Mass Effect 3 sucks, deal with it.

@Hailinel

@Brodehouse Well excuse me for apparently not having a clear memory then. You could have corrected me without the smug bullshit.

Aside from disagreeing with you, exactly what about what I said is 'smug'? Don't make this fucking personal.

(Insert everything I've said about Mass Effect 3 in the other 20 threads we had about it)

well that's ok mass effect 3 has decent cover mechanics so it'll recharge

@Hailinel I said you're either lying on purpose, or honestly just misremembering. You said its the latter. Which I had said in the first place, either you're intentionally misrepresenting it, or being candidly mistaken. What other options could there even be?

Arkham City wasn't overshadowed by Arkham Asylum, it was overshadowed by Skyrim.

WHAT WILL THOSE CRAZY BOMBCASTERS NOT BE IMPRESSED BY NEXT!?!?!?

@project343 said:

@WinterSnowblind: Did you just argue that Mass Effect 2 had a better story than Mass Effect 3? The fuck. Even with the shitty ending, Mass Effect 3's narrative is far more than a setup to meet great characters--there is some compelling shit in there.

It should have been compelling, but just wasn't. I really liked that ME1 was more or less a stand alone game that left wiggle room at the end to expand into further games. Turning it into a trilogy is the mistake too many franchises make, but ME2 still avoided getting bogged down in that, since it was mainly just about putting together a team for the suicide mission and taking out the Collectors, which worked, it was a fun adventure.

ME3 became all about the reapers and it was clear from the start that the writers didn't know what they were really about, or what to do with them. Besides a few emotional/dramatic character moments, ME3's story was an utter mess and this is why the ending turned out the way it did. I'm not in the camp that will pretend it was a horrible game, but it was certainly a disappointment and it'll be a long time before I ever want to play through it again.

As disappointing as ME3 may or may not have been, I really thought the MD award was going to go to Steel Battalion: Heavy Armor. The turn around on them saying that game looks kind of awesome with lots of potential, to the opening line of the QL being how much Brad hated that game seemed really abrupt. I guess Brad will now have to argue with himself to figure out which between SB:HA and RE6 will emerge ...victorious(?) in that particular GOTY discussion.

@Brodehouse: It was worse for a long period of time before E3 a lot people thought they were just making a pure action game Gears of War style it wasn't until the press got their hands with the demo where they told people "calm down! you still have skills and squad commands"

@Brodehouse

@Hailinel I said you're either lying on purpose, or honestly just misremembering. You said its the latter. Which I had said in the first place, either you're intentionally misrepresenting it, or being candidly mistaken. What other options could there even be?

Sorry. I just don't like when someone suggests I'm lying.

Mass Effect 3 was a good game and worth playing, but it was little disappointing, and certainly not the best game of the year, which isn't even over yet.

Not surprised, but it is a bit of a bummer. Mass Effect 3 and what I've played so far of Resident Evil 6 are my personal GOTY contenders, far and away. Which means this year's podcast will be practically worthless to me, and just completely depressing.

@Hailinel

@Brodehouse

@Hailinel I said you're either lying on purpose, or honestly just misremembering. You said its the latter. Which I had said in the first place, either you're intentionally misrepresenting it, or being candidly mistaken. What other options could there even be?

Sorry. I just don't like when someone suggests I'm lying.

We've been over this three times now. Spare the victim routine.

Idk guys. I think Dishonored may be a dark horse. Has this out of nowhere Bioshock buzz around it

ME3 to me just felt rushed. Not from the development side of things but from the player side. Every aspact of it just gave me that notion that the developer just wanted to get the players to the end of the game ASAP. The game did not take its time to build up and as such felt rushed and shallow. It's the same feeling you get at a resutrant when the waiter hands you the bill even before you took one bite out of your meal.

@BisonHero said:

Haha, yeah they pretty clearly implied that it had a shot at "Biggest Disappointment" except now RE6 is likely going to steal that category.

RE6 will get into the runner's up line-up but I doubt it'll win out right since Jeff and Ryan didn't have anything like high hopes for it beforehand anyway.

When I finished Mass Efffect 3 the first time, I thought I might play it again six months later again, something like that. Lo and behold, I did indeed pop that sucker back in a week or two ago. Now, I still say play the game if you liked the first two, and I remember disliking the part I began playing, but the game just didn't do anything for me. I don't want to touch it again. Like, ever. The first two, yeah, but I can go without the conclusion.

In stark contrast to that, I've played the first hour of Sleeping Dogs and all I want to do is go back to it. I know that's the first hour but first impressions of that game are strong, and from everything I've heard it does not disappoint. Mass Effect 3 has been my GOTY 2012 so far by default because it's the only 2012 game I've really played to completion that I can think of, but I knew it wouldn't be too hard to knock it off of that and Sleeping Dog's first hour knocked all of Mass Effect 3 out of the fucking ballpark.

@TorMasturba said:

@BisonHero said:

Haha, yeah they pretty clearly implied that it had a shot at "Biggest Disappointment" except now RE6 is likely going to steal that category.

RE6 will get into the runner's up line-up but I doubt it'll win out right since Jeff and Ryan didn't have anything like high hopes for it beforehand anyway.

I disagree. On the Bombcast, Jeff talked about how every time since RE4, he hopes it is the time they finally change the controls enough that he can enjoy playing it, and he was once again willing to give RE6 a shot. So he was probably somewhat disappointed that, if anything, the game is turning back into a clunky mess compared to RE4 and RE5 (or at least, that is how Brad described it to Jeff).

@BisonHero said:

Haha, yeah they pretty clearly implied that it had a shot at "Biggest Disappointment" except now RE6 is likely going to steal that category.

RE6 will get into the runner's up line-up but I doubt it'll win out right since Jeff and Ryan didn't have anything like high hopes for it beforehand anyway.

@BisonHero said:

Haha, yeah they pretty clearly implied that it had a shot at "Biggest Disappointment" except now RE6 is likely going to steal that category.

RE6 will get into the runner's up line-up but I doubt it'll win out right since Jeff and Ryan didn't have anything like high hopes for it beforehand anyway.

It deserves an honorable mention at least not outright dismissal, 95% of that game is perfect so it mucks it up at the end. It terms of gameplay it was flawless, took what ME1 promised and what ME2 refined and honed it to a point where ME3 has better shooting than most shooters and a dialogue system still unrivaled. The story is good, had some emotionally impacting moments and some jaw dropping ones. But it trips up at the end for some and everyone is going to let that be the only thing taken away from that game. Not the first 25 hours but the last hour.

I think Mass Effect 3 was a good game, and I didn't find the ending nearly as odious as the outrage surrounding it (and it was better post-DLC, too). That said, I don't think it's game of the year either. Possibly top 10, depending on how the holiday rush games pan out, but not GOTY.

Of course, it has no chance. I fully anticipate GB's "Most Disappointing" award to be a toss up between RE6 or ME3. The "ME3's ending is HORRIBLE!!!!!!" train of thought quickly became the conventional wisdom surrounding the game, dominating all other discussion of the game's merits, and I doubt it'll ever be broken.

@Brodehouse said:

@TorMasturba

@BisonHero said:

Haha, yeah they pretty clearly implied that it had a shot at "Biggest Disappointment" except now RE6 is likely going to steal that category.

RE6 will get into the runner's up line-up but I doubt it'll win out right since Jeff and Ryan didn't have anything like high hopes for it beforehand anyway.

Dragon Age 2 won last year despite Vinny being the only person in the office who played it. It's hysterical to listen to Patrick describe the ills of a game he didn't play, and talk about the strength of Origins (another game he didn't play).

I played Origins all the way through three times, the Awakening expansion twice, and upgraded my computer specifically for DA2 before it came out, then stayed up all night to play it when it came out on Steam.

DA2 was a massive, epic disappointment. Played it through once, and was so disappointed with the design corners that were cut, and the awful story, that I uninstalled it when I was done and haven't touched it since. No DLC - nothing.

I consider DA2 to be the first chink in what was Bioware's previously impenetrable armor as a developer, that has continued with SWTOR, and to some extent ME3 (despite playing and reasonably enjoying the latter two, myself).

Mass Effect 3 is a fine game, and honestly I feel like the hate around the ending overshadows a lot of the things that it does right. That being said, the main plot thread is still a bit of a mess, and enough has been said about that abysmal ending.

@Brodehouse said:

@TorMasturba

@BisonHero said:

Haha, yeah they pretty clearly implied that it had a shot at "Biggest Disappointment" except now RE6 is likely going to steal that category.

RE6 will get into the runner's up line-up but I doubt it'll win out right since Jeff and Ryan didn't have anything like high hopes for it beforehand anyway.

Dragon Age 2 won last year despite Vinny being the only person in the office who played it. It's hysterical to listen to Patrick describe the ills of a game he didn't play, and talk about the strength of Origins (another game he didn't play).

Don't forget The Witcher 2 getting on the site top 10 despite (once again) Vinny being the only one who played it. Obviously, Patrick has played it now and can back up those claims, but I always thought it was a bit incredulous that that game made it but Dark Souls or especially Mortal Kombat didn't.

@Brodehouse said:

@Scotto THAT'S NOT THE POINT

I know. I was taking the opportunity to rant. :D

@Brodehouse said:

@Scotto THAT'S NOT THE POINT

Maybe if you fired a shot at the point, people would take notice of it. SHOTS FIRED SHOTS FIRED SHOTS FIRED!

@ArbitraryWater said:

Mass Effect 3 is a fine game, and honestly I feel like the hate around the ending overshadows a lot of the things that it does right. That being said, the main plot thread is still a bit of a mess, and enough has been said about that abysmal ending.

@Brodehouse said:

@TorMasturba

@BisonHero said:

Haha, yeah they pretty clearly implied that it had a shot at "Biggest Disappointment" except now RE6 is likely going to steal that category.

RE6 will get into the runner's up line-up but I doubt it'll win out right since Jeff and Ryan didn't have anything like high hopes for it beforehand anyway.

Dragon Age 2 won last year despite Vinny being the only person in the office who played it. It's hysterical to listen to Patrick describe the ills of a game he didn't play, and talk about the strength of Origins (another game he didn't play).

Don't forget The Witcher 2 getting on the site top 10 despite (once again) Vinny being the only one who played it. Obviously, Patrick has played it now and can back up those claims, but I always thought it was a bit incredulous that that game made it but Dark Souls or especially Mortal Kombat didn't.

The Witcher 2 was a great game, and definitely deserved to be in the top 10 for me. If I recall, Mortal Kombat was specifically left out because it had kind of busted multiplayer for so long (which is obviously key for a fighting game).

I think it just came down to none of them really being big Dark Souls fans, and hence, not really willing to go to bat for it. Two of them pretty actively disliked it, Brad always seemed ambivalent at best, and Vinny sort-of thought it was good. It is THEIR collective Top 10 list, after all.

I think Witcher 2 made it simply because Jeff and Ryan had a passing familiarity with it, and what they had seen at the time they were impressed with, so they just sort of took Vinny's word for it.

@WinterSnowblind said:

ME3 had some good sections, but the story was disappointing compared to the past two games, the gameplay did nothing special and the ending was ridiculous. Considering the competition this year, I doubt it's even going to break the top 10 for most.

Gameplay, in terms of how the combat worked out due to ability balance and level design, seemed a lot better than ME2. Instead of just being corridors ME3 sometimes had sort of open areas and the areas felt a bit more diverse. And the co-op mode wasn't bad. But I guess since that is not the part of mass effect that people really care about it would miss out on GOTY consideration.

@Quarters Isn't the end year podcast more interesting when you disagree with it? For the most part I would expect a journalist to have a bit of a different view of the industry than an individual player would, so that is part of the charm of the enthusiast press type release on these items.

Yeah, no. It's FAR from GOTY. That is going to the Walking Dead or Journey.

@WinterSnowblind said:

It should have been compelling, but just wasn't. I really liked that ME1 was more or less a stand alone game that left wiggle room at the end to expand into further games. Turning it into a trilogy is the mistake too many franchises make, but ME2 still avoided getting bogged down in that, since it was mainly just about putting together a team for the suicide mission and taking out the Collectors, which worked, it was a fun adventure.

ME3 became all about the reapers and it was clear from the start that the writers didn't know what they were really about, or what to do with them. Besides a few emotional/dramatic character moments, ME3's story was an utter mess and this is why the ending turned out the way it did. I'm not in the camp that will pretend it was a horrible game, but it was certainly a disappointment and it'll be a long time before I ever want to play through it again.

Mass Effect 1 had a spectacular story. I think there's no arguing there. Best in the series.

The problem with Mass Effect 2's story is that there simply wasn't enough substance there outside of the spectacular character cast. You were introduced to the core objective (build team, take on suicide mission), but that core objective does not change or layer in much else besides that six-word summary. Moreover, Mass Effect is all about the Reapers as a specific, but Mass Effect 2 deviates it's series-wide narrative arc into two things that were essentially hidden background lore in the original game (Cerberus and the Collectors). The whole thing feels like a dopey little adventure that is entirely inconsequential to the grande narrative. At the very least, Mass Effect 3 resolves some compelling narratives that have been there from the start (genophage, purpose of the Citadel, the Geth vs. Quarian war, the stressed relationship with Kaidan/Ashley, etc.).

Personally, I think the mystery behind the Reapers is both intentional and wholly captivating. But then again, I also enjoyed the original ending of the game. Some things are better left unexplained, and I don't think that should have an effect on what you walk away with from the narrative. I'd actually say that ME3 is among Bioware's best modern (read: post-KOTOR) stories. If I had to rank them:

1. Knights of the Old Republic
2. Mass Effect
3. Mass Effect 3
4. Jade Empire
5. The Old Republic (Imperial Agent)
6. Dragon Age 2
7. Mass Effect 2
8. Dragon Age: Origins

(I also found Dragon Age: Origins' core narrative to be dreadfully boring for the same reasons as ME2--but the game was a fucking awesome excuse to explore spectacular characters and gameplay).

@Phatmac said:

Mass Effect 3 is incredibly disappointing. Remember what you thought me3 would be after me2 and than compare notes on how you feel about me3 right now. I like most parts of me3 but it isn't as great as previous games in the franchise. It's a good choice for biggest disappointment.

I don't know, I was pretty sure ME3 was going to be hot garbage after ME2 basically came in and ruined most of the great stuff about that series. ME3 ended up fixing most of it.

I still won't put ME3 in my personal top 10.

I was going to say Mass Effect 3 is going to win the disappointing game category but then Resident Evil 6 happened.

@bushpusherr said:

Doubt it will even be on the radar. Most of them felt (and I agree) that Mass Effect 2 was a much better game. Look at how much attention Uncharted 3 got last year? Not much, because the 2nd was better received.

Also, I don't think it should be near the top of the list anyway.

Uncharted 3 is a fantastic game, if slightly inferior to Uncharted 2. Apart from everything else it has pretty much the best co-operative horde mode in existence. Mass Effect 3 is an okay game but vastly inferior to Mass Effect 2 and has the worst co-operative horde mode in existence.

@project343 said:

1. Knights of the Old Republic
2. Mass Effect
3. Mass Effect 3
4. Jade Empire
5. The Old Republic (Imperial Agent)
6. Dragon Age 2
7. Mass Effect 2
8. Dragon Age: Origins

1. Overrated

2. Overrated

3. Terrible

4. Gorgeous looking, but overrated

5. What?

6. Atrocity

7. Fantastic, a bizarrely good turn for such a mediocre company

8. Terrible

Loved the game. Everything about it. Reiner gave it a 10 at Game Informer and I couldn't agree more.

But it's not getting top game of the year nods here. Doesn't make me like it less and hopefully hasn't caused people here to get overly negative. The GB GOTY stuff is interesting, but the individual top 10's are always so different that you can tell the mutual one is just a bunch of compromises. Which is why I feel people shouldn't get too hung up on it.


Regardless, I'm looking forward to the monster casts.

@Fredchuckdave: Guess you don't like games, troll?

@project343: Mass Effect 2 was great. But it is good to see BIoware deteriorating even further into nothingness nonetheless; hate terrible hype machines.

@Fredchuckdave: You just shit on most of my favourite games of all time. Care to give me your list?

*Edit: you're also the only person I've heard who dislikes the ME3 coop mode. Also, that title for worst coop/horde mode belongs to so many other games before ME3. I think Uncharted 2 has the worst in recent memory for me.

@project343:

2/10 troll @Fredchuckdave said:

@project343: Mass Effect 2 was great. But it is good to see BIoware deteriorating even further into nothingness nonetheless; hate terrible hype machines.

@Fredchuckdave said:

@bushpusherr said:

Doubt it will even be on the radar. Most of them felt (and I agree) that Mass Effect 2 was a much better game. Look at how much attention Uncharted 3 got last year? Not much, because the 2nd was better received.

Also, I don't think it should be near the top of the list anyway.

Uncharted 3 is a fantastic game, if slightly inferior to Uncharted 2. Apart from everything else it has pretty much the best co-operative horde mode in existence. Mass Effect 3 is an okay game but vastly inferior to Mass Effect 2 and has the worst co-operative horde mode in existence.

I agree about Uncharted, and that is kind of the strength of the point I was making. It was a very good game, but since it didn't as much impact as Uncharted 2 (felt more of the same, etc), it wasn't nearly as significant for the bomb squad come end of the year discussions. I was hoisting up Uncharted 3 as an example of a terrific game that was largely left out of the discussion due to the success of it's predecessor.

Given that precedence, my point was that Mass Effect 3 doesn't really have a chance because not only does it not live up to Mass Effect 2, but, in my opinion, doesn't really belong up there regardless.

@project343: In no particular order: Vagrant Story, Starcraft Brood War, Dark Souls, Valkyrie Profile 2, Unreal Tournament, Doom II, Arkham Asylum, GTA San Andreas, Metal Gear Solid 3, Suikoden V, Xenosaga I, Link to the Past, Super Metroid, Metroid Prime, Witcher 2, and Resident Evil 4.

Honorable mention to Heroes of Might and Magic V and Vanquish for being the hardest

Note I did used to be a Square fanboy so I can relate somewhat to fanboyism, but that must've been like 6 years ago. I don't dislike most BIoware games just dislike how much the press hyped everything for like 5 years, good to see a crash in that regard. I do think Baldur's Gate 2 is overrated as well, but wasn't really interested in western RPGs at the time and it's next to impossible to get into it in retrospect.

Your probably going to see a lot of sites really put Mass Effect 3 as game of the year, gametrailers been mentioning that too. They would have to write a 15 page essay WHY, and then contain a 3 hour documentary of them debating the merits of the game. Any good will is coasting on the multiplayer alone and even that is debatable if it should have been free to play.

@bushpusherr: Ah, fair enough. Though I do think Uncharted 2 is still better than Mass Effect 2 (for that GOTY cast) even though they kind of forced the issue. Didn't York somehow lose out on best character to one of the 2-3 hour characters in ME2 as well? Tragedy.

@smcn said:

Mass Effect 3 should be game of the year to anyone who's not a total philistine.

NOOOOO! I didn't even have that big of a problem with the ending, but that game was a massive disappointment in general.

@Hunkulese said:

@smcn I know your just trolling but I don't think you understand the word philistine.

Philistine = huge motherfucker that got killed by a midget

@bushpusherr said:

Mass Effect 3 doesn't really have a chance because not only does it not live up to Mass Effect 2, but, in my opinion, doesn't really belong up there regardless.

you fucking crazy, son.