This might just be a case of Jeff simply not liking it.

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#1 Posted by jillsandwich (762 posts) -

I've read quite a few reviews, and Jeff's review is the only one that's average, as opposed to 9's or 4's. War for Cybertron got a 3 from Jeff as well, but I enjoyed the hell out of the game, and I loved playing the co-op, multiplayer and horde mode with my friends. Me and all of those friends have been totally stoked for this one since they announced it. It also doesn't hurt that a couple of us(including myself) are rabid Transformers fans. We'll all be slapping down the full 60 for this one.

Anyone else doing the same?

P.S. Jeff, the "Universal Greeting" moment in WFC should have been worth at LEAST four stars.

#2 Edited by Mesoian (1574 posts) -

I need to rent it first. The multiplayer is pretty janky and the Bumblebee single player stuff was slow and plotting. The combaticon stuff was EXCELLENT however, and if there's a lot of that in the campaign, then it may be worth the price of admission.

But from a purely technical view, it's literally half the game WFC was. That's enough to make people leery.

#3 Posted by JasonR86 (9657 posts) -

@jillsandwich:

Who cares what Jeff scored it? Also who cares what others scored it? If you like it and are excited for it buy it. But why even bring it up? What's to discuss?

#4 Posted by AhmadMetallic (18955 posts) -

@JasonR86 said:

@jillsandwich:

Who cares what Jeff scored it? Also who cares what others scored it? If you like it and are excited for it buy it. But why even bring it up? What's to discuss?

Yeah, what Jason said. Just read the reviews to see what reviewers think, but don't care about it too much, this is about YOU and the GAMES, no one else.

#5 Posted by Morningstar (2150 posts) -

I'll be willing to "slap down" 30 for this one, much like the previous game.

#6 Posted by FancySoapsMan (5816 posts) -

um... okay 
 
I don't really see the point you're trying to make

#7 Posted by PrivateIronTFU (3874 posts) -

As opposed to what, Jeff loving it but giving it 3 stars anyway?

#8 Edited by RenMcKormack (1074 posts) -

I think its a tough game to score. I liked the first game a ton and will get this one. Jeff makes valid points about the roteness and slidey feel of the game-play in his review. But I am so starved for anything that's even remotely good AND transformers that my mind goes blank. Making the objective questions of: is this a good game? are these mechanics fun? meaningless.

I mean I saw 5 minutes of transformers revenge of the fallen last night. Jetfire is Old and English in that movie. I felt like i needed to take a shower. so These games have been my transformers respite, even if they aren't perfect AND even if they are at times not perfect in terms of the transformers lore and stuff that i grew up with. Close enough.

#9 Edited by CandleJakk (766 posts) -

So, what you're saying is that someone's personal opinion about a video game is wrong, because it doesn't hold with every one elses?

I didn't like GTA IV, so I must be an ignorant douchebag.

#10 Posted by jillsandwich (762 posts) -

@RenMcKormack said:

I think its a tough game to score. I liked the first game a ton and will get this one. Jeff makes valid points about the roteness and feel game-play in his review. But I am so starved for anything that's even remotely good AND transformers that my mind goes blank making the objective questions of: is this a good game? are these mechanics fun? meaningless.

I mean I saw 5 minutes of transformers revenge of the fallen last night. Jetfire is Old and English in that movie. I felt like i needed to take a shower. so These games have been my transformers respite, even if they aren't perfect AND even if they are at times not perfect in terms fo eth transformers lore and stuff that i grew up with. Close enough.

I've been trying to get that movie out of my head for three years now man.

#11 Posted by Rowr (5535 posts) -

Jeff also doesn't care for Dynasty Warriors - hell, most of you don't. But fuck if it's going to stop me buying the new one every few years and playing the hell out of it.

#12 Posted by AngelN7 (2970 posts) -

Stop holding Jeff's opinion in a pedestal he's just a guy who plays videogames he may not like a game you like, who cares?

#13 Posted by Yodasdarkside (276 posts) -

I've certainly got my Transformers-blinkers on, but Jeff's review is definitely coated with a veneer of apathy regarding the franchise. He clearly doesn't hate Transformers, it just doesn't excite or interest him, which is fair, but makes me wonder if he was the right person to review the game. On one hand, he's sure to review it based purely on it's merits as a game, without any investment or 'forgiveness' because it's Transformers, which makes me think he was probably the right choice. However, ONLY fans of Transformers are gonna pick this up, really, so would it hurt to have a fellow fan review it? This isn't like most other franchises where people will buy it regardless of what the shell is - people are buying this because it's a Transformers game (that doesn't suck), not because it's an interesting third-person shooter.

#14 Posted by Ghost_Cat (1425 posts) -

I'm pretty sure he said (in the review) that this game is definitely for the rabid fans to enjoy. So go slap down sixty dollars.

#15 Posted by InfiniteGeass (2052 posts) -

In the end it's your opinion that matters most when buying and playing a game. Not some reviewers.

#16 Posted by mtcantor (947 posts) -

Jeff more or less said this game is like the last one. If you liked that one, you will probably like this one.

Just because we all like giant bomb doesn't mean our tastes need to align.

#17 Posted by dudescript (2 posts) -

@Mesoian said:

But from a purely technical view, it's literally half the game WFC was. That's enough to make people leery.

I don't know what that means.

#18 Posted by MariachiMacabre (7077 posts) -
@PrivateIronTFU

As opposed to what, Jeff loving it but giving it 3 stars anyway?

"Masterpiece of gaming but load times are long sometimes. 2 Stars."

A review is always just a case of someone liking or not liking something.
#19 Posted by AlisterCat (5531 posts) -

He hates games I love. Happens all the time. I hate pretty much all the games he loves too. We haven't fought to the death. Yet.

#20 Posted by Barrock (3525 posts) -

In my opinion, he may have been the wrong guy to review it. When he was down on the previous game just because you can strafe in vehicles... you knew it wouldn't be good.

#21 Posted by PillClinton (3291 posts) -

Well, I played War fo Cybertron and have to agree with Jeff's review. Personally, I found it rather bland and average, although I basically only played the single player. And I appreciate Jeff's honesty in giving FoC a very average review, despite doing the QLEX and all that.

#22 Posted by Dagbiker (6964 posts) -

On the contrary, I think this is a case of, you liking it too much.

#23 Posted by SethPhotopoulos (5227 posts) -

@Barrock said:

In my opinion, he may have been the wrong guy to review it. When he was down on the previous game just because you can strafe in vehicles... you knew it wouldn't be good.

His criticisms of that game extended far beyond that.

#24 Posted by Bubbameister33 (27 posts) -

How can someone be the wrong person to review a game? That's just fucking stupid to say. So what if he didn't like it. Just play the game and have fun.

#25 Posted by President_Barackbar (3454 posts) -

@CandleJakk said:

So, what you're saying is that someone's personal opinion about a video game is wrong, because it doesn't hold with every one elses?

I didn't like GTA IV, so I must be an ignorant douchebag.

FINALLY, people taking responsibility for their opinions being wrong! Good on ya you ignorant douchebag!

#26 Posted by joetom (97 posts) -

A case of Jeff not liking it? In a mostly middling review? No shit. If he liked it, it would have a better score.

#27 Posted by Dagbiker (6964 posts) -

If you really did reviews right you would have a computer randomly pick who reviewed what. And if you really, really did reviews right you would have that Reviews Bot that gamespot has get some reviewing done, but I think he might be in an epic battle against Udur'Min.

#28 Posted by blueinferno (448 posts) -

I paid 10 bucks for WFC, and I would've gladly paid 40. Only started playing it a couple of weeks ago and I'm enjoying the hell out of it.

#29 Posted by Barrock (3525 posts) -

@Bubbameister33 said:

How can someone be the wrong person to review a game? That's just fucking stupid to say. So what if he didn't like it. Just play the game and have fun.

Well, if you hate the subject of the game (not that Jeff does, I'm just using it as an example) you probably aren't going to be fair in the review. Like if I reviewed Madden for instance. I'd have no clue what I was doing, and I'd say "It's well made, but it's no fun.".

#30 Posted by NathHaw (2760 posts) -

@Barrock said:

@Bubbameister33 said:

How can someone be the wrong person to review a game? That's just fucking stupid to say. So what if he didn't like it. Just play the game and have fun.

Well, if you hate the subject of the game (not that Jeff does, I'm just using it as an example) you probably aren't going to be fair in the review. Like if I reviewed Madden for instance. I'd have no clue what I was doing, and I'd say "It's well made, but it's no fun.".

So if you are a fan of the series, should you not review it; you'd be too prone to be unfairly praising?

#31 Posted by ThePickle (4165 posts) -

As opposed to what? If he likes a game he gives it a good score, if he doesn't like it he gives it a bad score. That's all reviews. It's your job to find a reviewer who best lines up with your personal tastes. He's never said "I don't like this game but I'll give it a good score".

#32 Edited by Willtron (243 posts) -

@Yodasdarkside said:

I've certainly got my Transformers-blinkers on, but Jeff's review is definitely coated with a veneer of apathy regarding the franchise. He clearly doesn't hate Transformers, it just doesn't excite or interest him, which is fair, but makes me wonder if he was the right person to review the game. On one hand, he's sure to review it based purely on it's merits as a game, without any investment or 'forgiveness' because it's Transformers, which makes me think he was probably the right choice. However, ONLY fans of Transformers are gonna pick this up, really, so would it hurt to have a fellow fan review it? This isn't like most other franchises where people will buy it regardless of what the shell is - people are buying this because it's a Transformers game (that doesn't suck), not because it's an interesting third-person shooter.

Why would only Transformers fans pick this up?

I'm a kid of the '80s, but I fucking HATE Transformers. I loathe them. But I still heavily considered buying the first game because I heard a lot of praise about it--and this game is just supposed to be an evolved version of that. I heavily considered buying the game because it seemed like a really interesting third-person shooter wrapped in Transformers canon. Reviews should be a barometer for people on the fence. Like you insinuated, those who FUCKING LOVE TRANSFORMERS were probably going to get this game regardless of what reviews said--just like, say, I'll buy any Fire Pro Wrestling game ever made.

You get an unabashed fan of something and then you're getting into too much subjectivity sometimes. It can go the opposite way if someone fucking hates something, too. For example, I would never be able to review Madden games. I despise football. The guys aren't fond of J-RPGs. That's why they don't review them: they aren't familiar/interested, and it'd do those games a disservice.

Look at Greg Miller's reviews of Smackdown games over the years. I think that's a perfect example of someone letting their subjective point of view creep in wayyyyyyy too much on a review. Those games were mechanically shit for a good while--and still are, really. But he's been doubting them as what one would qualify as 'great' due to scores for fucking yeaaaarsss. They aren't great. I've no opinion on him otherwise, but Greg Miller's reviews of those games, to me, are a perfect example of someone's bias being at direct odds with what I think is kind of an average at-best game, and at worst a shit game with broken online features.

I see your point, but I honestly just think you're wrong. I really do. Yes, reviews are just professional opinions, and I often let a game live on its own merit--but to say reviews don't matter, to me, is insane. I think their influences have dwindled on me, but they still definitely influence my purchasing habits--for the good or the bad. I think that review scores just give you a barometer--you read a few, you look around, you see if the game is 'right' for you. For you it would be right because it's Transformers. For me it would be right for strong gameplay--and that's where an outsider's point of view like Jeff's would surely come in handy.

Also, he gave it a three. That's an average game. He didn't dislike it. He found it average. Ohhh noes.

#33 Posted by Mesoian (1574 posts) -

@dudescript said:

@Mesoian said:

But from a purely technical view, it's literally half the game WFC was. That's enough to make people leery.

I don't know what that means.

It, literally, has half the features of WFC. Co-op is gone, half the multiplayer game modes and features are gone, horde mode length is cut in half (length of unique enemy waves).

#34 Posted by Barrock (3525 posts) -

@nrh79 said:

@Barrock said:

@Bubbameister33 said:

How can someone be the wrong person to review a game? That's just fucking stupid to say. So what if he didn't like it. Just play the game and have fun.

Well, if you hate the subject of the game (not that Jeff does, I'm just using it as an example) you probably aren't going to be fair in the review. Like if I reviewed Madden for instance. I'd have no clue what I was doing, and I'd say "It's well made, but it's no fun.".

So if you are a fan of the series, should you not review it; you'd be too prone to be unfairly praising?

Actually a good point. I'd not considered that.

#35 Posted by joetom (97 posts) -

@nrh79 said:

So if you are a fan of the series, should you not review it; you'd be too prone to be unfairly praising?

In that case, you'd be the perfect person to review it, because you'd represent the opinion of those who are most likely to be interested in it. It's the same as someone who likes fighting games reviewing the newest Street Fighter or someone who likes JRPGs reviewing Final Fantasy.

Whereas if you don't like it to begin with, you clearly don't represent the opinions of people who'd be interested.

#36 Posted by DoctorWelch (2774 posts) -

This is definitely one of those games where the quality increases exponentially when you have friends that are also playing it. I can easily see how Jeff gave it a 3 while pretty much playing it alone as he likes to with most games.

#37 Posted by DoctorWelch (2774 posts) -

@Bubbameister33 said:

How can someone be the wrong person to review a game? That's just fucking stupid to say. So what if he didn't like it. Just play the game and have fun.

Is this a joke? If I am someone who openly hates on every JRPG and never wants to play them, it would be utterly pointless to give me a JRPG to review because my perspective on that games is basically worthless to anyone who was actually thinking about purchasing that game. On the other hand, if someone who knows a lot about/has played a lot of JRPGs is the one chosen to review a JRPG, that perspective is going to be worth immeasurably more to anyone who reads it. The same thing can easily be said for sports games, and that's why GiantBomb doesn't focus too heavily on them.

I'm not saying I hate JRPGs, and I'm not saying this kind of situation is what happened with this particular review, but weighing the worth of a reviewer's perspective is extremely important.

#38 Posted by Renahzor (991 posts) -

Tell me more about how game reviews might be someones opinion!

#39 Posted by Ares42 (2620 posts) -

Already commented on the review, but ye, Jeff doesn't seem to like this type of arena-style mobility driven shooters. He either wants the tactical "2 shots, you're dead" military shooters, or the pop'n'stop cover based ones.

Online
#40 Posted by ShaggE (6415 posts) -

Wait... you're telling me that he based his review on what he felt about the game instead of what people want to hear? Like some sort of filthy opinion-haver?

Well shit. Here I thought I could trust Giant Bomb to keep opinion out of things and tell me that every game with a marketing budget is the best game ever, no matter what said game's actual quality is. :(

#41 Posted by Dixego (384 posts) -

@Renahzor said:

Tell me more about how game reviews might be someones opinion!

#42 Posted by Napalm (9020 posts) -

That's uh, typically how reviews work, yep.

#43 Posted by CornBREDX (5096 posts) -

The halfway point. An inherent appreciation of this game's specific gameplay style, characters, subject matter, and so on may play as big a role in your enjoyment as the actual quality of the game. 

 
Ergo Jeff said if you're into it already, you'll probably like it, there are better games but its not terrible if you want to check it out. Since you were already planning on getting it, his review rings true as you clearly loved it.
#44 Posted by SmilingPig (1337 posts) -

Is it the old transformers or the new ones?

#45 Posted by jillsandwich (762 posts) -

I obviously didn't word something correctly back there, because holy fuck.

#46 Posted by overjoyedpants (75 posts) -

@joetom said:

@nrh79 said:

So if you are a fan of the series, should you not review it; you'd be too prone to be unfairly praising?

In that case, you'd be the perfect person to review it, because you'd represent the opinion of those who are most likely to be interested in it. It's the same as someone who likes fighting games reviewing the newest Street Fighter or someone who likes JRPGs reviewing Final Fantasy.

Whereas if you don't like it to begin with, you clearly don't represent the opinions of people who'd be interested.

i do not think your examples are fair. you say someone who is a fan of fighting games should review street fighter. i agree with that part. i dont think a fan of the street fighter series specifically should review every new street fighter game. jeff not being a fan of transformers gives me, someone who doesnt like transformers, but likes third person shooters, a better opinion on if i should buy it. he is able to say if he likes the game or not coming from a similar point of view as my own.

#47 Posted by NathHaw (2760 posts) -

@overjoyedpants said:

@joetom said:

@nrh79 said:

So if you are a fan of the series, should you not review it; you'd be too prone to be unfairly praising?

In that case, you'd be the perfect person to review it, because you'd represent the opinion of those who are most likely to be interested in it. It's the same as someone who likes fighting games reviewing the newest Street Fighter or someone who likes JRPGs reviewing Final Fantasy.

Whereas if you don't like it to begin with, you clearly don't represent the opinions of people who'd be interested.

i do not think your examples are fair. you say someone who is a fan of fighting games should review street fighter. i agree with that part. i dont think a fan of the street fighter series specifically should review every new street fighter game. jeff not being a fan of transformers gives me, someone who doesnt like transformers, but likes third person shooters, a better opinion on if i should buy it. he is able to say if he likes the game or not coming from a similar point of view as my own.

I think the main problem we are running into is the word "fan." What we should probably be thinking about as far as a reviewers go is whether a reviewer has a familiarity with the genre, its mechanics, etc. Sometimes we forget that many people (including some of the GB crew) doubted a game like Arkham Asylum due to games of that type's typical nature. Some people went into it thinking one thing and left as believers, because the game was good and was reviewed as so. Didn't take a Batman fan. If Transformers has a breakout like that, it won't take a Transformers fan.

#48 Posted by Tim_the_Corsair (3065 posts) -
@Yodasdarkside

I've certainly got my Transformers-blinkers on, but Jeff's review is definitely coated with a veneer of apathy regarding the franchise. He clearly doesn't hate Transformers, it just doesn't excite or interest him, which is fair, but makes me wonder if he was the right person to review the game. On one hand, he's sure to review it based purely on it's merits as a game, without any investment or 'forgiveness' because it's Transformers, which makes me think he was probably the right choice. However, ONLY fans of Transformers are gonna pick this up, really, so would it hurt to have a fellow fan review it? This isn't like most other franchises where people will buy it regardless of what the shell is - people are buying this because it's a Transformers game (that doesn't suck), not because it's an interesting third-person shooter.

That's not true at all, any more than it was true for the movie, or for, say Dawn of War / Space Marine.

People will pick up a game because they think it looks good, regardless of branding (especially when nothing else is out) and the game should be good enough for everybody, not just fanboys who can see past the flaws because Dinobots.

And this is coming from someone who absolutely loved the first one and will no doubt love the second.
#49 Edited by freakin9 (1113 posts) -

I remember telling my friends how much I liked War for Cybertron and in the same breath, readily admitting that without my love for the Transformers it was a very generic and flawed game. The Transformers games have very much been about great sound effects, storytelling, and a bit average gameplay. But in the end the games FEEL so good with some great big moments that you are too giddy to care.

#50 Posted by toastface (106 posts) -

I try to read most reviews of games from the perspective of someone who plays a lot more games than I ever will be able to. While I might get to play a cover based shooter every few months, they must play several a month. I can imagine that would wear thin a lot faster on someone that is exposed to it far more than I.

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