounded and pitifully juvenile. The only purpose it serves is to discredit whatever follows the statement, "Conservatives are dumb durr hurr".

Then again, looking at your prior post, which is riddled with unfounded, overused and typical hyper liberal vitriol that oozes a false sense of intellectual superiority over those who disagree with you..followed by the next post that essentially regurgitates what the liberal ideals are in a sort of putrid, chunky bile..