Something went wrong. Try again later

Giant Bomb News

289 Comments

The Guns of Navarro: The More Things Change...

Alex wonders aloud why, for all the progress the game industry has made in the last generation, we're still fighting the same cultural battles over and over again.

I'm coming up on ten years working professionally in this industry (something I'll reminisce more about in a month or so). This realization has me feeling a bit nostalgic lately, not to mention thinking about the many changes that have come in that time. I'm of course referring to things like the huge advances in technology and interactivity we've seen, the groundswell of support for independent gaming, the rise of competitive gaming as a medium people will actually pay attention to, and a greater focus from the endemic press (not always positively, certainly) on the human side of the game industry, among other things.

The ugly specter of Jack Thompson's legacy continues to haunt our industry to this day. How have we allowed that to happen?
The ugly specter of Jack Thompson's legacy continues to haunt our industry to this day. How have we allowed that to happen?

These are all, to be sure, major shifts that have occurred over a relatively short span of time, as these things go. As an industry, we have most certainly evolved into something bigger, crazier, and frankly just a lot more interesting than what we were ten years ago. Which is why I find it all the more frustrating that we're still dealing--or, in many cases, not dealing--with the same cultural problems that plagued this business long before I even started in earnest.

Back when I began my career, video games were mostly mired in a place of cultural scapegoating and mockery. Jack Thompson, the patron saint of saying ridiculous things and somehow getting the media to repeat them, had just begun his war on Grand Theft Auto and the supposed sickening violence of our industry. Fast-forward to January, 2013. The primordial crazy being spouted by Jack Thompson has been taken up by actual politicians. And no, I'm not just talking about the likes of Leland Yee, whose campaign to ban violent video games in California was met with an expensively dismissive wanking motion from the Supreme Court. I'm talking about those who, in the wake of the tragedy at Sandy Hook, have taken to violent games as the scapegoat du jour. I'm talking about major political figures like Vice President Joe Biden, who has at least shown an ounce of restraint when talking about the need to research the link between violent video games and violence in reality, as well as Senator Lamar Alexander, who demonstrated the opposite of restraint when he said violent video games were "a bigger problem than guns."

It boils down to this: as I look at the perception problems that plagued the industry in the past, and the perception problems that plague the industry now, I'm seeing far more overlap than I feel like I ought to. But why is that the case?

For one thing, I don't think we've ever done a particularly good job of defending ourselves. Gamasutra's Kris Graft wrote an intriguing piece back when Biden was first making overtures to the game industry over Sandy Hook. The whole piece is worth a read, though to sum it up, Graft basically believed that going to meet with Biden under the auspices of helping to "fix" gun violence in America was tantamount to admitting we're part of the problem. In my opinion, he was absolutely right. While I respect those who disagreed with Kris--including IGN's EIC Casey Lynch, whose retort was equally thoughtful--having seen the result of the meeting, it's difficult to believe that our representatives going there really did much of anything except to help galvanize the notion that violent video games really do have a serious place in this conversation. Now the news media has picked up on this violent video games angle all over again, just as it did with Jack Thompson so many years back.

Ignoring outreach from the Vice President's office wouldn't have necessarily been a smart move either, because that says we're indifferent to these kinds of problems. Rather, it might have been nice to see a response to Biden's invitation that rejected the question of "how can we help to stop gun violence in America" on the merits that video game violence has never been linked directly to actual violence, or at least not any more than violent films, violent music, or whatever else. The ESA, who are ostensibly the lobbying agency for our industry, have made a few limp reiterations of that fact in statements following Sandy Hook and the meeting with Biden. It was the ESA who helped win us the right to constitutionally protected free speech in that fateful Supreme Court case. So why are they not more confidently responding now, knowing this is the case?

The ESA has done some good work defending the industry, but when it comes to the violence debate, its responses have lacked strength.
The ESA has done some good work defending the industry, but when it comes to the violence debate, its responses have lacked strength.

There are those of us out there who are, at least, trying to steer the conversation back to a saner place. The always great Adam Sessler had an interesting bit on Fox News' live webcast this past week, speaking about the history of video games and their similar persecution compared to music, film, and even opera. Plenty of writers have written intelligent op-eds expressing weariness over the continuation of this debate, especially in the face of all the research that's been done previously. But it often feels like we're talking at ourselves. Hell, I'm probably just as guilty of that right now as anyone else. Which is why I maybe find it a bit frustrating that those who are chosen to represent us in the larger scope of the world aren't more assertively balking at this notion that we need even more research into these supposed links between violent games and real world violence. Why have I not seen a press conference that simply features the head of the ESA staring slack-jawed at a TV monitor featuring Wayne LaPierre's airing of grievances over Mortal Kombat and Bulletstorm? Why has nobody in any position of significant power in this industry simply gotten in front of a camera and said, "Look, you have got this all wrong..."?

Again, I don't have a solid answer to that, though I imagine business reasons most certainly factor in. It's difficult for the game industry to turn the tables on the NRA's hateful video game rhetoric when you consider that the same arms manufacturers that fund the group are the ones who hold the rights to the guns we license for those same violent video games that the NRA supposedly is lambasting. That's a web of ugly that reared its head this week thanks to Eurogamer's Simon Parkin. I haven't been able to get it out of my head since.

Biden's office was right about one thing. The video game industry does have a perception problem, but the issue isn't solely inherent to the violence it purveys. We, as enthusiasts of the medium, are often portrayed as loners, social outcasts, and, quite frankly, cringe-worthy human beings by those who have not taken the time to understand that those are really only a very small portion of our greater whole. People aren't so much worried about "violent video games" as they are "violent video games played by people who are probably socially awkward serial murderers." The picture of seething, hateful blobs of humanity resting comfortably in an office chair as they curse at and "pwn" people in grotesquely violent shooters has become the default picture people call up when thinking of those who play games. There are people like this, and they are loud, crude creatures who frankly misrepresent the notion of what gaming is supposed to be about (fun, competition, interactivity, creative expression, among other things). There are awful people like this in every facet of entertainment, but somehow, we've let our awfuls become our default image. Angry commenters, forum trolls, and thoughtless haters are stealing our narrative and feeding into this resentful and fearful perception people have of what games are all about. All the while, those who are actually paid to represent this medium are quietly nodding along, trying to figure out how to right a ship that feels like it's been rudderless for ages.

Ultimately, it starts with us, and our seeming inability to communicate our better qualities to the outside world. It's not as if gaming hasn't produced remarkable stories outside of the most wretched connections to those who do terrible things. As one particularly recent example, amid all the THQ layoffs of last week, it impressed me to no end how quickly the many developers and publishers came together to collect and promote job listings for those who suddenly found themselves unemployed. I can't think of another industry so quick to spring into action like that when their peers--and, quite frankly, their previous competitors--find themselves in a tough spot.

I am very much looking forward to Grand Theft Auto V. I am less looking forward to the recursive conversations about video game violence it's likely to spark up all over again.
I am very much looking forward to Grand Theft Auto V. I am less looking forward to the recursive conversations about video game violence it's likely to spark up all over again.

Cleaning up our image isn't just about making ourselves look less overtly obsessed with violence (though, that would probably help). It's about making people recognize us as people, making them recognize the good this industry is capable of, and that any large community can't be adequately judged by its few bad eggs. We've spent way too much time allowing the media, politicians, and frankly a good chunk of the rest of the world dehumanize us into easily dismissed, mock-worthy caricatures. We've let a perceived obsession with violence define us.

We have made major strides in recent years at diversifying this medium, both in terms of the kinds of games we play, as well as those who call gaming a personal pastime. But we've done this quietly, internally, and in a way that has clearly had no major impact on how those outside of our core group view us. As a result, here we are, however many years later, still facing these same issues, these same stereotypes, these same political push-backs that feel like they should have dissipated into obscurity long ago.

I guess I just find all of that a little bit sad.

--A

Alex Navarro on Google+

289 Comments

Avatar image for machofantastico
MachoFantastico

6762

Forum Posts

24

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 73

User Lists: 4

Edited By MachoFantastico

Great article (and the ones you linked were great to, thanks for that). It's a fascinating and yes, sad subject. What scares me is how quickly video game violence as become the prime target. Now I don't live in the United States so don't know what it's like to live in a culture where guns are so, well accepted. Hell, I've never even held an actual gun in my life and I wouldn't be sad if I never did. So I feel that the perspective of those who live in countries where guns are technically illegal don't take into account the cultural or social impacts.

But making video games the scapegoat was always a possibility. Let's be honest, nothing will be done. The US government are to scared to make changes and if any serious action is taken, it'll be towards video games rather than gun control. We debate this continually, but at the end of the day it still makes me sad to think about what happened at that school and if that can't change anything, nothing will. Like I said, I didn't grow up in the United States so I can't appreciate the cultural acceptance guns have. All I know is that a cousin of mine lived, married and had children in the US a few years back and owned two guns (both pistols I believe) and I remember him saying how awful he felt having them in the house with kids. But he added that it was the 'done' thing in the US, a common method of protection. Yet it's two wrongs don't make a right.

It's a complicated issue and to be honest, I'm thankful we don't have to worry about this issue in the UK (though gun crime is still an issue over here, though no where near as bad as in the US). I just hope that once the dust as settled, it's not video games that take the hit... that would be bad for all. Great piece Alex.

Avatar image for mofaz
Mofaz

62

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Edited By Mofaz

I think the bigger issue with videogames is that they provide inappropriate coping with emotional issues by resorting to addictive escapism and perpetuating underwhelming management of aggression through playing them. Since it's only a single human being maintaining their respective aggression levels while they're playing a game, you're going to see people resorting to utilizing coping methods they've learned through isolative videogames. That means less appropriate social expression, a greater anger and aggressive response to things a habitual gamer encounters in day to day life, and less real-world coping and emotional management skills in response to real-world situations.

It's easy enough to smash and destroy controllers, self-harm by striking yourself or objects, or to scream and curse at your TV. The more you do these things in response to anger or frustration placed towards a videogame, the more likely you are to demonstrate them in other situations, it's a Pavlovian response, but to anger and other emotions, rather than external stimuli. That's just a tiny part of the issue however, understanding how and why videogames tend to exacerbate aggressive tendencies in individuals is something that still takes a lot of study before it'll fully come to light.

That being said, the issue is more along the lines of, a person who is already emotionally unstable or performs inappropriate coping responses, will only be further harmed through the playing of a violent videogames. Why? Because not all outlets are created equal, videogames are not like a sport, they are sedentary, there's no kinetic movement of your muscles, no physical exertion, no exercise, no real social experience to them beyond a disconnected digital environment with other players, and most importantly, the "fun" response you get from videogames isn't conducive to a healthy lifestyle like that of an active individual's.

So yes, excessive gaming is definitely a societal ill, but it's up there with things like watching too much TV, too many violent movies or etc. Media does influence you, but the greatest part of it is the fact that we, as human beings, tend to distance ourselves from our problems as much as we can, and videogames are just another one of those things. A regular, casual player, a weekend player, or an "hour a day" player is perfectly fine, but people addicted to videogames are definitely going to suffer as a result.

So why does no one ever respond to these issues in any sensible way?

1. The media turns it into "Videogames make people violent," they don't, they simply nurture that behavior, but already violent people will not be benefited in any way, shape, or form, by escapist entertainment, nor will young people benefit from it either, and since children have addictive personalities that are easily fascinated with repetitive and easily approachable concepts, it's even worse to let your kids play videogames compulsively. It's why good parents control their childrens' media intake and try to keep them from violent entertainment. To the impressionable, violent and aggressive expression is regularly reinforced by things that glorify them and when people have not have much emotional conditioning in their life (kids, individuals who are shut-ins), videogames can eventually create those tendencies by themselves. You can deny that as much as you like and give me all your anecdotal bullshit evidence pointing out how you "turned out" fine. But that's another thing.

2. Gamers are overly fucking defensive, pathetically so, even the VERY STUDIES that SHOW videogames aren't exactly a beneficial societal stimulus (like TV or habitual drug use) with absolutely no bias within them are viciously rejected by the gaming community. It's another thing that makes this industry seem so childish. Everyone is constantly holding their hands over their balls. They REFUSE to see, understand, or even register that there are things they might like that are not entirely sound in their implementation in the modern era. This is a young medium, and as such, it's trending towards things that are immediately consumable and drive towards appeasing more base requirements when it comes to entertainment. It's why a child obsessively watching exploitative horror or action films will become overstimulated, because it over-gives, and it does so simply to maintain rigid interest. Everyone should be able to watch a slow paced drama, but not everyone can, because they've been conditioned by different moldings of various mediums. That's just the way it is, but it's typically that way because of excess consumption. It's the same as drug use (since physical and psychological addiction typically have the same mental symptoms), you eventually dull your ability to enjoy things that do not stimulate on the same level. The industry as it is now is overstimulating, exploitative shlock with thousands of man-children willing to defend its every misstep.

And when you realize the simple reason for that is because they're already part of the consequence, it's even more sad.

The only thing I can say is, grow up, take a long hard look at the evidence, and stop jumping the gun at everything. Responding to the media with your own salivating bullshit and your own anecdotal insanity while ignoring the evidence that yes, videogames are not good for people who are already emotionally immature, or really, children either in anything even approaching a level higher than "low intake," and yes, the way it's regulated in this industry is complete stupidity. The way its advertised is utterly stupid as well.

Right now, gaming is either for children, or for grown-ups who are still children, at least, that's how the face of it all looks. Our image is shit, because our "drink" is Mountain Dew, because we're still a collective defined by memes, because whenever anyone brings up ANY problem with us, it's always met with frothing protestations or calm, yet entirely uneducated,"experts" in the industry who are people about as well versed in the subject as your average caveman. Sessler, mentioned in this article, is a prime example of that.

This industry's representation is shit, its response to every god damn thing is shit.

Women are objectified objects in gaming? Examples of non-existent imaginary "reverse sexism" are thrown out by a much, much, much too large portion of the community, as well as a plethora of other pathetic excuses. The same goes for racism, the same goes for excessive pointless violence, the same goes for the inherently stupid exploitative shit this industry does.

So videogames essentially producing individuals with less appropriate maintenance of aggression? Same fucking shit, excuses, stories pulled out of their ass, articles like this that hand-wave it away and try to pull the same bandwagon communal shit.

Look at yourself, look at this cesspool of an industry, it's the reason why, when I come home, I play an hour of a game, then absolutely nothing for the rest of the day, or absolutely nothing the day after. Because I can't stand it. I can't play half the god damn games that come out these days simply because they were made by imbecilic troglodytes who apparently don't understand they're in the 21st century where entertainment should, but unfortunately doesn't, have a higher meter for being something other than an idiotic bushel of exploitative crap.

Videogames objectify women nonstop, videogames continue to make a pathetic joke out of anything that isn't white or male, videogames continue to have an utterly idiotic image catered to preteens, it's filled with excessively violent, ugly, stupid, insipid games that are nothing but fast food for the brain and junk food for every single part of your emotional well being.

So yes, quit letting your fucking shut-in kids sit in front of the computer all day. Stop that shit right now, because it's fucking bad. And stop getting so defensive at shit that is just the plain truth because it hurts your feelings.

Avatar image for bruno0091
bruno0091

132

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 24

Edited By bruno0091

@President_Barackbar said:

@bruno0091 said:

Here's the thing I don't get, and maybe it's a culture thing, why don't you guys just make ESRB ratings legally enforceable? PEGI is legally enforceable in the UK (and other European countries), but it's still a self regulated body.

It's not going to stop kids getting there hands of games that, really, they probably shouldn't be playing, but it will at least make it harder for them to get a hold of those games and in theory, shift more blame to the parents and their part in all this.

It's not a cure-all, but it's a step in the right direction and to me, makes perfect sense, but then I've grown up with a rating system like this, before PEGI it was the BBFC.

That's basically what the recent Supreme Court ruling in Brown v Entertainment Merchant's Association was about. Since the MPAA (films) and RIAA (music) ratings aren't legally binding, video games should not be singled out like they are more harmful than movies or music. Forcing ratings is harmful, because then smaller indies who don't submit to the ESRB would be barred from selling games. Besides, if ESRB ratings WERE legally enforceable, it would just cause parents to shift more blame to the government. Lazy parents will always find a way to make sure they cant be held accountable for anything.

Got ya, I thought Movie ratings were already legally binding in the USA, like the BBFC ratings in the UK are. That's weird, maybe they should sort that out as well, I certainly don't think one medium should be exempt when another isn't. I can't think of a good reason for them not to be legally binding, if parents want their kids to still be able to watch films rated older than their age, they can buy it for them. That's what happens here, but at least then the onus is on the parents.

Avatar image for dedbeet
DedBeet

756

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 4

Edited By DedBeet
Avatar image for erisron
ErisRon

110

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Edited By ErisRon

This is such a great read, Alex. Thanks.

Avatar image for mars_cleric
Mars_Cleric

1654

Forum Posts

24

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 3

Edited By Mars_Cleric

We need a sign.

To rally the people, to call them to arms, to bring them in line!

Avatar image for dan_citi
Dan_CiTi

5601

Forum Posts

308

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 2

Edited By Dan_CiTi

I remember like 5+ years back G4 had a segment on a show about Columbine, and how the kids who committed the shooting played Doom. Lorne Lanning of Oddworld Inhabitants was interviewed and essentially explained human beings have the ability to compartmentalize, and if you actually go through with committing an atrocity such as a school shooting, you have plenty of other, far more serious and fucked up things going on in your life/head.

Avatar image for feikken
Feikken

226

Forum Posts

3

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 2

Edited By Feikken

Alex you rule

Avatar image for grimluck343
Grimluck343

1384

Forum Posts

20

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 2

Edited By Grimluck343

We're arguing about gun control in a comment thread for an article titled "The Guns of Navarro."

Avatar image for president_barackbar
President_Barackbar

3648

Forum Posts

853

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 2

@bruno0091 said:

Here's the thing I don't get, and maybe it's a culture thing, why don't you guys just make ESRB ratings legally enforceable? PEGI is legally enforceable in the UK (and other European countries), but it's still a self regulated body.

It's not going to stop kids getting there hands of games that, really, they probably shouldn't be playing, but it will at least make it harder for them to get a hold of those games and in theory, shift more blame to the parents and their part in all this.

It's not a cure-all, but it's a step in the right direction and to me, makes perfect sense, but then I've grown up with a rating system like this, before PEGI it was the BBFC.

That's basically what the recent Supreme Court ruling in Brown v Entertainment Merchant's Association was about. Since the MPAA (films) and RIAA (music) ratings aren't legally binding, video games should not be singled out like they are more harmful than movies or music. Forcing ratings is harmful, because then smaller indies who don't submit to the ESRB would be barred from selling games. Besides, if ESRB ratings WERE legally enforceable, it would just cause parents to shift more blame to the government. Lazy parents will always find a way to make sure they cant be held accountable for anything.

Avatar image for theht
TheHT

15998

Forum Posts

1562

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 9

Edited By TheHT

Man... maybe we need Judges.

Dredd was awesome.

Avatar image for spaghettitime
spaghettitime

33

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Edited By spaghettitime

@bruno0091: If you're at all familiar with the MPAA/RIAA here in the United States you might have some semblance of an idea why that might not exactly be at the top of our interests.

Avatar image for bruno0091
bruno0091

132

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 24

Edited By bruno0091

Here's the thing I don't get, and maybe it's a culture thing, why don't you guys just make ESRB ratings legally enforceable? PEGI is legally enforceable in the UK (and other European countries), but it's still a self regulated body.

It's not going to stop kids getting there hands of games that, really, they probably shouldn't be playing, but it will at least make it harder for them to get a hold of those games and in theory, shift more blame to the parents and their part in all this.

It's not a cure-all, but it's a step in the right direction and to me, makes perfect sense, but then I've grown up with a rating system like this, before PEGI it was the BBFC.

Avatar image for richardpie
Richardpie

20

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 0

Edited By Richardpie

Video games as a medium for entertainment is still relatively new in comparison to it's peers. Right now we're at a weird point in time where we're still between a generation of people that grew up with video games and people that have not. This creates a divisive perspective concerning how people view games as a whole and it's impact on society.

Still I feel that even people that are passionate about games and it's industry have a hard time defending it because we simply do not know ourselves of the extent of how games can influence our overall lives. Just my 2 cents.

Avatar image for njean777
njean777

49

Forum Posts

26

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Edited By njean777

Wow, great article Alex, keep it up.

Avatar image for deactivated-630b11c195a3b
deactivated-630b11c195a3b

1072

Forum Posts

96

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 5

Great right up and I thank you for linking the article about gun licencing in games, which may be one of the best articles written by a games journalist I've read in a very long time.

Avatar image for koolaid
koolaid

1435

Forum Posts

16

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Edited By koolaid

Both Patrick and Alex have mentioned this eurogamer article. I don't really understand what is so surprising or "disturbing" about it.

Maybe it depends on where you fall on the gun debate, but I read it as 'companies like it when their product gets more exposure' Not really an earthshaking revelation to me. Did any one feel like it was an eye opening article?

Avatar image for ares42
Ares42

4563

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Edited By Ares42

The premise of this article does not line up with it's content. To directly address the main question of "why are we still fighting the same stereotypes?" is actually very easy, it's just ignorance. A racist will always consider mexicans lazy, a sexist will always consider women weak, a homophobe will always consider gays dirty. It's just the nature of ignorant stereotypes. For the ignorant videogames will always be something addictive that kids do that messes with their heads and makes them crazy.

The problem isn't that we need to change the issue, we need to minimize the ignorance. And over the years we have, but the ignorant crowd (no matter how big or small) will always have the same ignorant accusations. Because that's how ignorance works.

Avatar image for fiercedeity
FierceDeity

364

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Edited By FierceDeity

@towolie said:

@drakesfortune said:

Eh, who cares. It'll work itself out. Though your comment on Biden and Alexander shows your own political bias more than anything. Either inanimate objects are responsible for killing people, or they are not. Either we hold the people who do the acts responsible, or we blame scapegoat X, Y, or Z.

YOUR president, Obama, has been going after the video game industry since day one. Yet, he gets the pass, because he's got a D after his name, and you like them there fellers, and you don't like dem der fellers with the R after their name.

The video game journalism industry has the same problem the regular media does, in that you suffer from group think. You all have the same political ideology, and it seeps more and more into your regular coverage every day. It's nauseating. NAUSEATING.

I'm here for GAMES. I don't want to discuss politics here. Yet, the only way conservatives are heard in your industry, is in forums. Because you all have mind melded, you're all followers, you all think the same. It's group think in the extreme.

To sum it up, we have the right to carry arms not to protect ourselves against our neighbors, but to protect ourselves against a tyrannical government. Some people are going to die to keep that freedom. Cars kill many more young people, adults, and others as a result of their use. Yet we live with that risk. We get in our cars every day, and your much more likely to be killed maimed and destroyed in your car. Giving up our gun rights, to prevent a tiny amount of deaths, is short sighted, stupid, insane, and makes no sense. I can think of about 10 different ways, without a gun, to inflict more damage than was done at ANY of these gun massacres. To think that taking away guns is going to prevent crazy people from going on a killing rampage, is pure stupidity. What was used at the Oklahoma City bombing? Yeah, not a gun. How many people died? Many times the total number of these mass shooting sprees.

Liberal video game journalists (the only kind there are) are quick to go after guns and try to blame them. Just like liberal and conservative old people are quick to blame video games. Truth is, the killers kill the people. Most, if not all, of them are mentally ill. They are probably influenced negatively by games, and movies. Putting ideas in their heads. Then, having those mentally ill people have access to assault weapons, also makes things worse.

So can we try to solve this problem, without giving up basic rights. History is littered with democracies that failed. Ours has been resilient because of our protection of minority viewpoints, and because of the protection of our liberties. Both are eroded as time go on, and eventually our country will fail. Let's try not to rush to that failure...

i respectfully inform you that you are wrong about gun's, just look at the rest of the first world country's and you will see a HUGE difference in regular violence, gun violence and prison counts.

the one major difference between those country's and America? guns are illegal ( unless you take proper training and with background check ) and lets be honest here, like your guns are ever going to overthrow your self created monster of an army...

United States and Vietnam. Soviet Union and Afghanistan. United States and Afghanistan. And many, many more examples...

It's as if you've never heard of asymmetrical warfare. Sorry, but his argument is completely valid when you look at those historical examples. You, on the other hand, didn't present one iota of evidence to back your assertion.

Avatar image for fiercedeity
FierceDeity

364

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Edited By FierceDeity

@Lazyaza said:

I do love how American politicians point the finger at games when their is practically a vending machine on every street in US selling assault rifles for $5.99 meanwhile joe-mc-average-crazy is in a room for 12 months, alone and ignored and then everyone asks GOSH why'd he go crazy and shoot a bunch of people? vidya games of course!

Right. We're just tripping over guns left and right here in the states. Can't go more than 10 feet without seeing a gun.

Avatar image for bricewgilbert
bricewgilbert

270

Forum Posts

1

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 12

User Lists: 25

Edited By bricewgilbert

I don't know. This is obviously anecdotal, but the straight up sexist crowd seems to be quite large, and the anti-feminist crowd is even larger. Sometimes it feels like it's the majority.

Avatar image for manlybeast
ManlyBeast

1234

Forum Posts

49

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 3

User Lists: 6

Edited By ManlyBeast

Cause people live uninteresting lives and have to come up with something to argue about to pass the time. Common sense isn't always common

Avatar image for vigil80
Vigil80

477

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 2

Edited By Vigil80

@Judakel: No, he shouldn't. All this "culture" buzzword talk is overblown. It's just attractive to assign blame, especially when the actual perpetrator isn't around to take it himself.

@thekingoftoilets said:

Superb write-up Alex, per usual. I view the whole debacle over violent video games = real life violence to be a bit of a naive statement myself, and I think when it comes down to it, the culture of today's multimedia needs to be examined as a whole upon individuals that allow different types of media to alter their mood and attitudes. I have a full-flung opinion I could harp on about, but if I were to summarize, I would say that when people do their jobs (parents taking attention to what their child's watch, play, and listen to, and store clerks ID'ing customers for Mature purchases), and someone is there to listen and be understanding and take the proper steps towards help when it is needed, then maybe something could be stopped before it even remotely starts.

If people want simple answers so badly, I wish they'd take a closer look at statements like your last sentence there.

That's why when people ask, "But wait, what if violent media does have an effect?" I don't think it really changes anything. It isn't like banning and censoring would suddenly become a good idea, the right answer. People with problems need options. Parents need to parent.

Avatar image for thekingoftoilets
thekingoftoilets

217

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 2

Edited By thekingoftoilets

Superb write-up Alex, per usual. I view the whole debacle over violent video games = real life violence to be a bit of a naive statement myself, and I think when it comes down to it, the culture of today's multimedia needs to be examined as a whole upon individuals that allow different types of media to alter their mood and attitudes. I have a full-flung opinion I could harp on about, but if I were to summarize, I would say that when people do their jobs (parents taking attention to what their child's watch, play, and listen to, and store clerks ID'ing customers for Mature purchases), and someone is there to listen and be understanding and take the proper steps towards help when it is needed, then maybe something could be stopped before it even remotely starts.

Avatar image for likeassur
LikeaSsur

1625

Forum Posts

517

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Edited By LikeaSsur

While this is all well and good, how exactly am I, Joe Schmo Nobody, supposed to show that the gaming culture as a whole isn't as bad as the stereotype claims it is? That's a huge hole in this article that Alex didn't even touch.

Avatar image for featurepreacher
featurepreacher

40

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Edited By featurepreacher

The answer is time and generations. It just takes time for this generation to get old enough to dominate congress so when anyone tries to scapegoat video games the conversation is immediately squashed and the people who bring it up look like complete idiots.

Avatar image for artisanbreads
ArtisanBreads

9107

Forum Posts

154

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 2

User Lists: 6

Edited By ArtisanBreads

@LPRaver89 said:

I always found it funny that the people blaming video games are always the people who have never played them.

Just look at the picture provided. You know he has never played those games for a second and you know he would NEVER hold up some DVD cases like that.

Avatar image for artisanbreads
ArtisanBreads

9107

Forum Posts

154

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 2

User Lists: 6

Edited By ArtisanBreads

@Cold_Wolven said:

Another great insightful article from Alex, the link to Adam Sessler's video interview with Fox provided a good perspective from Sessler as the man knows what he is talking about.

For sure.

Also nice to see them just actually listen to what he has to say. Fox News has its bad hosts of course but that was good to see.

Avatar image for jazz_lafayette
Jazz_Lafayette

3897

Forum Posts

844

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 14

Edited By Jazz_Lafayette
@Hobosunday said:

We need a leader. A person who can rise among our ranks and help stop this thought process. Someone who is charismatic and intelligent. Someone who breaks the stereotypes gamers have held for so long. It might not fix everything, but it's a step in the right direction.

Alright, I can take a hint.
Avatar image for coldwolven
Cold_Wolven

2583

Forum Posts

3

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Edited By Cold_Wolven

Another great insightful article from Alex, the link to Adam Sessler's video interview with Fox provided a good perspective from Sessler as the man knows what he is talking about.

Avatar image for prezabelincoln
prezabelincoln

82

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Edited By prezabelincoln

I always found it funny that the people blaming video games are always the people who have never played them.

Avatar image for judakel
Judakel

116

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Edited By Judakel

@darkdragonmage99 said:

@Judakel: I'll gladly blame something other then guns because I know a certain number and I know the driver of america's murder rate.

80% of murders in this country are gang related gangs are killing each other over drug turf just like gangs killed each other over alcohol turf. If you want to solve the violence problem in this country end Prohibition. it is truly as simple as that it worked the first time it will work again.

No, you should blame guns as well. They are most certainly a part of the problem. How could they not be? In order to extinguish the gun culture in this country, we need to change the laws so those gangs can't thrive, we need to improve education, and lots of other things. However, you can't destroy gun culture without controlling the guns. You're going in the right direction with ending prohibition, but you're not thinking big enough.

Avatar image for judakel
Judakel

116

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Edited By Judakel

@towolie said:

@Judakel said:

@towolie said:

@Judakel said:

@towolie said:

@Judakel said:

@Alex: My comments are simply a warning against emboldening the individuals who have no qualms about declaring violence to be a "fine" thing in games and all media. To get rid of America's detestable gun culture, all forms of media will have to look really hard at the content they are creating and reevaluate their stance on gun violence without purpose.

Discussing what needs to be done as far as game violence is particularly difficult with games, since it is such an artistically immature medium. It is difficult to separate games that have artistically justifiable reasons for their gun violence from those that aim simply to attract eyeballs.

There will come a day when games are no longer singled out. Whether this will be due to the influence of lobbyists or an artistic maturity which makes it clear certain forms of video game violence are artistically legitimate remains to be seen. I hope it is the latter.

plz don't do that, we in Europe love to keep having fun/violent game's. don't ruin my games because your culture apparently can't handle it.

if you should do one thing, its to stop all this gun madness. in my country all these problems are practically unheard of.

( not trying to offend you, we should even give them ground of acting like this is a serious problem )

Sorry, but you must "suffer" so that we may endure. The prospect of changing our gun culture should be appealing to you despite the fact you live in another country.

hehe, nah what you do with your gun's is fully your choice. i just have the silly hope the we as a species can one day move beyond all the silly violence in the world.

i am however glad that gun's are illegal where i live. and i'd like to keep violence and sex/nudity in my entertainment. ( watching spartacus right now, its amazing! )

I don't think the problem is just any gun violence, but rather some gratuitous violence and the way we advertise violent games so as to make them appealing to people who are far too young to be playing them.

than explain why this is a non issue in at least northern europe. we play the same game's and watch the same show's. again its not my country and by extent not my choice on how you should deal with it. i'm just wondering what you think the difference whit these things are between america and europe.

also wanted to say sorry for my very first reply, i was a bit pissed and that rubbed off on my response.

The problem is the gun culture in America. Hence the "we" in my post. No one is talking about you and your country.

Among the ways to fix our culture: Change the way we advertise games with gun violence in them, stricter gun control laws (I am all for a weapons ban, period), saner drug laws that don't add to the disenfranchised, "criminal" population of this country, etc. The list goes on and on. The problem is so multi-faceted and so far-reaching that we need to tackle various issues. The three main areas are culture, gun violence by non-career criminals, and gun violence by career criminals. Each requires some comprehensive changes.

Avatar image for veektarius
veektarius

6420

Forum Posts

45

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 11

User Lists: 1

Edited By veektarius

@Chumm: The truth of the matter is, we can't be sure whether you're right about that, and we can't be sure whether I'm right about it either. The sorts of longitudinal studies that would be required to determine the behavioral outcomes of gaming would be hugely invasive in raising children. However, for what evidence there is, there's more to suggest that violent stimuli lead to violent behavior than there are to suggest that violent stimuli suppress violent behavior. I think that it is, at least, a very strong/bold statement to claim that there is no one who is so unstable as to improperly blur the borders between video game and reality.

Avatar image for artisanbreads
ArtisanBreads

9107

Forum Posts

154

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 2

User Lists: 6

Edited By ArtisanBreads

Good read Alex. I mean it didn't come to much of an ultimate conclusion... I guess that's the issue. As you say, we are talking to ourselves at a point. They don't want to hear us.

Frankly, I just think we aren't ingrained enough in the corrupt system, which is sad.

Just someone who is very down on our government here but I think, for good reason.

@tescovee said:

Weird that never does any one just say "fucked up families make fucked up kids", instead of blaming things. Any who...Ill be dead and people will still be bitching over guns, weed, abortion and violent media.

This and mental health. Why will we never talk about these issues? Because they cause people to look at themselves?

I'm not sure. It's a very sad thing to me.

Avatar image for korolev
korolev

1800

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 17

User Lists: 8

Edited By korolev

The reason why Alex, is because media companies are still owned by old people who have never touched a video game in their life. Plus, while the average age of game-playing folks is rising, our advancements in Medical Technology means that the elderly aren't dying. A lot of those old, non-video game playing folks who were grumbling about it in the 90s are still alive today.

Avatar image for fengshuigod
FengShuiGod

1518

Forum Posts

256

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 1

Edited By FengShuiGod

Really enjoying Guns of Navarro.

Avatar image for mrfluke
mrfluke

6260

Forum Posts

-1

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 2

Edited By mrfluke

quite interesting, the ratio of views to comments on this story is almost 50 percent, thats quite high for a piece of content on GB,

looks like alex fully has an audience!

Avatar image for darkdragonmage99
darkdragonmage99

744

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 2

Edited By darkdragonmage99

@towolie: gang violence a overactive black market cultural clashes the list of our differences that cause our homicide rate to be so much higher is large and not much of it has anything to do with the crappy gun laws we have.

Avatar image for kittyvondoom
KittyVonDoom

447

Forum Posts

117

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Edited By KittyVonDoom

I blame the parents and popular, sensationalist news networks...

If you don't want your child "influenced by the devil", then stop them from using the things you don't understand. But don't stop them from gaining an understanding of what these things are.

Who instils fear of society thru warped reality into more minds - video games, or FOX news? Hey. Remember when the media and parents wanted you to be afraid of Marilyn Manson because he turned kids into cold-hearted serial killers? Apparently his music doesn't do that anymore. Not since video games.

Avatar image for darkdragonmage99
darkdragonmage99

744

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 2

Edited By darkdragonmage99

@Judakel: I'll gladly blame something other then guns because I know a certain number and I know the driver of america's murder rate.

80% of murders in this country are gang related gangs are killing each other over drug turf just like gangs killed each other over alcohol turf. If you want to solve the violence problem in this country end Prohibition. it is truly as simple as that it worked the first time it will work again.

Avatar image for kfizz
kfizz

41

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 2

Edited By kfizz

I think its that each time a game genration starts, its a new form of media to the old bags. So its a new thing to them each time so its going to happen every genration of systems. So its a microcosm of media at a faster rate. Its crazy I saw chain smoker of facebook, say that E-cigs cutting profits of cig companies saying that is why our economie is bad because their profits are being cut by e-cigs. The common man is getting dumber and dumber.

Avatar image for shensai
Shensai

42

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 1

Edited By Shensai

One day, the old generation will die off and hopefully so will their astigmatism towards "violent" media.

Avatar image for darkdragonmage99
darkdragonmage99

744

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 2

Edited By darkdragonmage99

Hey I am a social outcast and a loner and you know what I don't see anything wrong with that

Avatar image for sor_eddie
Sor_Eddie

282

Forum Posts

3

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Edited By Sor_Eddie

Thanks for the great article, Alex. Can't wait to read more pieces by you

Avatar image for branthog
Branthog

5777

Forum Posts

1014

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 2

User Lists: 0

Edited By Branthog

As long as we keep biting at the political "the games industry needs to participate in the discussion about their role in causing violence" bait, it'll keep being a problem. We contribute to the validation of the prolonging of this bullshit conversation about something for which there is no evidence or justification and only baseless accusations.

It's also ultimately irrelevant, because so what if it did in some magical fantasy world increase the chance of a crazy person with access to guns who is on medication for their mental health going nuts in a school or shopping mall? That one in tens of millions person going nuts is, what, going to justify unprecedented censorship?

Avatar image for fargofallout
fargofallout

435

Forum Posts

140

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Edited By fargofallout

Something I still struggle with is thinking of this as an "us" and "them" situation. People play games. People watch movies. People read books. I don't know why people who play games are their own group of people, whereas people that watch shitty reality TV every night are just people. I know people play games to varying degrees, but almost everyone - and especially people who have smartphones - plays games to some extent. Hell, I don't know that my wife has ever touched a 360 controller, but even she plays Temple Run and Angry Birds on her iPhone. Does that make her a gamer?

Also, I would like to voice my concern about shooting being a core mechanic of so many games. I'm not talking about it from a violence perspective, but I'm starting to think of it as sort of lazy and uninspired design. My annoyance at games like Uncharted 3 (timely reference here) is really starting to skyrocket. I liked the game, but I felt like it didn't need to be a shooter. Games don't always need to involve shooting other people.

Avatar image for toyboxx
TOYBOXX

327

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 7

User Lists: 1

Edited By TOYBOXX

Although this article is thought provoking, and highly interesting; one argument comes to mind at the very beginning when discussing restraint from our leaders in Government. I think you're giving Biden a little too much credit with handling the "Violence" in this video games 'witch hunt'.

And this is exactly what it is. A modern day witch hunt.

If Joe Biden, the gaffer and chief, took the time to study-up on the violence in video games investigations of the past, the public display of incompetency wouldn't have even occurred. Common sense dictates that interacting with any form of violence in the media DOES NOT brain wash an individual into becoming a killing machine. Jack Thompsons' poison corrupted the thoughts of others, including the media, and it worked. Even our leaders are considering this idiocy as being fact without seeing the facts which only further fuels the fire of stupidity.

If citizens of this nation refuse to put in check the very people who are quick to judge (and likewise quick to pull the plug on things that they don't understand), is very damaging to our society as a whole.

As the saying goes "You can lead the horse to water, but you can't make one drink". In other words, you can present the facts plain as day to the individual, but you can't make someone learn said facts if they refuse.

What other forms of industry will be thrown under the bus in the name of "peace"?

Avatar image for spencer_twin
spencer_twin

134

Forum Posts

1960

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 1

Edited By spencer_twin

@horseman6: Amen duder.