@bogitt: It all happened rather at once from my point of view. I've not been 'banned' before all this started for many years.

@lackingsaint said:

Generally we have zero problems with people having a certain sense of humour or carrying certain opinions, and I assure you this is not our problem here. The only time we come down on users expressing an opinion is when it reaches into extreme stuff like sexist or racist speech, and we only have a problem with humour when people violate our rules and then claim it's a joke. Making jokes is fine, we do it all the time, but for example, telling a bunch of people they're "fucking assholes" then saying "it was just a joke" will not let you duck out of moderation.

There's a big difference between "can" and "do". As far as I know the staff are plenty responsive to users, but if you don't get a response, just give them a nudge. As for the whole "eyewitness testimony" thing, well, it's hard for such a thing to exist in a true form. Bannings aren't a situation where a person does one thing wrong, then they're judged worthy of a ban. Bans almost always come on the back of a history of causing trouble on the site, and when it comes to what pushes a user over the edge into a ban, it's sometimes not just one thing, but a series of things that made us decide it was time for the final blow. I often see users complaining that people shouldn't have been banned, while showing that they're clearly don't know all the things that person had done to get banned.

@endurancefun: All warnings and suspensions come with a PM from the mods, but if you really want to contact us, we state at multiple places across the site that users should PM us, you were free to do so at any time. As for @replies, there are a lot of things we won't discuss publicly, but keep in mind that @replies on the site are not currently functioning properly and that people don't always know they're being mentioned.

Honestly, the mod team would like to see some changes to the site to deal with some of the issues you're talking about (e.g. Public cooldowns), but when it comes to changing the way the site functions, that's something only the engineers can do. Currently we're trying to bring up about a million different things with them while they already have enough of a job trying to work on Comic Vine, and deal with issues on the site that have nothing to do with moderation, so even if there are things on the site we'd both like to see done differently, we have to accept that at this juncture that will probably have to wait a while.

As for the whole staff/mod thing, I mean this as politely as possible, but before you make a statement, please think about whether you actually know the nature of how the mod team and staff work. Moderation is not a small job, and is far from just dealing with a few spammers. If the staff were to moderate as the rest of us do, it would take a significant chunk of their time. Yes, many of the current mods were not directly appointed by the staff, but the staff trusted that the mods they originally appointed were fit to appoint further mods, and they've told us that they're happy with our current work. If one of us has done something wrong, of course the staff could prove it, they have the access to everything we do and more, and it couldn't be further from the truth that there's no way to punish a mod acting out of line; if they staff wanted they could just flip a switch tomorrow and have all our accounts deleted.

Lastly, I'm afraid you still don't have a leg to stand on with this insulting the mods thing. Insulting all of us, instead of insulting one of us does not mean we're going to let it slide, and while we certainly don't consider "sucks" the worst things you could say about someone, we're not going to refrain from moderating people for insulting a group of people rather than specific individuals. I'm not trying to intimidate anyone here, and I know you're not trying to make trouble specifically. I will shoot you a PM, and we'll talk about this in private, but the fact remains that 9 out of 10 times someone has a problem with the mods things just kind of turn out like this, and I think there's something for users to learn from it.

We're making an exception to begin with letting EnduranceFun talk about this thing publicly. I hope you can understand why we don't want users pointing to other users who are not part of this discussion and saying "This guy did a shitty thing everyone".

It wasn't our choice, it was just the way the staff implemented it. There may be a change to this in the future as we talk with the engineers, but no guarantees.

I may lock this thread up soon actually, we were making an exception letting EnduranceFun do this publicly, he's already got our attention, and things are getting a little too gossipy in here for my liking.

Fuck the mod team <3

#YOLO

I wasn't angry about it really, I just thought it was funny and ironic in a way. I guess the only slightly annoying thing about it was that I've seen people get away with way worse stuff than what I said, but it's not like the Mods can be everywhere at once.

Moderation on this site is extremely lenient and easy to deal with. Anywhere else and this thread would already be deleted. My advice is the next time a user causes you to be a jerk just close the window before posting.

@gamer_152: My problem with contacting the mods is once you're banned, as you can't send messages, you're locked out of your account. Of course you can contact mods very easily when not banned, no question about that. Okay, I feel a lot more informed now after reading this post, particularly on trying to talk to the engineers about a 'million little things.' If you could send me a private message I'd also appreciate that. Not that you need my permission, but as the thread has largely served a purpose, I'm not going to grumble about you locking it.

I hope you get banned for this. I even blacked out this atrocious remark. Because I do not want to repeat it.

@nictel: I was sort of hoping I'd get banned, too :P

There's really only one moderator I can think of who I ever felt was slightly rude or unnecessarily threatening to me and broke the invisible contract that exists between subscriber and site, but largely Giant Bomb moderators are fantastic, and even honest about problems and mistakes.

@gamer_152 Which is why I hope you don't lock this thread right away. Open, public dissent is a healthy thing.

@geraltitude: I don't remember this, but I'm prepared to bet money that it was me :D

You're the worst, Sweep. I don't think you're even actually a hamburger.

Gay is a race?

@sweep said:

It can't have been you Sweep, he said slightly rude.

It's in the Geneva Conventions.

Generally speaking people who break the rules never understand how they broke the rules. The moderators are human beings, just like every other user and, as such, make mistakes. If they made a mistake, there are channels that you can go through. I'm not saying the system is perfect but there are ways to raise a concern. You have, and clearly every mod that has replied has disagreed with you. The reality is this: you made a mistake, doesn't matter if you understand why you made the mistake but you did. Deal with it. Stay Calm, Carry On.

Your best bet would be to raise your problem like a civilized human being. If it is truly a worthwhile concern, I imagine it will be dealt with properly.

The moderator team are not the KGB they won't blindfold and gag you if you bring up a concer.... [message deleted by moderator]

i think i remember that tnt and in the chat you were been a total dick spamming like fuck thinking you were funny but you were so not, just fucking annoying.

O...Oh fuck. Did anyone see that? Where'd patman99 go? What do you mean you don't know who that is? HE WAS RIGHT THERE A SECOND AGO.

@sweep@gamer_152 lol, no, it wasn't Sweep! They shall not be named, because I have forgiven the event, and hope they have forgiven me too.

I can be a little sensitive at times (all the time) so at this point I've convinced myself it was probably one of those misunderstandings where we were both cursing at our computers going I'm trying to be nice what is this duder not getting??

I don't think the "system" is very nice to users who got ban. How I see it, the only way to appeal a ban is to message a staff member. The staff members often do reply to messages but rarely for ban appeals.

Edit: although the system doesn't have to be kind at all. But there should be a simpler way to appeal a ban.

[Edit by mod: Please don't use this thread to leak other user's moderation details. That information is confidential.]

Edit 2: I don't think it's confidential since he posted it publicly on twitter which can be viewed by anyone. I also don't see how stating this "user" was banned is revealing moderation detail. Plenty of people know about it already. I did not say what was posted or said.

Yea this site seems to treat some users who I won't name *rolls eyes* like crap!

Even though they never freaking posted anything hateful or races!

I...is it you? Are you talking about you?

I find the mods opinions in life to be disagreeable, but as far as moderating goes I think they're okay

i cancelled my annual membership because brad gave DmC 5 stars so I can relate to this

sometimes enough is enough and you have to take a stand

Aren't people who were permanently banned for forum conduct on the old site also listed as -1?....and what about the people who have less than -1 wiki points? Like there are several users with -2, -3, -4, etc. one guy even has -34.

I am fairly positive he quoted his wife(be it real or not) saying that about his own mother when she was trying to give them advice on their baby.

But that's a dumb stand. No one should follow that example because it's silly.

It was probably @mattyftm. I mean, it's pretty rude to just have your balls out like that when dealing with a user.

I remember I got a warning because I was trying to be snarky and show Playstation's latest vita advertisement, apparently that isn't allowed.

Neato. I think any forum is a pretty bad place, so you can't really take it seriously. Just ask questions and post comments without giving a shit what anyone thinks or replies. Oh wait you already kinda did that.

If your not happy, don't give them your money. Seems fair to me.

You totally missed the rest of the conversation we were having. Good job.

Plus some people pay for that shit. Don't be generalizing.

just like the redcoats thought the founding fathers were silly, huh?

I've been staring at that sentence for what feels like 5 minutes trying to comprehend which corner of your colon you ripped it from.

@mariachimacabre said:

Matching that statement up with his user icon, I think it's safe for you to brush it off as a trolling comment.

@psylah: I should have just replied to you, but the point still stands.

This thread is a lot less entertaining than i thought it would be.

"Faggot" is one of those words that merits an insta-ban. Fucking can't stand that word.

In general, people on the internet aren't nice enough to each other. They're too busy trying to be right. And it's a shame.

Most of your complaints seem to be almost, if not entirely, your own fault. The moderation system on Giant Bomb is fine. Sure, it may seem a bit too lenient at times, but that only means you have to really make an effort to earn the wrath of the moderators.

And in regards to the appealing a ban: How about not behaving in some way that would warrant you to get banned in the first place?

The mod team on this site does a great job and they are all good individuals. The staff's job is also not one of being moderators, they have many others things to do and it is why we have people devoted to doing just moderation.

I feel real weird about this. On the one hand, I do think that the Mod team is overzealous on this site. I've been banned for saying I was called a -slur for a gay person- after coming out at some point, as a part of some of the bullshit sexist stuff (I mean the bullshit on both sides, to be clear). And when I tried to contact support about this, I never got a response. It wasn't like I said it to be a dick or to break the rules, and it didn't even occur to me that it'd be a problem because we've been told that the site is a mature place where mature things can be said. But apparently being mature about a word that is hurtful to me, and means jack shit to the staff/probably most of the mods, means banning me instead of warning me and asking me to edit (which I gladly would have done if it was unwelcome). I wouldn't mind if someone were banned for being called the C-word (I'm not going to post it here because I have no idea if I'll get banned. I've seen the C word posted and be the ONLY WORD IN THE POST and not get any sort of moderation, and I believe a mod posted in that same thread) and the rules were clear and they didn't just immediately ban someone for a slip up like mine (which was just long enough after the Ryan incident that it wasn't on my mind, but not long enough that I was used to being super concerned about sharing some of my experiences with homophobes). I had been banned a couple times in the past for being a bit of an ass, and I'm not too concerned with that stuff, I never spoke out against that.

Which reminds me of another instance in which a moderator on the beta site called me out as being a complete fucking asshole (I believe he used those words, and he CERTAINLY used explicit language) because I DEFENDED THE MOD STAFF despite being in a ban. I also shared my experience regarding being banned previously for the quote of a homophobic slur, used against me, a gay man who believe the word is disgusting when used as a slur or even as a "disarmed" term of endearment by my fellow homosexuals; as well as an experience in which a fairly positive thread asking if there were other open gays in the community being locked and me being scolded for inviting trolls.

Any response we get from the mod community seems pretty aggressive: "No, fuck you, we're the mods and we will do things the way we do things."

And usually, that's awesome. They ban people when they deserve to be banned, they get rid of fucking spam, and they help keep the live chat clear of asshats. They also give people fucking cooldowns for saying totally goofy things that aren't even a little offensive. They also ban people when a warning would have been more than enough. And there is no way to appeal even an issue that is NOT human error. I was rebanned, I believe because of the system, and not an individual, when the new site launched because of a recent ban. It was over a week till I finally got threw to Dave on twitter and he was awesome enough to help out. That was after messages to the support email, which I can't ever remember getting a response from. And after I realized I had been unbanned early, and informed the Mod team of this without ever abusing my early unbanning.

Well... If it's a meme, isn't it the same? They are both joking references to things other people said/did? I tell my friends to fuck off in all manners of ways without actually meaning any ill will. I'm not saying it should be okay, but I'm confident that at least three members of the staff have, usually jokingly, something along the lines of "suck a dick."

The issue here is that it's hard to know what I'm allowed to do when I do something that someone on the staff does (which is okay when it's not specifically TO someone, just behind their back on a podcast). I don't mind when Jeff says some random person or organization (which by the way, is made up of people) can "go fuck off" because they do something he disagrees with because he's usually right, those people are dicks. But when we do the same thing, we are banned and called assholes. I would go so far as to say that I was personally attacked by a mod, who well overstepped his or her bounds despite the fact that I was supportive of the fucking mod team, despite the fact that I even went so far as to ensure my own ban was enforced. I've always been supportive of the mods as a whole, even the individual who went off on me because I shared a critical point of view as a part of my mostly supportive message. One which clearly did not benefit me as I stated bans should carry over to the beta at a point when I was banned. Clearly that's the action of a monstrous asshole with absolutely no responsibility or willingness to admit his own mistakes. /sarcasm.

I get some people think that the "no, fuck you guys" approach that the staff and mod team take is amusing, but it kind of fuckin' sucks to be on the wrong side of that. Especially when you've been verbally and financially supportive of Giant Bomb since the very beginning.

The mod team is awesome, but I also believe that the idea that it is perfect is disappointing.

This is pretty unrelated, but this is the kind of healthy awareness that I wish more organizations would have of their own individuals:

A lot of times, it's easy to ignore the flaws of your own party; but if you can't admit that mistakes are made and that there need to be consequences to these things, they will continue to be made. Obviously, the subject matter that Sgt.Maj. Barret speaks of is FAR more serious than moderation on a silly web site, but at the same time, shouldn't that mean that we are a lot less intense about these things?

That all being said, without having COMPLETE knowledge of what the OP is "in for" it sounds like he deserves what he got. But I don't know what happened, so I can't really speak to it. Some of it though, I will say sounds borderline at best. I remember when the chat was more full of cooldowns than anything else, and instead of helping to clear up the chat, it was getting in the way and the cooldowns were just going to people being goofballs. It felt like they were just caught in the crossfire against the mods and the real assholes.

IGN continues to be fucking stupid with bans, seriously. I've seen straight up abuse, on multiple occasions in the last 30 days, of moderation powers on the IGN comments. Not to my own comments, to other folks.

If I show you a quote of my friend saying "Fuck you buddy" and you don't know it's a joke, or even a reference to a past experience, or if it's a reference to pop culture you don't know about, and in fact it was just a playful thing being said, what would you say the intent is?

And no, it isn't always lighthearted and funny. Patrick always has someone he's genuinely saying "Fuck you!" to. It's practically his catch phrase at this point, it's always exactly the same. And usually, it's pretty warranted. But at other times, it isn't really needed at all.

Intent cannot be proven terribly easily. Ya literally have to admit to it. It is why it is so damning, because if it's even remotely possible to prove it, it's probably going to prove complete guilt. That goes about ten-fold for text in a comment on the internet without context or attenuation. If it's impossible to be sarcastic, why would intent be a simple thing to get across?

Yes, people should be more aware of their words, I've been banned for making that mistake. But by your rules, you should be banned for directly calling someone a "dick." I've been banned for far less (see above) so why shouldn't you be banned for saying he's a dick, even if he is being a dick? I've been a dick to people on the forums because they've been dicks, and I got banned because of how I was a dick (the wrong way) and they weren't because they were just being self entitled or what have you, which isn't really a bannable offense. So why shouldn't you be banned for calling someone a dick because they are a dick?

And by that same rule, shouldn't the mod who called me an asshole be banned for a personal attack on me, even if I was being a dick when I earned one of my bans? Or is he exempt from the rules for being a mod?

It's not as simple as intent, because intent can be mistaken even if you have the full fuckin' picture. Remember a certain story of a certain friend of the site thinking he was going to have a threesome? Yeah, shit happens. People do stupid things, and people misunderstand other things. Acting like that is impossible is a bit goofy.

There needs to be support, even for people being banned, potentially for a real bullshit reason. I was pretty unhappy when I shared a pretty shitty experience of mine, and because of a rule that didn't occur to me in the moment that doesn't even make sense in the context of what I said, I was banned. Which hey, whatever. If they had at least responded to me about it when I tried to contact support, I would have been okay with it. Instead, I was ignored, and then had a member of the mod team speaking pretty passionately about how poor of a person I am. And hell, I'm NOT perfect. And neither are any of the mods, or staff. Sparkly-whoever used to call in to every fuckin' live show in the world and always got on while other members of the community never got a chance because it was always the regulars that got on. Ryan shouted the baddest F word on a live show in front of thousands of people, some of whom would be very offended to be called that. And then continues to say "cock sucker" on a regular basis, which has a pretty fucking apparent source.

But seriously, saying "your face!" is worth any sort of punishment? That's silly guys, just admit it. My teenage sister says that any time I say anything to her. Should I tell her she's no longer allowed to speak to me? No, because all she said was "your face."

And if the people who have said "f****t" in this thread aren't freakin' banned for using it the way they used it, that'll be pretty good proof of how kind of inconsistent the mods can be. I was degraded because I like boys and happen to be a boy, and was banned for sharing that experience with the community. If that's worth a ban, so is listing the word as a part of other words that the staff has said in the past.

And no, I don't really think someone should be banned for pointing out that the staff has used that word. That's sort of my point.

I apologize for the rant, but this is what happens when your father is a drunken, abusive asshole, that treats fatherhood more like Saddam treated political office, ya take this kind of stuff pretty seriously.

This is really good to know and cool that you guys did this. I am however a little curious why this wasn't put out more publicly. This should be a story on the site or something, if there is a new means of receiving support, just so people are aware. This shouldn't be the first time I'm hearing about this. Not trying to be a dick, but this kind of thing is only useful when it's made apparent to people. A lot of people I'm guessing aren't aware of this right now. But, I will keep this in mind the next time a site transition re-bans me or unbans me, or both judging on past experience :p

And as useful as twitter/the forums are, that doesn't really count. I don't ever really see stuff like General Discussion stickies because of the way I browse the forums these days. A story to notify users of changes in support structure is pretty standard so I feel it's acceptable to accept it. And it's not showing up in the support section of the premium/account hub thingy either, so that might be something worth changing as well.

Yet here you are, using the word. Knowing it is against the rules to use this word, without exception. According to statements made by the moderation, this post is worthy of a ban. That said, it makes me all warm inside to hear that kind of thing being said :3

This is turning into a catch-all for various issues, it's time to just close this down. Mods are always available via the various links and at giantbombmods@gmail.com.

If anyone has any problems with an individual moderator or all of us or the way we do things, please contact your closest friendly member of Staff.