Are humans intelligent or just dumb?

@Surkov: I know exactly what goes into theories I'm not stupid, I wouldnt just say these things without knowing about what a theory is. You still are just stating facts about how theories are made that dont contradict anything I'm saying in any way.

Scientists have no right to be self righteous, they only observe and use logic to determine what may or may not be true but then in turn anyone can look at that information and from their own ideas, so just because they did the research doesnt mean they have more right than anyone else to observe it and give an opinion on it.

Also logic is first and foremost in everything. Logic is what makes us humans and what makes us more intelligent than other creatures. Science is simply the product of logic and its how we use logic to further our knowledge and understanding. Scientists are constantly defying logic for no other reason than to make themselves seem smart and try to understand things they have no right to even try to understand because chances are everything they think in these areas is false because we dont have access to get the adequate way to achieve enough accurate information to even assume the most basic of things.

@ElBarto said:

@FilipHolm said:

We are too intelligent for our own good. Animals have none of the problems that we face every day. No wars, no nothing. So yeah, technically we are very intelligent, but at the same time oh so stupid

Animals kill each other all the time.

Read about chimps. Absolutely terrifying.

@SpikeSpiegel said:

@ElBarto said:

@FilipHolm said:

We are too intelligent for our own good. Animals have none of the problems that we face every day. No wars, no nothing. So yeah, technically we are very intelligent, but at the same time oh so stupid

Animals kill each other all the time.

Read about chimps. Absolutely terrifying.

How about dolphins? A group of males will keep a female dolphin hostage and rape her repeatedly for months at a time.

 Humans are wasting the resources of the earth. I mean, EXTREME wasting. But we have to do that, because our brain would not feel good if we didn't stimulated it a lot. Humans also have a very weird concept that weak and sick people should live with artificial help. In nature, weak animals becomes pray of predators, or if parents discovers that there's something wrong with their baby, they usually kill it to keep the genes strong.  Because weak people with serious diseases live on and create offspring, the human race has a lot of weaknesses that are inherit in our genes. Bad vision means we need glasses. Bad hearts mean we need to take medicine every day.  And so on. This is not a problem in nature where weak or sick offspring is killed off to make room for the strong.  Of course, this is because our unique emotional feelings that separates us from most other animals. But I'm starting to think that emotions are actually a weakness. That our "supreme" intelligence is just an evolutional malfunction that causes wars, destruction and waste.  You often hear that mankind has conqured the earth. What? 70% of the earth are oceans, and no humans live in oceans.  I think people should waste and consume less. Compare it to the evolution of video games:  Games in the 80s were just as fun as games are today. I mean back then, they were just as fun. But then we heightened the standard. Not content with all the great fun, we wanted more and more and more and more... it's in our flawed nature.

Japanese, Chinese, Asians in general all top IQ tests on average.  Intellectual and scientific progress was hampered for centuries by the church so I say we can, and must take action:  1) Nuke God. 2) Nuke Christians and other people of faith. 3) Nuke the black, the white, but especially the Welsh.  Chips and cheese is not a proper dinner.4) Nuke the science haters.  They're clearly chronically illogical. 5) Nuke anyone who likes mucking about, or looks a bit daft.

@DoctorWelch:

If you think a physicist claims to know everything then you clearly know nothing about physicists. Stephen Hawking is trying to understand the universe better and that is all.

And your claim that scientists just "accept" what Hawking's says is laughable at best. There are a countless number of scientists that go to work every day trying to disprove his theories.

@DoctorWelch said:

all they did was think up a bunch of shit that may or may not have some basis in reality and can not be proven correct or wrong which is why it stays a theory.

Oh wait, thanks for putting this in your argument and completely proving that you have no business talking about a scientific subject. In the scientific community, theory means something that has NEVER been proven false and is known to be true with the technology that we currently have. Thanks for proving that you actually have no idea what you are talking about with one little sentence.

(I know what you are thinking now, and no, this does not mean we accept things as true too easily, in order to become a theory, millions of scientists world wide have tested it and not been able to disprove it. Even then, if someone were to come up with a test that could disprove a theory it would be thrown out the window and scientists world wide would go back to the drawing board.)

At this point I would go into depth about how it is possible we know so much about black holes(we don't know everything about them, no one ever said we did, not even Hawking) (Hint: gravity) but I doubt your ability to understand such a complicated subject when you don't even know what a scientific theory means.

PS Your post makes you sound like the "arrogant, self righteous, and childish people" that you try to make scientists sound like.

PPS I like the last sentence of your post, perfect defense really, spout a bunch of nonsense then throw in at the end "You are dumb if you try to argue against what i say."

Also, I don't think you know what logic means.

So...what you're saying is that we should all act like animals? 

I like turtles

@Surkov: I know exactly what goes into theories I'm not stupid, I wouldnt just say these things without knowing about what a theory is. You still are just stating facts about how theories are made that dont contradict anything I'm saying in any way.

Scientists have no right to be self righteous, they only observe and use logic to determine what may or may not be true but then in turn anyone can look at that information and from their own ideas, so just because they did the research doesnt mean they have more right than anyone else to observe it and give an opinion on it.

Also logic is first and foremost in everything. Logic is what makes us humans and what makes us more intelligent than other creatures. Science is simply the product of logic and its how we use logic to further our knowledge and understanding. Scientists are constantly defying logic for no other reason than to make themselves seem smart and try to understand things they have no right to even try to understand because chances are everything they think in these areas is false because we dont have access to get the adequate way to achieve enough accurate information to even assume the most basic of things.

If you base intelligence on the human race, then call the human race dumb, you are dumb.

I was really hoping "do you philosophy?" would have become some kind of Giant Bomb meme by this point in the thread.

Compare it to the evolution of video games:  Games in the 80s were just as fun as games are today. I mean back then, they were just as fun. But then we heightened the standard. Not content with all the great fun, we wanted more and more and more and more... it's in our flawed nature.

@Surkov: 1. Yes, if your friend knows all the information as the doctor, but the only difference is the doctor did the research but your friend understand the research and the results of it than yes, his opinion is just as valid.

2. Ugh, this is exactly what I'm saying, this seems to always be the response half the time "Well its just too complex man, you just dont understand it" which is the biggest bunch of bull shit I have ever heard. I, in fact, do understand a lot more than you are assuming but you dont have to believe that. In essence what I know doesnt matter though because even the simplest of minds can understand that if something can not be determined to be or not to be than there is no point in dwelling on it. Because if the former is not true then any person could say anything, claim things they observe that suggest it to be true, but have no real accurate data or even a way to accurately find the data they need to support it, and than have people accept that to be what is truth or may possibly be truth. This is how scientists treat certain topics now and because of this they are ignoring the rule of logic I stated above. Therefore discussing or thinking about things like String Theory is completely and utterly pointless because it is just as much science fiction as anything else until there are viable accurate was of gather any evidence at all that such a thing is even a moderately good possibility because right now the chance that its concepts arent true are just as good as the chance that its concepts are true.

Also that bio was made about 3 years ago so my schooling has changed and I am now, obviously, 22 but that shouldnt really matter. Also I really dont know what the rest of what you were talking about has anything to do with what I'm saying right here. The earth does what it does and we know this because of we have accurate viable ways of measuring things and like you've said, we observed and reproduced something over and over and that is how we find it to be true. Even so though, logic is the only thing that allows these discoveries and things to come to pass, yes you have to think outside the box to begin finding new ways to think about things but in order to think about them and then see if they are true you need the logic of what you previously know to build off of. This still is just random facts about how science works and i dont know why you are bringing them up. This is all basic science stuff that anyone whose taken a couple science classes should know.

From how you're responding I dont think you completely understand the things I am saying. If you respond to this one with something other than basic rules of science and want to have a real discussion than thats fine but if you dont understand by now than you are just refusing to try to understand what I'm saying so Im not just going to repeat myself over and over.

I was really hoping "do you philosophy?" would have become some kind of Giant Bomb meme by this point in the thread.

@DoctorWelch: you're totally right

I keep telling people that the Earth doesn't orbit the sun, the sun is just a circle of light that is created every morning at the edge of the Earth then ceases to exist when it reaches the opposite edge. I know because I determined it logically from my observations and hence it is immediately fact or at least just as valid as any other scientific theory.

Also if we don't understand something we shouldn't try to understand it, we should just accept we don't know how it works. After all our scientific knowledge is exactly the same as it was at the beginning of man.

@NickL said:

@DoctorWelch:

If you think a physicist claims to know everything then you clearly know nothing about physicists. Stephen Hawking is trying to understand the universe better and that is all.

And your claim that scientists just "accept" what Hawking's says is laughable at best. There are a countless number of scientists that go to work every day trying to disprove his theories.

@DoctorWelch said:

all they did was think up a bunch of shit that may or may not have some basis in reality and can not be proven correct or wrong which is why it stays a theory.

Oh wait, thanks for putting this in your argument and completely proving that you have no business talking about a scientific subject. In the scientific community, theory means something that has NEVER been proven false and is known to be true with the technology that we currently have. Thanks for proving that you actually have no idea what you are talking about with one little sentence.

(I know what you are thinking now, and no, this does not mean we accept things as true too easily, in order to become a theory, millions of scientists world wide have tested it and not been able to disprove it. Even then, if someone were to come up with a test that could disprove a theory it would be thrown out the window and scientists world wide would go back to the drawing board.)

At this point I would go into depth about how it is possible we know so much about black holes(we don't know everything about them, no one ever said we did, not even Hawking) (Hint: gravity) but I doubt your ability to understand such a complicated subject when you don't even know what a scientific theory means.

PS Your post makes you sound like the "arrogant, self righteous, and childish people" that you try to make scientists sound like.

PPS I like the last sentence of your post, perfect defense really, spout a bunch of nonsense then throw in at the end "You are dumb if you try to argue against what i say."

Also, I don't think you know what logic means.

To the first part. Thats not what Im saying at all. Im saying that trying to discuss or even disprove his theories about certain things are completely and utterly pointless because half the stuff he says can neither be accept as truth (or even partial truth) and it also cant be disregarded as completely false because neither thing is possible for us to attain the knowledge necessarily to prove or disprove. Thats not to say he probably doesnt think fairly complex and the things he say can possibly be, and thats not to say that he hasnt done some things that display his intelligence. But as I have tried to explain about 10 time so far in this thread, some of the things he says have no basis in reality and, although what he says may be interesting, it still should not be taken as anything but a nice scifi idea that could possible exist but we have no real reason to believe it is either true or false.

T.o the second part. Yet again, you are another person just giving me obvious rules about how science works and how theories are made that anyone who has taken a few science classes knows and it doesnt pertain to what I am specifically talking about. Its not about proving something false in this case because I could say anything I want to and if we dont have any accurate way of calculating anything having to do with that then it cant be proven false. This is where science depends on logic. In order for science to work properly you need to first determine whether the ways you are calculating or observing are accurate enough to assume anything of meaning. Logic is solely at play here to determine this variable. Things may never be proven false if the tools arent accurate. So if there is any way to foresee a future where obviously more accurate observations and means to gather data will come up than you should actively disregard an extreme attempt to make these calculations and observations. So in the case of black holes, anything anyone says or "discovers" on the subject is completely and utterly useless until there is a truly accurate way of knowing these things we are assuming. Trying to say that we even know the smallest percentage about anything outside of our solar system always makes me laugh because trying to say that there are actual accurate ways of determining anything out there with the tools we have now is completely and utterly stupid and blind.

You can take what I'm saying as arrogant but until you let go of your previous assumptions and actually take a real attempt at understanding what I am saying than I dont really care if you think I'm arrogant.

Putting words in my mouth is pointless and immature. I never said anything close to that so I dont even know what you are talking about.

And lastly, I know exactly what logic is and means. I could just sit here and say that you dont understand what insert word means, but I dont really see how that promotes discussion. I doubt I will respond to you any more because chances are you will never actually try to discuss anything with me maturely.

@Titus said:

@fraser said:

I was really hoping "do you philosophy?" would have become some kind of Giant Bomb meme by this point in the thread.

This. Always this.

I was going to study for my test but then I just philosophy and I was ready.

@imsh_pl said:

@DoctorWelch said:

@Surkov: I know exactly what goes into theories I'm not stupid, I wouldnt just say these things without knowing about what a theory is. You still are just stating facts about how theories are made that dont contradict anything I'm saying in any way.

Scientists have no right to be self righteous, they only observe and use logic to determine what may or may not be true but then in turn anyone can look at that information and from their own ideas, so just because they did the research doesnt mean they have more right than anyone else to observe it and give an opinion on it.

Also logic is first and foremost in everything. Logic is what makes us humans and what makes us more intelligent than other creatures. Science is simply the product of logic and its how we use logic to further our knowledge and understanding. Scientists are constantly defying logic for no other reason than to make themselves seem smart and try to understand things they have no right to even try to understand because chances are everything they think in these areas is false because we dont have access to get the adequate way to achieve enough accurate information to even assume the most basic of things.

There's a nice video which pretty much sums up why you're not right at all:

Read what I am writing again and actually try to understand it. Everything in this video is obvious and it in now way contradicts anything I am saying so I dont really see what the point of you posting this is. If you think anything in there "proves" me wrong than I suggest you open your mind and actually try to understand what I am saying. Take out all my opinions of Hawking and disregard my personal bias and just try to understand the concepts I am communicating and if you truly do that I'm pretty sure you will find them sound. If you find a real problem with my thinking then I will listen but until then I wont respond again. I am open to discussing this with people who want to be in a real discussion, but I guess I shoudnt expect anything more form a forum.

@Titus said:

@fraser said:

I was really hoping "do you philosophy?" would have become some kind of Giant Bomb meme by this point in the thread.

This. Always this.

I was going to study for my test but then I just philosophy and I was ready.

People aren't wasteful because of a biological shortcoming. They are wasteful because certain groups haven't kicked Industrial Revolution era practices. It's hard to make people radically change their lifestyle like that.

@DoctorWelch: So you're argument is that since we can't prove anything to the extent that you understand reality then no one should ever try to prove anything different?

How much would it take for you to accept something that someone says?

@Titus said:

@Mars_Cleric said:

@Titus said:

@fraser said:

I was really hoping "do you philosophy?" would have become some kind of Giant Bomb meme by this point in the thread.

This. Always this.

I was going to study for my test but then I just philosophy and I was ready.

I had a similar problem the other day at work. There was this deep, problematic moral dilemma that I couldn't figure out, but now thanks to the OP, I'll just philosophy and it'll be alright again. No more moral dilemma, just philosophy.

I think all human conflicts could be avoided if all countries got together and just philosophy.

Once we realise we can philosophy together I think the world will be a better place. For philosophy.

@Titus said:

@Mars_Cleric said:

@Titus said:

@fraser said:

I was really hoping "do you philosophy?" would have become some kind of Giant Bomb meme by this point in the thread.

This. Always this.

I was going to study for my test but then I just philosophy and I was ready.

I had a similar problem the other day at work. There was this deep, problematic moral dilemma that I couldn't figure out, but now thanks to the OP, I'll just philosophy and it'll be alright again. No more moral dilemma, just philosophy.

I think all human conflicts could be avoided if all countries got together and just philosophy.

Once we realise we can philosophy together I think the world will be a better place. For philosophy.

@oskar_det People are definitely intelligent, the human is a marvel of smart design. No wonder people think we are designed by a higher being because we work so perfectly so often. body is intelligently designed to keep itself alive under tremendous pain, excessive bleeding, attacks on the microscopic level and adapt to some of the harshest conditions physically and mentally. And we have the potential for such great insight into our emotions and the ability to entertain and love one another but on the flipside have the ability to cause unthinkable pain. What you have said goes against everything that makes us human, yes an ideal world could exist where nobody died and everyone got along, but this would be a world where everybody is a robot. Emotions are the defining factor of every individual, they make us unique they are our soul; they are definitely not a weakness! They are only a weakness when ignored.

@DoctorWelch: Please explain to me in a clear easy to read fashion your point of view, because from what i've gathered you disagree with Scientists because some of their theories cannot be true due to our limited technology?

This is the last thing Im going to post here in this thread and maybe everyone who doesnt understand or refuses to try will have a chance if they want and I will put it as simply as possible.

There are many theories discussed in science that are not even yet worth wasting time, resources, and brain power discussing or testing. This is because these theories can not be accurately tested and observed in any way resembling thorough because we do not yet have the tools to make such observations and tests. Therefore, no matter how many tests and observations are made to contradict the said theory, it can reasonably be expected that it would not be proven false. Although not proven false after any number of rigorous tests, if the tests and the observations acquired are not considered to be thorough because of an obviously limited number of tools available at the time, than there is no reason to think that said theory is in any way true. In the same way there is no reason to think that said theory is false in any way. Therefore time, resources, and brain power of the human race should be used to advance in ways where we have the appropriate tools and the ability to completely, accurately, and thoroughly test certain theories. In this way we will eventually develop the tools we need to accurately and thoroughly test previous theories that could not be before and we will do this faster because resources would not be wasted on trying to understand the things we do not yet have the means understand and testing.

There, that's pretty much it. Everyone that's responding to me is talking about things that we know about earth and easily observed. We know that we can accurately test these things as thoroughly as foreseeably possible. Therefore we can say that these theories are seen as facts and they turn into laws. And even after that process there is still the possibility that in the future new ways to testing and new tools will be created in order to test the theories and they may eventually be proven wrong. This is why I've been talking about logic, the only way to determine whether the tools we have are accurate and thorough is through logic. There is no way to test how accurate the tools are except for looking at what the theory is talking about and judging whether or not there are obvious foreseeable advances in our ability and tools to test the said theory that will come in the future.

So yeah its not a big deal that String Theory exists, or that people talk about certain theories, but to act like they are anything more than and idea is silly because we do not yet have the tools or means to accurately and thoroughly test these theories. Therefore any attempt to disprove them while this is true will fail, but this does not mean that the theory is in any way true or in any way false. It is simply an idea that may be true or could be just as false as any scifi idea written in a book. So in conclusion there is no reason for people to talk about or dwell on these things at all.

If you still dont understand than I cant help you.

  

  this.

I have worked customer service jobs for as long as I can remember.  Basically since I was 15 (38 now)  I currently work at a higher end grocery store here in Portland.  And in the 7 years that I have had this job,  I have come to the realization that the average persons  iq will e drop by at least 10 points as soon as they walk through the front doors.  It's mind boggling as to the amount of stupid shit we have to go through.
 
Really.....?  You need to ask where your basket goes after you unload it.......?  Really,.....?  You need to ask if I'm open when im standing at my register with the light on and I say hello to you?

 And while my job sucks,  I at least get a laugh at the rest of the idiots who cant find the entire aisle thats nothing but chips.

thats right animals didn't have any thinking capacity...so they are going so..but important think is humans are used their 1 % intelligence only...just think if they used their full energy, then they can make everything under their control...

thats right animals didn't have any thinking capacity...so they are going so..but important think is humans are used their 1 % intelligence only...just think if they used their full energy, then they can make everything under their control...

@philipsteele said:

(...)but important think is humans are used their 1 % intelligence only...just think if they used their full energy, then they can make everything under their control...

That's a common misconception. Not only that, you've got it wrong even there. The misconception is that we use only 10% of our brain at a time. I have no idea where you got that 1% of inteligence from.

@Meowshi: The only reason you think that, is because you're a human. A human who values those qualities, simply because he's human. To say everything else is crap compared to us, and that that's a fact, is an extraordinarily ignorant statement.

No, you're a piece of shit. 
 
My point is that you're better at being a piece of shit than any other animal on the planet.   
 
Animals have to work hard in order to gorge themselves on food or fuck constantly.   
 
But us?  We do that shit without breaking a sweat.  
 
No hunting down gazelle for us.  Just call up Pizza Hut. 
 
No bright feather plumage or complicated mating dances.  Just call up a damn hooker. 
 
WE 
 
ARE 
 
THE  
 
SHIT. 

@Mars_Cleric said:

@Titus said:

@Mars_Cleric said:

@Titus said:

@fraser said:

I was really hoping "do you philosophy?" would have become some kind of Giant Bomb meme by this point in the thread.

This. Always this.

I was going to study for my test but then I just philosophy and I was ready.

I had a similar problem the other day at work. There was this deep, problematic moral dilemma that I couldn't figure out, but now thanks to the OP, I'll just philosophy and it'll be alright again. No more moral dilemma, just philosophy.

I think all human conflicts could be avoided if all countries got together and just philosophy.

Once we realise we can philosophy together I think the world will be a better place. For philosophy.

For sure! I mean, look at these walls and walls of text people are writing, trying to explain things when all they have to do is just philosophy a bit and understand the alpha and omega of philosophy. It's all pretty silly: war, crime, sandals. Just philosophy!

Haven't you ever played Bioshock? Of course people live in the ocean!

@No0b0rAmA said:

@oskar_det said:

@No0b0rAmA said:

None of this is relevant to human intelligence.

I think it is, because it depends on how you define intelligence. Do you look at Wikipedia or do you philosophy to make your own definition?

Bad vision is bad intelligence?

What is intelligence to you? Is it to invent the car or to make sure to create strong offspring?

As an old saying goes, a person is brilliant. People tend to be savages.

Humans are very intelligent. We're also pretty dumb.

A person can be smart... It is when they get into groups they become morons.

We all start "dumb".

It's up to each of us to become intelligent, sadly most choose not to educate themselves properly.