@Snail said:
@MordeaniisChaos said:
@Snail said:
I don't really relate to those issues much, but yeah, judging by the little experience I've had with the game so far, the controls don't always feel nearly as precise as Patrick made it out to be. Maybe it's something that takes a while getting used to.
In any case I recommend you check out the The Legend of Zelda attraction in Nintendo Land. If that doesn't restore your faith in 1:1 sword-fighting in video-games, then you probably just suck.
I have completely faith in actual 1:1 sword combat in games. This just isn't 1:1. It isn't even dynamic in the way that it could be. The only reason it isn't waggle is because the way you waggle happens to influence the direction of the action. It's still "acceleration of X triggers action".
In a real sword fight, you don't have to slowly move your sword around like a windmill and then strike from the outside. If you need to get your weapon somewhere, you take the most direct path of least resistance.
I think part of the issue is that it keeps losing it's calibration, sometimes to a pretty extreme level.
The controls in that game are fun, they are meant to be fun. Sometimes they're a bit janky, but that seems to be fixed in Nintendo Land's Zelda minigames, so maybe it was a hardware limitation with the Wii.
I can imagine that kind of accurate sword-fighting being in a Wii U game, and being fun and challenging and immersive, but at this point it seems that you're more likely to one day find what you're describing in a franchise that's not Zelda. Or maybe not, maybe the next Zelda game will have sword combat mechanics where the momentum of the sword is crucial as well.
Except the "realism" I'm asking for is to make it less frustrating and restrictive. It's not fun to have to be ever so careful how I move the bloody device in my hand to make sure I don't attack when I mean to position for a strike. Especially with how the combat seems to be meant to work, it makes no sense that the only way I can move my sword to position for a strike so as to get around the enemy's guard is to move the wiimote slowly and out as if ready to strike at any moment. As a result, if I want to feign in the true sense, if you start from an underhand, and then want to go into an overhead strike, you have to swing the wiimote out to the side, making an arc with the point of your theoretical and virtual sword, and then strike down. I have no such restriction, so putting that restriction on me means I get a lot of crappy swings that hit a block and that puts me into the stun state and forces me to take a step back and reset myself and try again.
I don't want realism. Or, at least I don't expect it of this game. But I do want it to do what it says it does accurately, which too often I feel it doesn't. And on top of that, I feel like a freakin idiot when I do play along with it's silly restrictions and manage not to screw it up, because I'm just slowly rotating a chunk of plastic around in a big circle until it's time to swing.
@DeF said:
You have to remember that you're not playing a sword fighting simulator here. The game resets the animation to a neutral position after a brief moment once you strike. You can strike any way you'd need to quickly if you are mindful of what you're actually doing and aren't just swinging around like a crazy person. The enemies and puzzles are designed for the various slashes (vertical, diagonal, horizontal, stabs) allowing for opposite starting points. Starting a horizontal slash at the top right will let you move back the exact same way immediately for another vertical slash from the bottom left or transition into a horizontal swing before Link resumes the neutral position.
While it is true that sometimes the motion you *think* you're making doesn't translate into Link's movements as you may have expected, I fail to see what exactly you aren't getting from the game. Twisting the Wiimote during a swing and immediately doing another one seems to confuse it a bit so you have to be a little careful about what you're actually doing and all enemies allow you to do that. There is not a single instance in the game that is impossible to get through because of faulty controls. The game sets boundaries according to its design and if you acknowledge those boundaries play accordingly, you get some pretty sweet sword combat.
Saying you feel lied to is certainly nonsense. A lie constitutes information given to you by someone who knew that the information they provided to be false. While there may be a technical difference between 100% 1:1 controls and what Skyward Sword is offering, the term generally holds true since the game accurately translates your Wiimote movements into sword movements. A horizontal 2-o-clock-swipe followed by a vertical 5-past-12-o-clock-swipe with your Wiimote will be accurately represented in the game with your sword. I don't know what else you want in a game that is not a real-world-simulatior.
Except it's not accurate, for me at least, at all. There are times I makes a downward strike that turns into a strike from 4 oclock for no apparent reason, or times when I'm trying to move my sword to prepare for a strike and it reads that AS a strike, which is obviously a pain because I'm trying to move away from striking the guarded side and transition my blade to be ready to strike the unguarded side.
You kind of contradict yourself. You admit there are significant limitations to the system but then turn around and say it's entirely accurate to what you're doing.
I am well aware of what I am doing, I don't "*think*" I'm making these movements, they are movements I am making deliberately and am familiar with making.
You did mention pretty much the only time that things felt decent for me: making several swings in a row. There is a pause where you're not able to make swings just long enough to adjust for another swing from another angle, and then it feels pretty decent. My issue is the strikes when I don't have this benefit, or the strikes that are wildly innacurate to what I am actually doing.
As for the lying thing, that was just a bit of colorful language. That said, the game was talked up as being more than just waggle, which it only sort of is, and the sword play was described as never going wrong. Yet I constantly have to calibrate the Wiimote, I constantly get weird inputs and innacurate strikes. Sometimes it works ok, but only in certain ways. Any time I try to move faster than an enemy is able to adjust their guard, I just end up freaking attacking when I'm trying to move to ready for an attack and then hitting their guard, getting thrown into a silly animation and losing health.
@Xtrememuffinman said:
The best part of Skyward Sword isn't the combat- it's the dungeons and exploration. Even without trophies/achievements, I found myself doing EVERYTHING in that game because the proverbial carrot on the stick is super short, and you are constantly getting new things for just a hint of sidetracking, leading to huge tangents from the main game. The next thing to get is always just a couple of minutes away, and as soon as you do that, you're pretty much on your way to something else. I ended up finishing the game with only one heart missing, and having pretty much everything upgraded. It's structured and paced extremely well. But yeah, I get what you're saying about enemies blocking at precisely the right time. The dudes with electric guards really, really pissed me off.
Overall, I'd defintitely say I'm enjoying the game, but I've got to say I find some of the lack of focus and direction a bit frustrating. Maybe I'm just not used to the Zelda style of dungeon puzzle but I've gotten stuck on puzzles that seem just needlessly out of the way, and that ends up being the issue more than the actual solution. I also find myself struggling to figure out what is read progression and what'll just get me some chest with money I can't take because I've already filled my damn wallet.
I also find myself really frustrated at the LACK of new stuff. The game just feels overly long in a pretty unpleasant way.
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