The Guns of Navarro: THQ's Dark Night of the Soul

#101 Posted by Seppli (10251 posts) -

Great read. Tragic story.

Thanks for the great write-up Alex.

#102 Edited by KittyVonDoom (445 posts) -

You're overlooking one thing regarding the WWE games, Alex.

Wrestling fans will buy them regardless of the quality. They will sell the exact same regardless of who makes them, or how long they're under development for. The online is totally busted and the actual gameplay still mind-numbingly tedious? Who cares, pre-order the next one, I heard a rumour they're fixing it. What's this? Wrestling fans... naive?!

WWE should just hire the wrestlers to make the games and makes them FMV quick-time events. Throwing that one out there.

#103 Posted by Voysa_Reezun (39 posts) -

@ProfessorEss said:

@Voysa_Reezun said:

I hope that Deep Silver does leave Volition alone to make The Next Great Game in the Saints Row Franchise, but let's all hope they leave the boob statues out of the pre-order gifts for the special edition.

I can't imagine Deep Silver is gonna mess with Volition, though the idea of Dead Island's limb breaking/severing tech in a Saints Row game could be... interesting. Also, I wouldn't be surprised if the next Saints Row came with a boob statue just to be, well, Saints Row :P

If it did, it would be interpreted to be intentionally so over the top (as the game is) that no one would care, which is good.

Hell, they can force me to display a boob statue in my house as long as it means that I get another Saints Row game.

#104 Posted by Renahzor (991 posts) -

Excellent article, looking forward to more Alex content as usual.

#105 Posted by Mezmero (1795 posts) -

How many times am I going to have to link videos of "Faith of the Heart" this year? Not gonna do it this time but watch yourself. I try not to think of the negative stuff happening in the industry but man do the Bomb crew sure love to bring me down with every chance they get. At least now I have more of a full picture idea of this process written down. Appreciate the write-up Alex. Go get yourself a bagel, you've earned it.

Online
#106 Posted by Alex (1973 posts) -

@KittyVonDoom: That may have been true at one point, but WWE games don't sell like they used to. They've made good money over the years, but they're nowhere near the sales juggernaut they once were.

Which isn't to say there isn't a segment of people who just buy them every year. But that number has been progressively dwindling, which means that whoever does pick it up will have to try to woo back some wayward fans at some point, if they ever hope to be profitable in the long-term.

Staff
#107 Posted by Lurkero (381 posts) -

Vigil may very well be a talented development studio, but I think that Darksiders 2 was underwhelming and that set them on a bad trajectory. If Darksiders 2 would have been as successful as something like Arkham City was to Arkham Asylum then perhaps Vigil would have been in a great position to be bought.

#108 Posted by NekuSakuraba (7240 posts) -

Great article, I already shared my thoughts on all the sales in the original article so I won't clog up the forum with my crappy opinions. :P

Still, all the best to everyone who is left without a job after the whole thing. And THQ, you will be missed, it's so sad to see such a major publisher in the industry go down like this.

#109 Posted by chocolaterhinovampire (1287 posts) -

LOL the screen caption for Volition and Deep Silver was hilarious

#110 Posted by KindOfBlue (21 posts) -

I'll be honest; I visit this site primarily for the video content. Usually I just quickly skim the headlines and leads of the news stories on the front page. This is the first one I've read from beginning to end, and it looks like I'll be paying more attention to the stories on Giant Bomb from now on.

I own a few THQ games, but I was never really a big fan. Still it's sad to see one of the big ones go like this. The more players on the market, the better. Unfortunately the video game industry seems to be heading in a completely different direction...

#111 Posted by Spiritof (2021 posts) -

Navarro owns a Vanilla Ice doll...

This changes everything.

#112 Posted by Gimm3nicotinE (19 posts) -

@HaltIamReptar: It would be a waste of 50 cents if you didn't have the money to then operate the company.

#113 Posted by Senate4242 (97 posts) -

RIP THQ I loved a great deal of your games.

Hopefully Vigil finds a good home as well as anyone left looking for employment.

#114 Posted by Wrighteous86 (3745 posts) -

I'm going to keep commenting on this feature because I'm so happy to see this kind of long-form editorial return to Giant Bomb. Thanks Alex!

#115 Posted by kerse (2100 posts) -

Its pretty sad, I feel like THQ was so close to being one of the best.

#116 Posted by fisk0 (3849 posts) -

Is there really a point to not taking a figure out of the packaging if the packaging is that busted up? It may still be sealed, but isn't the collector's value in sealed boxes that are in or near the shape they were shipped to retailers in?

#117 Posted by Alex (1973 posts) -

@fisk0: The only point to not taking out of the packaging is so I don't lose that stupid tiny plastic microphone it came with. Because if I do, I will.

Staff
#118 Edited by thefncrow (13 posts) -

@jakob187 said:

$500,000 for Vigil? THAT'S A STEAL! Darksiders 1 and 2 BOTH sold harder than that. While Darksiders 2 wasn't ZOMFG BEST GAME EVAR, the game was competent and the team most likely learned from any mistakes made on it. To honestly believe that someone would buy HOMEFRONT for $500k and not AN ENTIRE FUCKING STUDIO WITH AN IP ATTACHED...that's just insanity to me.

When you make a bid on a studio, you have to factor in the cost of running the studio which you become responsible for. Vigil was an 80 person studio, last I heard, so before you make a bid, you have to factor in paying 80 people for however long it takes them to develop a title. Given that Vigil just released a title early this year and was early in the process on a new IP, that might be a solid 2 years of paying 80 salaries before it starts to return any money.

Now, you can cut positions at the studio once you own it, but if you cut too much, you might as well have not bought the studio in the first place since you pushed the talent out the door.

Homefront, as noted, was sold because Crytek was deep in development of Homefront 2. If complications arise with the Homefront IP as a result of THQ's bankruptcy, Crytek could be left with a mostly complete video game that either has to be substantially reworked into something new or just scrapped entirely. $500k to secure the rights and make sure that you have a package that you can now shop to a new publisher is a good deal for Crytek. Homefront doesn't come with a bunch of development studio salaries you have to pay. The only cost assumed in buying the Homefront IP was that Crytek was apparently still due a $1m payment for development costs (which gets written off because now Crytek owes Crytek).

#119 Posted by Xbox420 (125 posts) -

Great article Alex! You should be the only editorial writer on the site.

#120 Posted by fisk0 (3849 posts) -

@Alex: Oh, that makes sense.

#121 Posted by Rasmoss (433 posts) -

THQ was never that good. They made a handfull of decent games but never any big smash hits, and they often made silly decisions like changing the Red Faction franchise just when it was coming good and then dropping it like a hot potato, or throwing all their weight behind behind middling Homefront. They never really had a clear identity either.

#122 Posted by paulwade1984 (477 posts) -

Wow. Alex just sent Patrick to school.

#123 Posted by Baal_Sagoth (1236 posts) -

@jakob187 said:

[...]

Beyond that, I just want to know what happens to Red Faction and Titan Quest. Honestly, I can't believe that Red Faction didn't go with Volition!!! As for Titan Quest, it's a game that still has a ton of support from the community.

Oh right, Titan Quest. I consider that one of the very best Diablo-style ARPGs. Had a huge amount of fun with that one and continued playing it for a long, long time. The original developer went under a good while ago though if I remember that correctly. In that sense it's hard to tell what the 'Diablo 2 with a very unique skill system and Ancient mythology' idea might be worth. My favorite aspect of that game is the exceptionally well done gameplay more than the IP (which is still good nonetheless).

#124 Posted by Vexxan (4615 posts) -

I really hope someone picks up Vigil or their people, need my Darksiders 3...and 4!

#125 Posted by sumjugei (30 posts) -

@HaltIamReptar: There was a min bid, but these are also subject to court approval. You would need the minimum bid and someway showing what you could do with the assets. The other bidders have all published big console games and have other games already in their production pipeline.

#126 Posted by agentboolen (1751 posts) -

THQ might have needed more focus in a certain direction. They really were making games in every direction. I enjoyed the Saints Rows and WWE games at times but for me everything else didn't have my interest. DIdn't they have Juice also?! I would have like some cool Burnout style racing games to come out of that IP. Its sad to see THQ go. If there is one good thing they did it was make respectable wrestling games, if anyone remembers there was a time when we got really bad wrestling games from Acclaim.

#127 Posted by cyrax (205 posts) -

Great article, Alex. Thanks for your words.

#128 Posted by fisk0 (3849 posts) -

@Alex: Do you have any idea what'll happen to the Darksiders franchise if nobody buys the IP or Vigil on the cheap? As there are neither a publisher or a developer associated with the game, I assume it'll be pulled off Steam, PSN and Xbox Live - but would they go the full on Too Human route with delisting the game entirely from the services (got the impression that happened with Too Human from the Unprofessional Friday livestream)? What does happen to the IP if nobody bids for it, would it get in the hands of an insurance company or something like that, like what happened with System Shock, and would somebody be able to make a bid for the IP long after the auctions if it remains unsold, or would it end up in some legal limbo?

#129 Posted by dr_mantas (1798 posts) -

Is that a Geralt of Rivia costume in that screenshot?

#130 Posted by ArtisanBreads (3753 posts) -

Long view, the Relic to SEGA thing is so funny, saying it makes sense.

It totally does just crazy what SEGA has become. Couldn't be happier. They now own the two best strategy devs.

@fisk0 said:

@Alex: Do you have any idea what'll happen to the Darksiders franchise if nobody buys the IP or Vigil on the cheap? As there are neither a publisher or a developer associated with the game, I assume it'll be pulled off Steam, PSN and Xbox Live - but would they go the full on Too Human route with delisting the game entirely from the services (got the impression that happened with Too Human from the Unprofessional Friday livestream)? What does happen to the IP if nobody bids for it, would it get in the hands of an insurance company or something like that, like what happened with System Shock, and would somebody be able to make a bid for the IP long after the auctions if it remains unsold, or would it end up in some legal limbo?

Someone will buy it. Just for the reasons you say, to make money off it on Steam if nothing else.

#131 Posted by fisk0 (3849 posts) -

@ArtisanBreads said:

Long view, the Relic to SEGA thing is so funny, saying it makes sense.

It totally does just crazy what SEGA has become. Couldn't be happier. They now own the two best strategy devs.

@fisk0 said:

@Alex: Do you have any idea what'll happen to the Darksiders franchise if nobody buys the IP or Vigil on the cheap? As there are neither a publisher or a developer associated with the game, I assume it'll be pulled off Steam, PSN and Xbox Live - but would they go the full on Too Human route with delisting the game entirely from the services (got the impression that happened with Too Human from the Unprofessional Friday livestream)? What does happen to the IP if nobody bids for it, would it get in the hands of an insurance company or something like that, like what happened with System Shock, and would somebody be able to make a bid for the IP long after the auctions if it remains unsold, or would it end up in some legal limbo?

Someone will buy it. Just for the reasons you say, to make money off it on Steam if nothing else.

If Vigil are disbanded, would the new owners automatically get the rights to keep publishing the original games, or just to keep doing new games under the IP? Seems like when Sir-Tech closed down and an Japanese publisher got the Wizardry rights, they still didn't get the rights to republish Wizardry 1-8, only to make their own Wizardry games?

#132 Posted by ArtisanBreads (3753 posts) -

@fisk0 said:

@ArtisanBreads said:

Long view, the Relic to SEGA thing is so funny, saying it makes sense.

It totally does just crazy what SEGA has become. Couldn't be happier. They now own the two best strategy devs.

@fisk0 said:

@Alex: Do you have any idea what'll happen to the Darksiders franchise if nobody buys the IP or Vigil on the cheap? As there are neither a publisher or a developer associated with the game, I assume it'll be pulled off Steam, PSN and Xbox Live - but would they go the full on Too Human route with delisting the game entirely from the services (got the impression that happened with Too Human from the Unprofessional Friday livestream)? What does happen to the IP if nobody bids for it, would it get in the hands of an insurance company or something like that, like what happened with System Shock, and would somebody be able to make a bid for the IP long after the auctions if it remains unsold, or would it end up in some legal limbo?

Someone will buy it. Just for the reasons you say, to make money off it on Steam if nothing else.

If Vigil are disbanded, would the new owners automatically get the rights to keep publishing the original games, or just to keep doing new games under the IP? Seems like when Sir-Tech closed down and an Japanese publisher got the Wizardry rights, they still didn't get the rights to republish Wizardry 1-8, only to make their own Wizardry games?

Now that I don't know about, good point.

I feel pretty certain someone will buy the rights to make money off the old games though, it's a no brainer.

We'll see though I guess.

#133 Posted by jsmoke (6 posts) -

vigil not selling is a head scratcher for me

#134 Posted by ArbitraryWater (11478 posts) -

While I'm glad that Relic seems to have found the best home possible and Volition will at least still be trucking along for a few years, the loss of Vigil is somewhat tragic. Now I haven't played a ton of Darksiders, but it seems clear that they were a talented studio and people losing their jobs is never a good thing.

Great article Alex.

Online
#135 Posted by Miketakon (513 posts) -

More of these and less of that other guys articles.

#136 Edited by planetary (341 posts) -

@paulwade1984 said:

Wow. Alex just sent Patrick to school.

Yep. Alex knows how to write, and this is a well-thought, well-written piece.

#137 Posted by hollitz (1422 posts) -

Nintendo should acquire Vigil. While I don't think that the puzzly elements in Darksiders are quite on par with Zelda, Vigil is really amazing at making a Zelda style game. I think Nintendo would get a lot of good will if they let Vigil make a proper Zelda ala Retro Studios with Metroid.

#138 Posted by Spam101 (142 posts) -

goodnight sweet prince

#139 Posted by King9999 (608 posts) -

Platinum Games expressed interest in Darksiders. Hopefully they can get that franchise. But then what about the team at Vigil...?

#140 Edited by Carousel (418 posts) -

@dr_mantas said:

Is that a Geralt of Rivia costume in that screenshot?

I believe it is.

Also, great article, Alex.

Informative, interesting, and fun to read.

#141 Posted by KlUMZeE (315 posts) -

Great article Alex, sad to see THQ go, but with all the missteps it was only a matter of time. Good luck to everyone involved.

#142 Posted by wsowen02 (318 posts) -
suddenly does a $20 million cannonball into the pool

I loved this line. It's funny but also somehow very accurate.

#143 Posted by SuperZamrod (269 posts) -

Man Alex is a great writer. A true games "journalist".

#144 Posted by Amaru25 (146 posts) -

Never played any Darksiders games. Should fix that.

#145 Posted by development (2076 posts) -

@planetary said:

@paulwade1984 said:

Wow. Alex just sent Patrick to school.

Yep. Alex knows how to write, and this is a well-thought, well-written piece.

he does. it's too bad he tries to pull the same jokes and tricks in spoken-word, and they always fail.

#146 Posted by sirdesmond (1234 posts) -

This is a really great piece. Heartfelt, genuine and interesting. Would read again. A++++++

#147 Edited by pw2566ch (480 posts) -

@LordAndrew said:

@pw2566ch said:

I'm curious as to if Double Fine were to purchase their own games from this auction.

Double Fine already owns the rights to their games.

They don't own the rights to Costume Quest or Stacking. It was mentioned in one of the Giant Bombcasts.

#148 Posted by WarlordPayne (694 posts) -

I hope Deep Silver gets Red Faction, too. I want Volition whole and free to make their crazy their way.

#149 Posted by Jonny_Anonymous (913 posts) -

I really hope Vigil gets snapped up

#150 Posted by mrfluke (5093 posts) -

@planetary said:

@paulwade1984 said:

Wow. Alex just sent Patrick to school.

Yep. Alex knows how to write, and this is a well-thought, well-written piece.

alex was part of the gamespot team of the old era, for my money that games journalist team was the best around, if that team was still together, or all that team was part of giantbomb, no one would be able to touch them

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