In Dragon Age games and many RPGs like it you have the ability to let party members go or outright refuse their offer to join you. I've never understood this since even if i didn't use them in combat I still liked talking to most of them in camp for their back stories.

The only game I have found myself releasing party members in the mount and blade series, since internal strife in your camp can get really annoying. Outside that I have never let a party member go in any other RPG.

Have you ever had a reason to let a party member go in an RPG?

I think it's just the proverbial meaningless choice option a la the end in GTA V.

Maybe if there was a companion I particularly did not like. I can't think of any good examples though.

@zeik: Like any Bioware game you just completely ignore the characters you don't like (i.e. the non Wrex/Garrus cast of Mass Effect), no reason to delete them from the game as far as I can tell.

@fredchuckdave: That's how I felt, the only members I have ever lost in a BioWare RPG are the ones that have turned on me in Dragon Age and KOTOR

I'm thinking less indifference and more actually despising a character and wanting to excise their existence from the game as much as possible. Can't think of any good examples off the top of my head though.

You know, it's interesting. The only RPG I have ever played where making a choice like that has any actual sway on the game world is Dark Souls and Demon's Souls. All other RPGs, when they give you that choice, I never see a reason to say no or tell someone to leave. In Dark/Demon's Souls it's a matter of letting people out of cages, prisons, rooms guarded by monsters or not and then they can either be helpful to you or kill everyone at the hub- or something in between. In other RPGs it feels like they only give you that choice if you find a party member annoying or maybe if you can only have so many people in your party. It has no other impact on the world beyond "do you want to hang out with them."

That's just something this thread made me think about.

I've never denied any party members up front, because honestly why would you? You probably don't even know anything about them at that point, so that's just stupid.

As for dismissing guys later: That's also not something I ever do. I only lost some party members in Baldur's Gate and games like that, since I tend to play chaotic evil guys, and that doesn't sit all too well with some guys.

Generally speaking I mostly play an evil dude, but am also nice to my party members. You know, be nice to your friends, fuck everyone/everything else. It's a philosophy really.

@sessh: Romantic/Jolly Dialogue interspersed with murdering people, it's just the Bioware way.

In Origins I killed Zevran, because he was a dirty assassin trying to ambush me, and I was roleplaying an ignorant brute. I usually didn't pick up Sten, either, because I found him super boring, usually played a dps character so Sten wasn't necessary, and it's kind of a hassle to get him out of that cage if you don't have high persuasion or a lot of money.

In New Vegas/Skyrim I never used any companions because I found them all lame and/or buggy. Fuck that Dawnguard DLC.

In Origins I had to kill Alistair, Wynn AND Lelienna in one of my playthroughs because I corrupted the Urn of Sacred Ashes.

I almost let Sera go, gave it a good 30 seconds of thought as I considered how likely it was she was going to stab me in the back later in the game ala Neverwinter Nights 2. Kicking her out of the party wouldn't help though, would it? She could still turn on me so long as I don't have a chance to put her down.

In my first playthrough of Mass Effect, I killed Wrex. Actually, I had Ashley kill him for me. I really liked that choice too. Never liked the Krogan. I altered my canon save, however, when it became apparent that future Mass Effects would yield rewards for keeping him alive and give only irrelevant NPCs if you did not. If you fuck him over in 3, that scene is downright brutal.

I would almost prefer if these games came up with ways to force you to choose your core party to the exclusion of others than give you this huge cast of characters that is effectively useless to you. Sort of like the Anders decision at the end of DA2, except early enough in the game to actually be relevant.

In old Bioware games people would refuse to join your party if you acted a certain way. Devs these days are just scared of the idea of punishing the player for the sake immersion and story.

The only DA party member I have ever denied was Zevron. Because the very first time I played it and came across him, I had no idea he could be a part member, and he was trying to kill Liliana. So he had to die.

Also, I've played Inquisition for 15 hours, and I've yet to come across a new party member. But then again, 13 hours of that was spent in the Hinterlands trying to do every single thing I could before moving on.

Well it depends if you wanna roleplay or not doesnt it. Accepting all characters no matter their oppinion on things and just let them stand in the base and ignoring them is just plain stupid so i just say no if my main doesnt approve.

I wish the characters could also refuse to join buuuut it has to be focus tested for casual play and yada yada.

That'd be kinda cool if modern day rpgs took a page from Chrono Cross with the npc party invites. There's so many party members you could get access to with their own side stories but picking one would block you from adding a certain set of characters and so forth. It really made you want to do a second play through just to add characters you didn't get access to the first time around.

I usually pick them all up, even though I have several I don't typically use in a given playthrough. Also, I just got to Skyhold, and the way they're setting up the upgrade stuff, I could totally see some sort of "base defense" scenario like in Awakenings where the members not in your party are defending the keep.

Really, the only one I'm seriously considering cutting loose is Sera. She is the only BioWare character I have ever had a visceral dislike of. They've had some boring ones, but never one that makes want to gouge out my own ear-drums. If I need a ranged rogue, I usually just roll with Varric so she doesn't have much use right now.

On this subject, how fucking cool would it be if there was an RPG built around the idea of recruiting 5-8 team members, but only realistically being able to keep two or three 'til the end, being pushed by real repercussions? Like, two of the members hate each other (racial or personal reasons) and if you don't ditch one of them, one of them ends up killing the other. Or a person who's just literally an enemy spy who will undermine your mission, or even kill one of your members and blame another, and you have to sniff them out and deal with them, and if you choose wrong, you don't find out until the final boss battle when he/she betrays you and now you're at even more of a disadvantage. Oh, man...

Sorry, to answer the question, I've done things like this in Mass Effect and the like, but only for role-playing reasons. I would almost never ditch a party member if I didn't have real motivation, and games very rarely provide you with that. Granted, I haven't played very many CRPGs in my time, and that seems like the genre that kind of stuff would appear in.

Now, I think I have to go breathe into a paper bag for a while.

Immediately killed Wynne in my first DA: Origins playthrough, Zevran during the second.

Killed Elanee in Neverwinter Nights 2. Qara and Sand respectively during different playthroughs.

Killed Ignus and Vhailor respectively during different Planescape: Torment playthroughs. Fall-From-Grace too, by accident.

Killed Minsc, Korgan, Keldorn and Aerie during various Baldur's Gate 2 games. Dynaheir in BG 1.

Killed many, many of the characters in Alpha Protocol between all my games but those aren't tradtional companions, strictly speaking.

Probably various Fallout characters over the course of the series as well. Some of those playthroughs get really sociopathic! That's it off the top of my head. I really enjoy games that don't just treat potentially allied characters as assets and make it a viable (as opposed to just bone-headed) option to treat them as hostile entities. Bonus points if you literally cannot ally with everybody at once.

There's plenty of reason to in some games, Dragon Age Origins is a good example with how some characters could turn against you depending on how you acted. For me it was Sven and Leliana in that game, and they made it feel very good to get rid of them.

Peacefully lost the Paladin guy in Baldur's Gate 2, though that was so long ago I don't remember any specifics.

Some people at the end of Knights of the Old Republic.

Definitely some in KotOR 2 aswell.

In retrospect after writing this post it seems to me that you have to play as a character that really wants to please everyone if you are able to get through most Bioware games without losing at least someone. I have more fun choosing the character morality and having to deal with the repercussions of it.

i actually havent till DAI and it was sera.i got rid of her because she did something in her special quest i couldnt forgive,which was killing someone without me giving the ok and who i actually wanted to not die.she said and did lots of things before hand that i didnt like,but as long as she listened to orders and did her job i could deal with her being in the inquisition.then this quest came up where she just kills a guy without reason and without orders,so i told her off and kicked her out.whats funny is she was furious that i never ordered her to do it and when i kicked her out she seemed really upset.whatever,she will be fun for a bad guy playthrough.

I fucking love how flexible the party system was in Origins. You yourself could potentially kill (if not tell to fuck off) nearly every character in that game.

I find Sera exceptionally annoying but she just sits in my camp so who really cares?

BG2 certainly had situations where the player had to make choices between party members to prevent internal conflicts or outright violence between two different party members. From memory, Keldorn tended to have a problem with evil party members and Edwin with various individuals. Aerie was just flat-out irritating so I gave her the boot not long after recruiting her.

@nasp: There was a pretty damn strong reason if it's the quest I'm thinkin' of. Also the only quest where I did not Investigate every possible thing because she starts getting increasingly erratic about stalling for time.

I don't know how well she'd actually fit for a more villainous character. I think she'd actually disapprove left and right for a lot of out and out cruelty.

yeah you have to be talking about the same quest as me.she goes crazy and before you can get any info from the person she kills him.constantly annoys you because she CANT FATHOM wanting to not kill someone for no reason.now that you mention it you are right,she wouldnt approve anybodys choices.so at this point i really hate her,not because shes a bad character,but because she is very random in everyway possible.which not only not makes her not trustworthy,but also makes her ruin operations from crazy antics.if biowares objective with sera was to piss you off so much that you wanted to kick them out,they did an AMAZING job.

I mean there is a great reason for her to despise that noble and he's kind of a huge dick so I was like sure do whatever you want.

She's also anything but random, everything she does is for a pretty singular purpose, her methods are just consistently nutty.

Some character disapproves you helping other characters, so there's that, I guess. Vivienne didn't like me letting Cole stay, for example.

nutty was more of what i ment instead of random,although i still feel shes a little random because she just does crazy stuff out of nowhere.either way she did something crazy without my permission,so i kicked her out.kinda wish i could have had the option to put her in a cell,but whatever atleast i dont have to see her anymore.

Far as I can tell you can only really ditch a few of them. I'd love to get the prick Solas out of my castle but Im not given the option.

Sera is the first party member I've kicked out in an RPG.

Man, I can't believe how many people dislike Sera. She's my favorite. This happened tonight while I was playing and it was great.

this is the exact scene i chose to kick her out of the inquisition lol.

Sera and Cole are the best. I wish more of the cast were like them. Like who the hell is going "Blackwall. Super paintbunumbers grey warden. Coulda been a random NPC. Greatest of all time" Same with Solis. I hope the devs ignore the people who want anything diverging from the tedious high fantasy template out of the game. That eccentric crazy stuff is the only thing keeping me invested really.

I just wish I could add certain prisoners to my party. Feels like a missed opportunity that you never get to recruit a companion by way of taking them prisoner and rending judgement.

Yeah, the scene is the reason I kicked her out too. It's when I realized that she's a violent psychopath who made no sense as a member of a war effort. It's not that she's bad character or anything, she's just unlikable for a chunk of people.

And I actually like Blackwall. I was expecting for him to be a boring character, but he's a genuinely decent guy who's not a great hero, but wants to help out. I'm glad Bioware stepped back from the Dragon Age 2 approach of making every single character over the top in some way or another. There's room for characters like Blackwall and Cassandra who are down to earth and relatable.

Characters like Cole and Iron Bull (and Sera if you think she isn't terrible) only work if they stand out from the rest of the party. If everyone is Kramer, Kramer isn't funny. Strange or quirky characters only work if others are somewhat normal by comparison.

I think there's a middle ground, though. Like Vivian and Dorian hit that because they have eccentricities but they're not sentient golems or a ghost possessing a human, etc.

But like Solis, I kept digging and digging hoping there was more to this dude, he's entirely boring and a wasted character slot. I don't think you need everyone to be crazy but its not neccesary to have tedious characters in the party to "ground" everything. I don't love ME but none of those characters felt like filler. They were different levels of eccentric, there was no dullard acting as control.

I just feel like I'm missing something with Cole due to not knowing anything about Asunder and that's keeping me from being all that interested in his character. It's probably not even the case but that's the costant feeling I have listening to him.

I think everyone else is pretty great though. Solas, Blackwall, Sera and all. Sera especially.

Does kicking Chobot out of the Normandy count?

I would get rid of Sera if she werent the only half decent Rogue. (need her for lock picking unfortunately)

@demoskinos: Hah, that's very good to see! Seems like Sera might very well be my kind of character. Sort of like Zevran if he wasn't completely useless and late to the fucking party from a gameplay perspective. I'm in the same spot as with DA2 though. The game seems way too far off from what I want out of a proper RPG in this vein but it has some cool characters and an interesting world. Maybe I'll play it someday when DA:O is a distant memory and I might be able to appreciate the rest of the franchise as the solid fantasy ARPG it has become.

I've heard that Solas only opens up if you befriend him, which is hard, because he seems to disapprove of every choice I make. Right now, he seems like he never has anything to say when I try to talk to him. Solas is okay, but all the other mages suck compared to Dorian.

@joetom: Hard? You mean it's possible to even get disapproval from Solas? He's literally responded positively to every choice I've made in the game. I can't imagine what kind of asshole your making your character out to be if he disapproves of you.

But yes, he starts to show a little bit more emotion when you start in on his personal quest. He sort of becomes Mr. Spock in the new Star Trek movies - generally calm, but when he loses it, he f'ing loses it and starts beating the shit out of people.

Solas basically just loves anything that involves you learning things from him, so almost all Investigate options are approval gains.

The only time I've seen disapproval is for just being kind of stubbornly close minded about certain topics. The demons aren't your friends dammit!

Short question: Are there even people, besides Sera, you can just kick out of the Inquisition after initially saying yes to them? Sera is the only one who has the dialogue option show up, right? Which is really weird by the way.

ROLE PLAYING game.

That's the thing. I explored all that stuff cus he's a human(elvin) thesaurus when it comes to the fade. One of the big choices he super disagreed with, though, and now he's just like "fuck you this is a job for me". I gave him a flower hat and now I like him a little more. But still.

They probably knew some people would find her annoying. I don't btw.

Yeah, I get that. I just don't understand their reasoning behind a) designing a character, they think so many people will just hate, that she needs to have a permanent "kick out" option and b) just assuming that everyone will like all the other characters, so they don't get that option.

Personally I like Sera and really don't care for Vivienne at all (she's so damn boring). I mean I still wouldn't kick her out, but I'm just saying.

She has the most personality on the team; she's kinda the only comic relief character and I like her powers a lot. Cole is too creepy to use and Blackwall too generic, but I wouldn't kick them out. I would kick out Ashley from Mass Effect if that was an option, since she's annoying and racist against aliens.

I experienced this last night myself, and promptly kicked her the fuck out. I didn't tell her to kill him though. I was trying to talk to the man and she just did that anyways. Pissed me off. Also pissed me off that she left with the gear she had equipped. It didn't auto remove it from her.

I don't get why everyone else just isn't killing him. He set you up in a trap to die. Way I figure it Sera had every reason to be pissed.

@demoskinos: I agree. Also Sera gives you multiple warnings to stop talking to him or she'll just kill him. If you for whatever the reason really want to ally with that slimy guy you simply have to do that without exhausting all the dialogue options.

Also it's not like this is really ultra violent or anything, certainly not for a DA game.