So why can't this come to the 360?

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#1 Edited by I_smell (3924 posts) -

I've got a 360, everyone says it's impossible but I've never read into it.

I shagged all the other games on the PS2 by the way.

#2 Posted by pyromaniac (1703 posts) -

yeah people say whatever they want to but it is  just to hype up their system. I am sure they can put this game on the 360 if they want but no...they have to be fanboys. Oh well their loss.

#3 Posted by TurboMan (7601 posts) -

It will take Kojima studios way to long to edit out the "Disc Swapping" conversation

#4 Posted by Callik (138 posts) -

1) Internet would explode, literally.
2) Built for the PS3 over 4 years of development, porting would be tricky
3) Kojima like big powerful systems and the PS3 does exceed the 360 on hardware specs
4) Leik, 50 DVD box set olololo!

I jest with that last one.

#5 Edited by Volkodlak (115 posts) -

There's no reason it can't and like other MGS games it may well have an second release, that could come to 360. I'm sure this is high on Microsoft's list of games they want... and they certainly have the money to make it happen, I hope it does cause I loves me some Metal Gear Solid, I just don't have a PS3 yet.

#6 Posted by Galiant (2193 posts) -

It would probably take some time, and require more discs, but it could (and probably will) happen.
It wouldn't be the first time, and I don't see why not?

The more people that can enjoy this game, the better!

#7 Posted by treefity350 (41 posts) -

I guess it could come, I mean the graphics will be there because there is no difference in technology between the consoles but since theres no blu ray, it will take effort to convert that onto 4 discs-NOT 50 DISCS!! Don't be idiots I would say it would take 4 tops and Kojima faith seems to be with Sony

#8 Posted by Kush (8889 posts) -

It can very easily be ported to the 360 because the game is already built for multiple discs. Yes, the game would need multiple DVDs on the 360 for all of the video/audio files, but it can easily work. The game is broken up into acts and between each act you have a mandatory install that can last a few minutes. This has to been done every time that you play through the game and this "install time" can easily be turned into a "disc-swapping" time.

I don't personally care if the game comes out on the 360 because I have already played and don't want to play it again. I also feel that the time it would take to bring it to the 360 would be way too long and no one would really care by then...but anyone who says it's impossible for the game to come out on the 360 is simply ignorant.

#9 Edited by Absinthetic (172 posts) -

because kojima productions have very little incentive to do so

and i dont really think most 360 users are the type to buy into the metal gear games, i believe they just want it on the 360 just for pure fanboy artilery

#10 Posted by Monty_The_Great (178 posts) -

Other than space on a single disc, there is no reason. There is no game on the PS3 that has better ingame graphics than the 360. I own a PS3 and 360 and have MGS4 and Uncharted, so please don't say they look better in game during actual game play.

#11 Edited by I_smell (3924 posts) -

Cheers, you all seem pretty cool about it.
How long would you say the videos at the start are? Like the real-life videos, all added together?
Cos they're crazy high def Blu-Ray videos. I bet they take up loads. Also:

Absinthetic said:

"and i dont really think most 360 users are the type to buy into the metal gear games"

That's like half the people who play games. I'm sure some of em are.

treefity350 said:
"there is no difference in technology between the consoles "
Now you're being silly.
#12 Edited by nailerr (198 posts) -
--edited for a little clarity, I was in a rush--

It's certainly possible, although there is more than just code to be ported.  There is a lot of Playstation history and in-jokes made during the game, and not always stuff you see in the first play through.
There are several instances where older consoles are directly referenced, even shown on screen and jokes made about the lack of, or the presence of rumble depending on what controller you are playing with.  This however could be removed should it be pushed to the Xbox.

Technologically, yes, the PS3 is a "more powerful console" than the Xbox 360.  But both consoles have plus and minus points, like most other games by skilled developers those differences can be negated with some smart code.  Although, Kojima Productions claim to be using nearly all of the SPU power of the PS3 and this is something the 360 can not replicate.  You just can not work around one console having 3 cores and one having 7.  But again, those cores are very, very different, with up and down sides.

The individual installs between acts is true, and the DVD read speed of the 360 is generally higher than the read speed of  Blu-Ray, but not at all times.  The 360 has a 12x DVD drive, and this means at the centre of a disc it is reading at maximum transfer rate, but as the laser travels outwards that data read speed decreases.  BD-ROM has been designed to have a constant read speed over the span of the disc, mostly achievable because the data pits are more dense letting the laser read more data in one sweep.

At maximum speed the 360 reads faster than the PS3, for the rest of the disc they should be the same.  Smart coding can make that matter, as can cashing to the HDD.  However with the 360 soon able to install games to HDD we may see games of this size become reality, but with mandatory installs.

Another note is video.  Video can be compressed, and it would make sense to compress both audio and video for the 360 to reduce some of that roughly 50GB of data.  Although true there is full motion video in the game a great deal of the cut-scenes are not FMV but rendered in engine.  Some however are not and it is very hard to tell them apart.  Basically if Snake has the same camo pattern in the cut-scene as he did before it started, it is in engine.  You can often shake the controller to reset the octo-camo mid scene.
Chances are most of the data on the PS3 is uncompressed because of the disc space available, compression helps a whole lot as games like Mass Effect show.

So, it would potentially need 7 DVD-9's to contain the game, further reduced to 3 or 4 with HDD install, compression and smart coding and cuts.  And to be honest the game is worth getting up and changing discs for.  Metal Gear Solid 4 like those before it is a very linear game, you do not revisit areas at will like Grand Theft Auto 4 or Oblivion, that helps.


To be honest, I would hope it remains a PS3 exclusive, but that is not for the reasons many do.  I just believe that if both consoles have a couple of exclusive titles then the quality of those titles is going to be very high.  When you build to the maximum known potential of one system the results are usually better.  I'm a fan of all consoles.  And with that in mind it was a little disheartening to think what Grand Theft Auto 4 could of been had it not been limited to a streaming DVD, just as the Xbox and PC versions of GTA3.* were limited to what the PS2 could handle, minus a few obvious engine improvements.

Games should not be held aloft like prizes for "owning the right console" and those people who do are bloody minded ignorant fools.
I just hope we have a future with good cross platform games, and a sprinkling of ultra high quality exclusives for all.

Cheers!
#13 Posted by Kaido (249 posts) -

I don't see why they don't see the plausibility in disk swapping, it's entirely possible.

#14 Posted by AutomaticSnake (390 posts) -

No way this game will never come to the 360 it cant handle it. If they made it for the 360 it would be a mess....

-  At least 6 DVD's
- Longer load times cuz no HDD installs
- No motion control support (no rosemary boob shacking in the codec :(
- A lot of the cut scenes would need to be redone (mantis talking about PS1 memory cards on 360?? lol)
- No more Free MGO (gotta pay for XBL sorry)
- Downgraded graphics
- And getting RROD before finishing the game.

#15 Posted by tec3297 (1170 posts) -

 AutomaticSnake said:

"No way this game will never come to the 360 it cant handle it. If they made it for the 360 it would be a mess....

-  At least 6 DVD's
- Longer load times cuz no HDD installs
- No motion control support (no rosemary boob shacking in the codec :(
- A lot of the cut scenes would need to be redone (mantis talking about PS1 memory cards on 360?? lol)
- No more Free MGO (gotta pay for XBL sorry)
- Downgraded graphics
- And getting RROD before finishing the game.

"
Ok, there is not way that is would use 6 DVD's. (well 6 would be the most)
A BD only has like 5 1/2 more times the space than DVD
There is no way that MSG4 uses all 50GB of a dual-layer BD

#16 Posted by tec3297 (1170 posts) -

 AutomaticSnake said:

"No way this game will never come to the 360 it cant handle it. If they made it for the 360 it would be a mess....

-  At least 6 DVD's
- Longer load times cuz no HDD installs
- No motion control support (no rosemary boob shacking in the codec :(
- A lot of the cut scenes would need to be redone (mantis talking about PS1 memory cards on 360?? lol)
- No more Free MGO (gotta pay for XBL sorry)
- Downgraded graphics
- And getting RROD before finishing the game.

"
Ok, there is not way that is would use 6 DVD's. (well 6 would be the most)
A BD only has like 5 1/2 more times the space than DVD
There is no way that MSG4 uses all 50GB of a dual-layer BD

#17 Posted by xplodedd (1316 posts) -
Callik said:
"1) Internet would explode, literally.
2) Built for the PS3 over 4 years of development, porting would be tricky
3) Kojima like big powerful systems and the PS3 does exceed the 360 on hardware specs
4) Leik, 50 DVD box set olololo!

I jest with that last one."
1) damn right
2) have you heard of porting?
3) optomizing, Kojiima can do it, he just likes to run his mouth
4) again, optomizing help.
#18 Posted by I_smell (3924 posts) -
I understood the whole thing, but why mention this part?

nailerr
said:
"The individual installs between acts is true, and the DVD read speed of the 360 is generally higher than the read speed of  Blu-Ray, but not at all times.  The 360 has a 12x DVD drive, and this means at the centre of a disc it is reading at maximum transfer rate, but as the laser travels outwards that data read speed decreases.  BD-ROM has been designed to have a constant read speed over the span of the disc, mostly achievable because the data pits are more dense letting the laser read more data in one sweep.

At maximum speed the 360 reads faster than the PS3, for the rest of the disc they should be the same.  Smart coding can make that matter, as can cashing to the HDD.  However with the 360 soon able to install games to HDD we may see games of this size become reality, but with mandatory installs. "
Are you reffering to framerate or something? I doubt framerate'll be a massive hurdle considerin how uncompressed everything is. Any problem with that's usually in lighting n shaders.

nailerr said:
"So, it would potentially need 7 DVD-9's to contain the game, "
:|
I'm not even gonna start on that.

I'm done with this topic, thanks dawgs.
#19 Posted by Vlademir (1029 posts) -
TurboMan said:
"It will take Kojima studios way to long to edit out the "Disc Swapping" conversation
"
That was a joke about the old MGS games. It may have a double meaning but I doubt they would make it that blunt if they wanted to make fun of the 360.
#20 Posted by DarkLegend (1387 posts) -

A lot of disc would be needed.

#21 Edited by GMhawk (14 posts) -

To AutomaticSnake

Dude, that post was brilliant!

#22 Posted by epic_pets (1339 posts) -

The 360 needs blue- ray

#23 Posted by spragels (97 posts) -

It could easily be done.

#24 Posted by ocdog45 (675 posts) -

who wants to play a game with 4 or 5 discs. that would make me want to run away from it.

#25 Posted by hazelnutman (1097 posts) -

MGS4 is partially a giant PS3 advertisement, so they would have to make a lot of changes. Plus, there's the presence of a ton of Apple products.

I have the game, and think it's fantastic. One of my favorite games EVER.

I'm not a fanboy, so I'd be cool with it being ported. More people playing this amazing game the better I say!

#26 Posted by Pikachu (449 posts) -

it would take quite a few discs to put this game on

#27 Posted by pause422 (6201 posts) -

Yeah disc swapping would make it possible space wise,but its just lame..and no one should have to do that. Plus there's a little joke about that in the game which would probably have to be edited out.  Secondly though,at the moment its the most graphically impressive game to be released(don't mention sports sims,because all the effort there goes into player models so of course they look good) especially for being an action game. The framelag would suffer  a bit going on 360,or the visuals would need to be tuned down which is kind of dumb. Another good reason is the online part of it,since they use their own Konami online ID shit to sign up,it just wouldn't be possible on XBL,because every game has to be on XBL for microsoft.

#28 Posted by SonicFire (821 posts) -

There are some excellent points here, but I have to agree with nailer in saying that it's not just about disc swapping and data storage. Though there are some in-jokes that talk about the Blu-Ray's storage capabilities, this game was designed around the cell processor, which effectively is different from the 360's GPU. The game would have to be redesigned quite heavily, and I don't see Kojima tampering with his masterpiece at this point, it just wouldn't make a lot of sense.

#29 Posted by nailerr (198 posts) -
I_smell said:
"So, it would potentially need 7 DVD-9's to contain the game, " :|
I'm not even gonna start on that.

I'm done with this topic, thanks dawgs.
"
And then DIRECTLY AFTERWARDS "further reduced to 3 or 4 with HDD install, compression and smart coding and cuts"
50GB BD divided by DVD-9 (realistically 8GB) = around 6 to 7 discs.  Each disc would have to contain massive amounts of duplicate data unless it was installed to HDD.  Before compression and cutting.

The point about DVD read speed was just a technical difference, for those who were interested.
#30 Posted by Josiah (101 posts) -

DVD-9 = ~14 GBs. MGS4 = ~30 GB. So 2 Discs, maybe 3?

#31 Posted by NateDogg (465 posts) -

I think it can come to the 360... But Sony has to do everything to keep that franchise exclusive..

also.. I don't see why people are complaining about disc swapping... although 6 DVD's do sound like a lot..
But remember back when FF7 was 3 discs and FF8 was 4?  Its not like we all haven't disc swapped before at some point in time..

#32 Posted by RedSox8933 (2428 posts) -

who cares. FFXIII is coming you should be thankful

#33 Posted by Bilawal (109 posts) -

ANSWER:

Built with teh Sony's cell processor, meaning a lot of work almost re-making it to bring to 360.

#34 Posted by TimesHero (699 posts) -
GMhawk said:
"

To AutomaticSnake

Dude, that post was brilliant!

"
Just hit the quote link at the bottom right of his post.


Sorry guys... please continue.
#35 Edited by Alawishis (2 posts) -

I think that it will be released as a re-release, like mgs2 substance on the xbox because, mgs 4 is to ps3 as mgs2 was to ps2 (The big graphics power house that sold alot of people on the sony name) and the mgs 2 re-release came to xbox. also it would take awhile to do it but the re-releases do take 1-2 years to come out, microsoft got FF13 which was somthing i never saw coming, and that only speaks to how much pull microsoft actually has now in japan and in general so they could get it if they really wanted it. Finally besides ratchet and clank, and tekken(so far) i can't think of a long time stablished franchies that hasn't appeared on a microsoft console(ridge racer 6, FF13, Resident Evil, Devil May Cry, ect..) so why not get Mgs once again?

#36 Posted by Absinthetic (172 posts) -
I_smell said:


Absinthetic said:
"and i dont really think most 360 users are the type to buy into the metal gear games"

That's like half the people who play games. I'm sure some of em are.


"

i'm sure there are some as well but i dont think there are enough of them to justify the cost of porting it
#37 Posted by Homer (1372 posts) -

Because the 360 is GAY!!

Lol jk but Sony needs at least a few good exclusives.

#38 Posted by Jordan23 (1000 posts) -

Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots is geared for Blu-Ray technology, no one want an 10 disc set of an videogame. Besides, an direct port of the game would just be so incorrect, (Hideo Kojima) need to keep it "exclusive."

#39 Posted by OGCartman (4354 posts) -

It can but it wont =(

#40 Posted by Red (5995 posts) -
I_smell said:
"I've got a 360, everyone says it's impossible but I've never read into it.

I shagged all the other games on the PS2 by the way.
"

Won't ever happen.
First off, Kojima was saying that the Blu-Ray disc 'STILL NOT BIG ENOUGH' so I'd have to assume that MGS4 is around 40gigs which would mean 4 or 5 DVDs. Also, there's a lot of Playstation parodies in this game.
*spoiler*

First Otacon tells you to change the DIsc but then he remembers we're on the PS3 so we don't have to. Then Psycho Mantis shows up and tries to read your memory card but then he's shocked by the implementation of a hardrive. Pictures of the PS1 are flashed during this time.

So, they'd have to do a lot more than porting the code, and I STILL don't think the 360 can handle MGS4

#41 Edited by Shinedown220 (148 posts) -

Hideo Kojima and Kojima Productions wouldn't be invloved so why would you care?

#42 Posted by OGCartman (4354 posts) -
Josiah said:
"DVD-9 = ~14 GBs. MGS4 = ~30 GB. So 2 Discs, maybe 3?
"
Wow realy? Thatd suck nuts
#43 Posted by MetalGearSunny (6997 posts) -

Stop praying 360 whores it's not gonna happen.

#44 Posted by zityz (2360 posts) -

It could be possible, I mean Lost oddesy is what 4 discs? It's possible later on down the road like what they did with metal gear 2, but then again, MGS3 was ps2 only so who knows.

Wouldn't help me much, I've only played the Original MGS for playstation, and like 5 minutes of MGS3, would be cool though.

#45 Posted by Rowr (5793 posts) -

The developer is an arrogant prick.

#46 Posted by AaronBelfast (1491 posts) -

Yea it'll happen, eventually..

Companys can't turn away money, thats just being naive.

#47 Posted by brukaoru (5079 posts) -

It can.

It all depends if Microsoft wants to dump their money truck into getting it to the 360, I somehow doubt that they do. I mean, most people who want to play MGS4 have probably already gotten a PS3 or plan to get one, so I don't see how many more sales it would have on the 360.

#48 Posted by TheGreatGuero (9130 posts) -

At this point, I don't think it's going to happen. If it was being ported to the 360, I'm sure we would have heard by now. I thought maybe there might be a chance of an announcement at E3, but now it's looking quite unlikely. Seems MGS4 will remain a PS3 exclusive.

#49 Posted by Subway (971 posts) -
AutomaticSnake said:
"No way this game will never come to the 360 it cant handle it. If they made it for the 360 it would be a mess....

-  At least 6 DVD's
- Longer load times cuz no HDD installs
- No motion control support (no rosemary boob shacking in the codec :(
- A lot of the cut scenes would need to be redone (mantis talking about PS1 memory cards on 360?? lol)
- No more Free MGO (gotta pay for XBL sorry)
- Downgraded graphics
- And getting RROD before finishing the game.

"
Lets see here
-At least 6 DVD's? maybe at most 6 DVD's
-HDD installs are coming
-Motion controls suck dick
-How many cut scenes talk about PS, honestly?
-4$ a month how can we ever afford it!?
-Downgraded graphics? How, most games look identical if not better on 360
-A RROD statement, how fitting. Too bad in my three years with my 360 I still haven't had an RROD
#50 Posted by suneku (2997 posts) -

Meh, it's entirely possible even if its like a year down the road.

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