Breaking: Bungie Still Behaving Horribly

I thought this deserved its own thread.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2015-06-22-destiny-the-taken-king-director-defends-40-expansion-price-tag

As Jeff said: "Destiny is a load of fucking bullshit."

I don't even know what to say anymore. This game is becoming a cancer.

Is Luke Smith the middle dude on the E3 couch who was clearly boiling in anger during Jeff's interview?

Between that, and this interview, he clearly suffers from some sort of social disorder and I have no idea why Activision would send this guy to speak to the press.

With that being said, I have no problem throwing down $40 on DLC, as long as said content is worth the value. Bungie has not been too great in that department, but I'm still not ready to give up on Destiny just yet.

@mustainium: No, Luke Smith was the guy on the end. He comes across poorly in the Eurogamer interview, but I thought he was pretty reasonable on the live show.

@mustainium: I have no problem with the price point but Bungie can fuck right off if they think I going to rebuy old content to get some emotes. Also Luke Smith was the guy doing most of the talking during the E3 interview

@conmulligan:

Ah, my mistake.

I do admit, he was a master deflector during that interview, just laughing and saying "Yeah, we hear you!" without really answering any of Jeff's questions.

Eh, it really is just dancing emotes. But them asking you to buy everything again and Luke Smith going "Well ARE YOU NOT A TRUE FAN THAT WANTS EVERYTHING" is pretty gross.

Well, we have nothing more to talk about regarding your opportunity to spend extra money in Destiny

That's pretty much all you need to read from it. The fact that this philosophy has spread as much as it has among developers is just disheartening. Not that every game needs to be an "authentic artistic expression", but the idea that consumers are aching to spend more money and developers are just benevolent beings allowing us to give it to them is so insanely twisted.

The interview seemed skewed to make him look bad. Now i think the dlc pricing is as gross as the next guy, but my guess is that by the time this expansion comes out there will be a price drop on the DLC. Desiny is already cheaper than the DLC right now and it'll probably be like 15 dollars when this shit comes out. So basically they'll be saving like 15 or 20 bux getting it together considering the price drops. The vanilla game came out almost a year ago, of course new players are getting a discount they wouldn't buy it otherwise. He's a sales guy, nobody is going to say "Hey, yeah are shit is overpriced but buy it anyway!"

It's £40, not $40, which is what full games are generally priced at.

Yea I was going to post this interview but you beat me to it. That is the most gross game related interview I have read. Like who the fuck put that guy in head of speaking to news outlets. That being said the Game of the Year edition might actually be the first version of the game that is actually worth the money. The base game and all the dlc individually have been highway robbery compared to what you get in them.

Just finished reading it..... He really came off as a pompous arrogant asshole. I'm really surprised he even wanted to "poke" (as in mock) the interviewer for legitimately wanting the emotes but refusing to purchase the entire game and DLCs again just for emotes.

Shame, I really did think this game could be great but never expected things to go so wrong. I'll wait till Destiny 3 before I give them another second of mine, I don't have faith anything will change with Destiny 2 next year.

Do video game retailers in Europe normally discount the price to be comparable to what us Americans pay?

No, £40 is roughly equivalent to $60 so we're usually charged the same price for full games - for physical versions anywhoo. Console digital prices, however, are absurd over here. Though I can only speak for the UK mind you. I believe just about any country that uses the Euro has a pretty nasty price hike in relation to everywhere else.

Boy I wish I could smugly sit around implying that my customers were as stupid as Bungie seemingly thinks Destiny players are.

@junkboy0: As much ranting as Jeff has done about Destiny, he could do so much more. You could spend hours unpacking Destiny and its insidious bullshit. For as much heat as CoD, Battlefront, EA, Ubisoft and all the other usual suspects take, Bungie is basically setting a new bar for poor customer relations at the AAA level.

What will really make you pop a blood vessel, is reading the Destinythegame subreddit. People fall over themselves to defend and justify even the most absurd of Bungies gaffs.

That's pretty much his M.O. He was like that even back during the 1up days.

@yummylee: Wow in Destiny's case people in the UK are getting charged an extra 20 bucks. It should have priced at £25 to much the $40 US price point

@bocam: lol oh... I wasn't actually aware of what it was priced in the US and assumed that it was also $60. Jeez, that's even more fucked up, and I don't even play Destiny.

Wow, I thought Bungie was shoring up their messaging, but this is just awful. I'm not giving Bungie anymore money. The arrogance Bungie continues to show with this game is astonishing. This is coming from someone who has put up with their bullshit all of this time. I've put over 300 hours into this game.

"Destiny is a fucking load of bullshit" - Jeff Gerstmann

It's sad watching Bungie self destruct like this. I wonder if they have any idea how much of their reputation they are shredding irreparably.

If I were senior management at Activision I'd be calling them immediately and telling them to muzzle their people if they don't understand basic customer interactions.

Getting pissy about the emotes is pretty dumb, but man. What a delightfully terrible interview.

"Destiny is a fucking load of bullshit" - Jeff Gerstmann

@frodobaggins: He was right. He was always right. He was like the woman from that twilight zone episode. "ITS A COOKBOOK!"

"IT'S A MONETIZATION SCAM!"

@slag: It's crazy to think about now, but a year ago NOBODY had a bad word to say about Bungie. Fans, press, industry. They were one of the few sacred cows. Now? I thought Jeff sitting down with that clown was doing Bungie a favor. He was respectful and restrained. Most outlets are either hostile or already out the door.

Maybe it was from the intense atmosphere at E3, or maybe he was under the influence of something, but Luke Smith really lost it there.

It's a really small addition, but it's featured in a game that is largely devoted to collecting cool things. If you've paid full price for the standard game and every bit of content as they've been released on day one, you shouldn't have some idiot telling their customers to buy everything again if they want a small piece of content.

The thing is, "it's only" is a two-way street. If it's ONLY a few emotes that don't really matter, than you should have no problem giving them away to everyone who has been paying for your game since the beginning.

It's not logical, other than hoping that hardcore fans will pay for everything again, just so their game is "compete." It's a load of bullshit. Hardcore fans might suck it up and buy the 40 dollar update anyway, but Bungie probably just pissed off a lot of fence-sitting fans who weren't sure if they were going to pickup the update or not. After this nonsense, I'm going to find it much easier to skip the DLC for a while, if I even bother getting it at all.

@spaceinsomniac: Even if Bungie got in front of all this and released all that stuff for free to existing players as a peace offering, it doesn't change the basic philosophy at work. As you said, it isn't about the emotes. It's about charging a kings ransom for content so spare, the free Witcher DLC dwarfs it.

2 things

1: Why does the euro gamer guy keep saying that it costs the same as the base game? $40 is a lot but $40 does not equal $60 last time I checked? Seems dishonest to me. Is this some pounds conversation I'm not understanding? Is it $60 in England and 40 in USA?

2: wait, I gotta to buy the other expansions to be able to get this one? Fuck. That. Noise.

@koolaid: 40 Euro not $40

40 Euros is usually the cost of a new release retail title.

Well for one, GBP not USD. Two I was in target the other day and they had Destiny for $24 AUD, shows how well the game has retained it's value...

At no point did Luke Smith mention that there was actually enough content to justify the purchase. If there's any talking point he should be presenting it shouldn't be throwing money at a screen for emotes. Maybe bungie just wanted to make a physical pressed copy so that they can truly compete for most disappointing game of the year.. again?

@bocam said:

Thanks for this. I saw people shouting about the numbers elsewhere and didn't realize it was different than a normal game's launch. That part is messed up.

As we've seen with Arkham Knight though, if the game is good, people have a tendency to forget the past. I personally don't think The Taken King is what will get people back on board. I love Destiny, and TTK just seems like more of the same, which is great for me but won't win back anyone they lost last year.

@koolaid: Wait... Destiny is STILL $60 new at retailers? Wow. Throughout that whole interview, I was under the impression that the base game was $40 new. Good lord.. now my question is why?

This is like a whole 'nother level of fucking abhorrent corporate greed. I hope Jeff and Brad tear into this on the next Bombcast.

Jeff will, Brad won't.

Considering what Bungie has previously charged for Destiny $40 should come as no surprise. I would expect the expansion to add about 4h-5h of content which bring the total up to about 15hours after 3 expansions and over $100 spend.

It's not really Luke's place to answer why people in the UK are paying $24 dollars more, that should be a question aimed at Activision UK.

DLC is just garbage these days. I dont know why people buy season passes on anything. I cant recall the last time a DLC was worth the money. If it is not a actually expansion to the game, its just shit filler content. Even then half the time expansions dont end up being great content that makes me feel good for buying it.

Ive never had a real problem with Microsoft. People love to hate on them, but fuck...Activision has just GUTTED Bungie. Ive never seen a company fall so far in such a short time frame. I actually liked Destiny too. I felt ripped off, lied to, the story was abysmal, but it scratched that loot whore itch. I put a lot of hours into it. I quit just before the first DLC. Glad I did, I wont give them more money for piddling content. I thought maybe they could get their act together and make Destiny 2 a good game that might be worth buying. That obviously is not going to happen, and I wont be supporting the franchise.

I think the heat Luke Smith himself is getting here is a bit too far, and misplaced in my opinion. I think people have every right to criticize the pricing scheme of the collector's edition, which is especially punishing to existing players, but it's not as though he could really speak out against it. He is the creative director, not the business executives at Activision that are setting the prices. Sure, he gave a terrible interview and came off incredibly arrogant, but he's not the one setting prices.

The interviewer put him in really tough spot with those questions, which he attempted to handle with humor, but it clearly didn't work. It's not as though he's gonna come out and say "Yeah, my bosses are really trying to fuck people over with the pricing, but my team worked really hard on the game so please buy it anyway." He had no choice but to tow the company line, and clearly he doesn't have the media training to have done that effectively.

I guess the point I'm making here is: let's blame the right people, the suits at Bunige and Activision that set the prices. Piling on a game designer that got put in a tough position and handled it poorly is not where the majority of the anger should be directed.

let's not all crucify brad at once, guys!

there's an audience for this stuff, otherwise it wouldn't be selling. brad is obviously part of that audience, and it scratches a particular itch for him. more power to him, i say. hell, i haven't even really played destiny and i'm with those who are just kinda sick of all the endless hate dumped on it for no reason. if you don't like it, fine. vote with your wallet; it will be the best way to effect change. feel free to express your opinions (hopefully rationally, but god knows neither i nor anyone else can force you), but live and let live and let those who truly enjoy the game have their enjoyment.

e: also people should kill it with the exreme superlatives. this isn't genocide in africa, this is a DLC for a game you play for entertainment.

e2: not trying to harp on you korwin, just annoyed at the general sppitefullness towards brad and others that enjoy the game. i know you weren't being particularly harsh on him.

@oursin_360: Honestly, I think the interview was fair, but Luke decided to respond like a child - besides the awful messaging Bungie has decided to go with.

In any way you look at it, this expansion is a huge mess. As someone who bought the digital deluxe edition on launch, and have been on the fence about it, this really pushes me over. Done with it.

I get that he came across really poorly in the interview. But why are people upset that a special collectors edition of the game comes with special collectors edition things unique to it? This is not a common and expected practice?

Seems like making a mountain out of a molehill.

£40 is $63. £40 is the price of a new game.

Also wowee that interview is bad. Those responses are pretty unreasonable.

@hh: I think he meant GBP. $40 GBP is $63 USD (the cost of a game in USA). For contrast, the new batman costs $40 GBP, so his point stands. $40 GBP is pretty much the cost of a brand new AAA.

@jslack: Yeah, in this interview they're talking about GBP (£).

The expansion is releasing for $40 in the US. It's also releasing for €40 in the countries of Europe that use the Euro. And in the UK (who stayed out of the Euro), it's £40.

£40 (average price of a full new title like Witcher 3, Batman) is $63. €40 is $44. The guys in the UK are being totally shafted on the price of this DLC. The average price of a new game like Witcher 3, Batman in the Eurozone is €70 (roughly $78).

That's an absurd price to pay for what looks like less than one third of the original game. Bungie or Activision or both, whoever is setting the prices, are out of their fucking minds.

As is whoever decided to put extra content into the Ultimate Edition that people who've been around since day one and who have already met the requirements for TTK cannot get.

Every time over the last year of it's life that Bungie get called out on something shitty in their game or their practices, their defence comes across as "No no, we couldn't possibly do anything other than that. You guys are just wrong".

You already had your collectors edition Bungie. Some of them cost upwards of $150. If you're not willing to give the die hard fan who gave you $150 some fucking emotes, then you've got a really, really warped sense of how to keep customer loyalty. Or you just don't care.

Actually they aren't. They are in it for big profits, and taking advantage of a common practice. Same numeric price value independently of the currency of the market. People have been well accepting of it till now, it shouldn't constitute too much of a problem this time.

@jesus_phish: Ah, ok I guess that explains some of the confusion, they are releasing drastically different prices in each region. I overlooked that. Another example of terrible PR and marketing for Destiny. Also as a side note, euro pricing is crazy on amazon, a lot of discounts on stuff. I do see most games available for EUR 59,99