Karkarov

@JasonR86 said:

I think it's an analyst's job to perpetually worry.

Well said, people forget that an analyst or researcher basically require that their results be uh.... worth reading. Either that or they don't get paid. No one is going to hire an analyst who always returns with, "no sir, I think everything looks okay". It is their job to find something to bitch about.

@xaLieNxGrEyx said:

@gamefreak9:

You're aware that during WWII participation was mandatory, and this man fought in it including D-day.You're an idiot asshole.

Quoted for truth. I am a true purveyor of insults and foul language and I could not have said it better myself.

@Divina_Rex said:

@TheSpoonyBard said:

@Divina_Rex: I imagine part of the button mashy nature is you and your pawns are probably overlevelled for the demo. Also, they give you about ten minutes to mess with the game under a warrior/archer build (as opposed to a mage or mage archer) so maybe it's just natural to hit buttons until something dies.

Just seeing how other gameplay videos are made it seem like it was far tougher if you started off from the beginning.

Maybe. I will say though that this demo would be a poor representation of the game then. It's too short to really get the full feel for it. They don't preview the structure leveling. They don't allow for a mage character. It's a demo that could really put people off, such as myself. I did really like the customization though. You could make some hideous people with that builder.

That would be the exact reason I replied to your post like I did. Because the demo does give the wrong impression as far as the game goes. The Prologue you play is literally the games tutorial level, so it is going to be a cake walk. The griffin fight you have a overleveled / geared team. There is an insane ton of move sets in this game that you don't get to see in the demo. I have seen everything from a attack that lets you leap into the air and do this huge long range stab, to a frontal aoe attack that does do knockdown, to a high level archer shoot an arrow that pinned an enemy to a wall, to a mage who started beating people with a whip made out of electricity. In fact there are so many buff spells in the mage arsenal you could literally make a mage who had nothing but buff spells. You wouldn't want to, but you can do it.

There are even enemies in the game with elemental resistances, guys who are strong against physical attacks, golems that con only be hurt by attacking weak points on their body, drakes that can mind control one of your pawns... Even some of the pud regular monsters like Saurians (think lizardmen) have different strengths and weaknesses. There is definitely tactics to apply to each type of enemy, it is just sad you only get to see that in two fights where the demo gives you a party specifically designed to beat those enemies. In the real game your archer won't automatically start trying to snipe it's wings and your mage may not even have a fire buff spell which is what Griffin's are weak to.

So trust me, the real game is only mashy if you want it to be. Like I said you can play that way, but you can get farther if you don't.

@Divina_Rex said:

@Bell_End said:

im underwhelmed and disappointed. i though it was generic and bland.

Yeah, real button mashy. I find this demo to be akin to Kingdoms of Amalur. I'll get it when it's cheap to hold me over the summer drought.

It is only button mashy if you don't uh .... get it. Or choose to be that way on purpose. Even your light attack has a delay component to it, like try hitting light ... wait.... light light versus just spamming the button. The bumper/R1-L1 buttons have alot of moves there that make very good tactical sense in the fights you find in the demo too. Example R1 in the "countryside mission" turns your jump into a dodge roll. It is like Street Fighter (go fig, both capcom) you can mash your way through but someone who knows the moves and how to tactically use them will have a much easier time of it.

@Chavtheworld said:

@Karkarov: Have you any Monster Hunter/Dark Souls experience? I freaking love MH, and am pretty into DS too, so does this really compare to them that well? It seems like a statement people who have never (seriously) played MH are throwing around with abandon and I'd love to see if the analogue is true. I deleted a bunch of stuff off my Hard Drive to make space for this game, so fingers crossed it will impress.

Dark Souls/Monster Hunter experience... Yeah you could say that ;p. Maybe I will pm you my youtube page....

That said I don't think a Monster Hunter comparison holds up long term outside of combat handling for a few reasons. Yes you fight big monsters (hardly exclusive to MH), and you can knock them down..... but that is where the similarities sort of dwindle. Monster Hunter can be pretty instanced at times, relies on multiplayer, even has timed missions here and there, and in the end is a pure gear game. Your gear determines how BA you are, your weapon determines how you play, etc. Dogma is totally the opposite. Your character not only has a personal level, but a job level as well, and there are a ton of skills to learn per job. Like it is impossible to actually have every job skill slotted at the same time even on the starter classes and gear is restricted by class. There are even some things you gain that are like perks and give you permanent upgrades. Basically there is a ton more in the world and character development of Dogma than MH.

That said.... how would I describe Dragon's Dogma? Something like this ....

"Your Dark Souls character used a red crystal to invade another world and finds himself in Skyrim. Somehow he brought three blues with him that have the strange power of speech and boy do they love to be chatty Kathys! Even weirder it seems all the huge bosses from Shadow of the Collosus invaded this world at the same time you did. To make things interesting all the villagers are now calling you the Dragonborn and due to all this attention some giant ass dragon decided to beat you up and steal your heart. Good thing you are an undead, but you figure you should go get it back anyway."

Yeap that is how I would describe it.

So in the end the combat doesn't 100% handle like Dark Souls or Monster Hunter, and the leveling and game environment is more similar to a western action RPG like Skyrim or maybe Divinity 2.... But anyone who has played MH or DkS will be right at home with how the combat works and the overall gameplay. It is similar enough to make sense, but different enough to not be a rehash. There is even a certain level of alternate reality/community that ties in to the Souls games.

In closing, I love the Souls games and my most played game on Wii is Monster Hunter Tri. I have Dragon's Dogma on preorder with Amazon for release day delivery. Nuff said.

@Mesoian said:

First thing I did in the demo: grab my pawn and throw him off the cliff. It let me do it. Satisfying.

Don't do that with your main pawn in the real game ;p. My understanding is it gives you a game over. You can however throw pigs at townspeople, climb on a cows head and stab it to death (assuming it doesn't shake you off and stomp you), and a bunch of other crazy crap. As far as big enemies go.... yeah there are parts of the game where you will run into stuff like two cyclops at the same time only to crest a hill and find yourself fighting a golem, etc etc. You don't see it in the demo much but the game is insanely dynamic as well. Visit an abandoned shack during the day it is just some villagers, come back at night you walk inside to find it empty and when you walk outside you get jumped by a bandit army. There are also random giant monsters too, like the Griffin.

@ShawnS said:

Thanks for pointing all that stuff out, that's what I get for being excited and trying to write something super quick.

Not at all, you write up was great. I just wanted to let you know about that stuff because I know the demo just doesn't do the job on that front. My biggest worry for the game is alot of people will be on the fence, think "let's check out that demo!" then walk away with a bad impression because they don't have a full understanding of the game. That isn't their fault either, it is the demo's for not giving enough info and partially Capcom's for making the demo work like it does. I sort of wish they had just said screw it and made the demo into the first hour/hour and a half of the game itself. People would have had a better impression that way I think.

But then you would not get a cool Griffon fight that way ;p

@Packie said:

It was... okay. I do wish they let us free roam though. It's really hard to judge the combat because the fights were pretty damn easy. They must've toned down the difficulty for this build.

Oh and taking control away from you to show that your pawn is doing some stupid shit was bad. Hope we can turn it off in the release version.

Well I said this in another post but... If you look at the options and turn off the "cinematic camera" it will stop showing what your pawn is doing. Though I don't consider Salde holding up a Hobgoblin so I can easily own it's ass to be "stupid shit".

Wow you really had no clue what was going on in the demo did you? It shows. I don't mean that as a dig or anything the demo has one major flaw and that is it doesn't do any kind of job at educating the player on what the hell is going on.

First off. Almost everyone who plays this demo makes one big complaint. There is too much crap on the screen or these dudes talk to much! Okay, fair enough, they do talk to much and there is too much crap on the screen. So it is good that you can go into the options menu and turn off the text pop ups. They will still talk, but it won't take up any screen real estate. You can also turn off tutorial hints, the button menu on the bottom right, even the mini map and everyone's hp bars. Just a heads up to Packie.... you can turn off the "cinematic" camera thing that highlights your ally's actions too. The only thing you cant turn off is the black bars. The reason for this is because the game is actually played in some funky aspect ratio like 16x10 or something. I actually had part of the screen cropped off at the sides when my monitor was in strictly 16x9 mode. Fortunately that is easy to get used to. At least it was for me. Unfortunately the demo never bothers making sure the player knows you can do that stuff.

Second the character creator. You had a really funny coincidence there. Because it seems like you choose a build that looked like an archer. Here is the skinny. You were only choosing your characters "build" as in base body shape/physical look. It is too bad Japanese dev's don't know all the mmo/diablo speak of the west or they would have chosen a different word. In other words the choice you make on "build" only gives you a starter body type and has no bearing on your actual class. Of course taller characters have better reach and heavier ones have slightly more hp/physical damage or some such supposedly. Of course smaller lighter characters compensate by regening stamina faster and moving slightly faster in game. So that is worth thinking about I guess. Not that the demo says anything about that either.

So what about your class??? Simple, you never pick one in the demo. You are given a pre set party of dudes and it makes your custom character a "Strider", think Aragorn with Daggers or like you said Legolas. In the prologue you are literally playing the intro of the game, it is the retail games tutorial level. So there you get to play Savan who happens to be a Fighter and is actually the character from the Digital Video Comic Capcom is making for the game. The reason you are Savan and not your character is like I said... it is the games intro/tutorial level. When you play it in game you haven't even hit the character creation screen yet. In the actual game you get to pick your class extremely early in after a couple in game events. You can also change your class as the game moves along so you are never really stuck with your early game choice.

The cool thing about the demo is it shows off the combat, the monsters, the whole pawn thing, and the character creator which I actually like. You can even use your demo custom characters in the real game you know? The not so cool thing is like I said, it doesn't explain crap. I only know this stuff because I have been following this game REALLY closely and learned all this from the Capcom live streams and other coverage. It also doesn't show how the actual game is a real open world RPG with wandering NPC's insane amounts of stuff to do etc etc. If you saw more of the game you wouldn't make a Monster Hunter comparison, because Dogma has far more in common with western RPG's like Skyrim or even the Divinity games than it does MH.

@Draxyle said:

@Strife777 said:

@Draxyle said:

FF7 did a heck of a lot of crazy stuff that everyone forgets about, not to mention things that the "sequels" completely ignore too. I always laugh when they make Cloud into this mopey Emo character nowadays when he absolutely was not. He was hard as nails with a slightly dorky side now and then.

But isn't that because he kind of took Zack's personnality or something? Like he always thought he was Zack until he remembered he wasn't actually in SOLDIER.

That does sort of complicate it. I don't know though, Zack wasn't exactly a super tough, grizzled individual himself from what we saw of him, though there was that little dorky part that got through to Cloud (Zach being extra excited to go on that mission to the reactor, for example).

If anything, Cloud becomes more like Zach after he discovers his true self ("Lets Mosey").

Now I'm confused. He definitely was never emo though.

Except Cloud was in the Soldier program, he was just the absolute bottom rung scraping the barrel lowest rank you could possibly be and ultimately had to join the regular military. This is why he actually went on missions with Zack and Sephy as one of their grunts, they actually knew who he was from his failed attempt to join.

But no, he was not an emo. Yes he emulated Zack cause he looked up to him, but by the end of the game he had remembered his own past and was his own dude again. The whole emo thing is beyond retarded and it would be nice if Japan stopped using it entirely. To quote a buddy on why he didn't like the first Michael Keaton Batman movie "Look at him, he is sitting in his cave bemoaning his parents death all concerned about his love life with Vicki Vale like he is some kind of Emo. Emo's don't have the force of will to be motivated enough to put on a bat costume and beat the shit out of criminals! Batman is not an emo!"