Piracy: Is it as bad as they say? (Article and survey results)

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metal_mills

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Edited By metal_mills

 I started a survey up a few days ago. It's point was to find out the real facts about piracy. On one side we have companies claiming piracy is killing the PC, hurting sales on the DS and PSP and if it never existed then their games would be selling millions more. On the other side we have people claiming piracy is overblown and that it isn't as bad as the big dogs claim. Sadly though, it's not the user that gets to make the choices here, it's the companies. Due to the ease of piracy on the PC we are are seeing less exclusives, less multiplatform games getting ported over from the consoles and heavy and ridiculous forms of DRM such as Ubisoft's that forces users to stay connected to an online server constantly, even when playing single player. Other kinds have only 3 installs allowed. This kind of treatment makes the honest buyers seem like the criminals. But is it necessary to keep trying these radical kinds of copy protection in order to keep the games getting released? Is every download a sale lost? Well, my survey helps to try and figure that out and tries to get down to the facts(or as close as within reason).
 
I went to the source of the problem and asked 253 rum-swelling, saber swinging, treasure hunting pirates about how much of an industry destroyer they truly are. And to answer the question probably going through your mind, yes, I am aware 253 pirates isn't close to the many millions around the world but as I found out this topic is a hell of a lot more taboo than even I thought. I scoured the internet for sites I could post my survey at but it wasn't as easy as going in and watching the people click away. It turns out piracy...kinda a touchy subject around gamers. NeoGAF refused me to even ask people to participate. Gamespot closed my thread down(after it somehow ended up on the subject of Crysis' sales). Even some piracy forums instantly banned me, closed or ignored my thread. Geez, thanks guys...
Thankfully though, some sites were happy to help out and thus my survey began.
 
The survey consisted of 6 questions. Each one a multiple choice.

Do you pirate all of your games?


No Caption Provided
 
The first question is pretty simple. And pretty unanimous. Over 88% of the responses said that they don't pirate all of their games. A pretty good start to the survey, and remember this is answers from pirates, not just any gamer, so it was a little surpring. I actually expected a lot more people to say they 'yes' to this question.
 

If No, would you say you buy 50% or more of your games?



No Caption Provided

So this question was aimed at the people who don't pirate every game they own. It might not be as big of a difference as the last question but with 65% saying Yes, that is still in favour of people buying the game, rather than pirating it.
 

What is the main reason you pirate games?


No Caption Provided
Now this question is where we get down to the nitty gritty. And amazingly, with 34% is the answer I least expected to come out on top: 'Trying a game to see if they can run it, or like it before buying'. Maybe if developers bothered releasing more PC demos(I'm looking at you Ubisoft) then maybe people wouldn't do this kind of thing? It's easier with console games because not only do most have demos ready and waiting before the games launch but if you do buy it and find out you don't like it, you can return it to the store or sell it to get some money back. Hell, many gamers these days use sites such as Gamefly so they don't even have to buy the game. You can't do any of that on a PC. So if you buy and the game doesn't run very well, or isn't what you expected, then tough shit, you just lost $50(or $60 as the trend seems to be, again, I'm looking at you Ubisoft). 
 
Coming in second with 30% was "Can't afford to buy games". Well, I have to ask how did you afford the PC or console to begin with? I can see where they are coming from though. There are times when too many games come out and with limited money(and time) you have to pick what you want to get. I never ended by buying Fable 2 because there were just so many games coming out and buying another one of top one the eight or so I had bought would be crazy. However, if I got it for free, I'd probably throw it in and try it out from time to time. Maybe to help combat this they should stop going nuts on releases? Remember when games took 3 or 4 years to come out? These days 2 years seems like a long time! With games like Call of Duty pumping out a new game, plus several pricey map packs every year how can you keep up? They aren't the only series that does it though. Halo is another who released ODST last year and Reach this year. Left4Dead is the same. And God knows how many 'Hero' games have been release, what is it? Like 6 in one year? No wonder people can't afford games! I think it's safe to say as well that if they couldn't pirate all of these games they sure as hell wouldn't be buying them all, we'll get to that point a bit later though in question 5.
 
Coming in third with 25% was "It's free". Honestly, I thought this would be by far the most voted answer. Isn't that the core reason people pirate to begin with? I thought so. I guess it isn't like that for many people.
 
And finally, at exactly 10% we have "Easier to pirate than buy". This is kind of a broad answer. It covers reasons such as older games that are hard to find, countries that might not release the game or online games that people can't buy because they have no credit card. Things like that.
 
 

If a game had a copy protection that was hard to crack would you wait for the game to finally be cracked(Eg: several months) or just buy it?


No Caption Provided


 DRM is never impossible to crack. There are times however when it can be harder to get around. Some games can have a crack in 24 hours of release. Some can take a few months. One such game was The Sims 2. Sure there were cracks out for it soon after release but none really worked that well. The main issue was you couldn't enter any build mode so basically half the game was broken. Would that stop the pirates though? Would they go out and buy it instead? Well...kinda? As you can see the clear winner of the question(with 63% of the votes) is: "Depends on the game". So it really boils down to the big names or not. The Call of Duty's and the Half-Life's. Games that people must have ASAP and they simply can't wait. 
Another deciding factor of this could be how bad the DRM of the game is. Games with terrible DRM such as Ubisoft games would probably push quite a few of those "Depends" into "I'd wait for the pirated version". The other 2 answers are pretty close together with "I'd buy it" just getting ahead by a few percent. So overall a good kind of copy protection could help sales and ward off piracy but it actually NEEDS to work and without the customer being made to feel like a criminal. Sadly, no such DRM exists yet. As for the games that aren't big releases, they probably wouldn't have any kind of effective DRM anyway.
 
 

If for some reason all piracy stopped today and it was impossible to pirate any game(retroactively too) what would you do?

No Caption Provided

So what would I pirate do if he couldn't be a pirate anymore? Well, the answer is: Cut back on gaming. I think this question out of all of them shows that not every pirated copy is a sale lost. Something many developers and publishers think is true. With just under 60% the main answer was they'd buy more games but not all the games they would have downloaded. So if piracy was cut out, then yeah, we'd see an increase in sales. Is it as much as we'd think though? The other two answers are very, very, close. One getting 19% of the votes. and the other getting 20%. The winner? Buying all the games. While 20% isn't huge, it's a sizable number. Imagine if this survey had a million pirates fill it out and the results were the same. If they bought all the same games that's 200,000 extra copies per game. 
Now, I know, it's imposable to tell how this question would have turned out if a million pirates had filled it out rather than 253 but it's something to think about. Whether or not piracy is the devistating monster some people claim it to be, one thing is for sure. We have to find ways to stop it. And no, I don't mean stop releasing PC games. I mean find a way to fix it rather than including these insane forms of copy protection that don't do shit and then jack the price up to $60US. 
 

If a game was $5 - $10 would you buy it?


No Caption Provided

I added this question after reading an article which was claiming that a recent Indie pack, which included 5 indie games that you could pay whatever you wanted for them had been pirated a large amount if times. 25% of all downloads of the indie pack were a pirated copy. Now that's pretty sad not even paying $1 for 5 great indie games. The developers are people who need the money. Not only that but a sizable chunk of the money was going towards charity. That's pretty low to pirate something like that. The victim isn't a multi-billion dollar company. It's people like you and me, and sick children. It's not on and people who do that are worse than a regular pirates, they are scum. On the other side on things though, Runic Games has just come out to reveal that Torchlight has sold over 200,000 copies and making it one of steams best-sellers. The game has also seen on sale several times for $5 and $10 giving it huge sale boosts.  
I think that combined with the answers of this question show that most people probably will fork out money for a cheap game. It's only those few who want something for nothing, no matter who they effect that really hurt the small developers. Sadly with pirates number in the millions around the world, those few can seem pretty big sometimes.
 
So that's it. End of the survey. So what have we learned? Well, I think it shows piracy might not be as bad as people say...but things could be better and have a possibly of being better if someone can invent an effective form of copy protection. I think the gaming industry needs a bit of a restructure too to help with the cause. It's just getting too big and too chaotic for it's own good. With many series releasing a game every year and the holiday seasons getting so crowed it's starting to make the normally quiet Q1 season into an extension of Q4.
Simply put, there are too many games getting release that it's going to start turning against the industry and I think it already has. Medium budget games have no room anymore and each new release needs to out do the one before it. Budgets are through the roof and the prices of games might even reach $70 next-generation as some analysts claim.  
To the industry it hurts the smaller guys who try and make a game only for it to bomb because any one of a dozen big titles are released around it. It hurts creativity because companies are to scared to risk $50 million on a game that may or may not sell. Which is why we have a painfully large amount of FPS and TPS'ers this generation. They sell, so everyone sticks with them.    
But when are people going to get sick of it? Modern warfare is tired and played out. WW2 themed games are pretty much dead. Zombies games are on it's last legs for many people. Even the classic sci-fi and fantasy theme's are getting worn out. MMO's are just trying to copy WoW and failing because of it. I mean, what the hell is left? With the huge number of games being released and the high prices, it makes people turn to piracy, a free and easy way to try out these games without requiring a second mortgage. 
 Not only that but in this day and age these titles should be getting world wide release dates. Yet they don't. Many countries have to wait for games, sometimes even up to a few years, before it's available in their country. Sure they can import but why should they have to? It should be there at the game store or on steam.
 
At the end of the day, you can say piracy is wrong, flat out. And you'd be right.. However, I think the industry by sorting itself out a little bit could help the situation. Along with that, they should either use a good, workable form of DRM or don't use it at all as it doesn't help them one bit and in fact makes people who never pirates games start thinking about pirating the superior, DRM-free version of the game. In the end though, it's down to the person who pirates the games. They don't need to play them and in life if you can't afford something then you can't have it and it should be like that for video games too. All the honest buyers of games can do it keep supporting the games you like and hope the companies don't come up with even crazier DRM's that hurt us more than they hurt the pirates.
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#1  Edited By metal_mills

 I started a survey up a few days ago. It's point was to find out the real facts about piracy. On one side we have companies claiming piracy is killing the PC, hurting sales on the DS and PSP and if it never existed then their games would be selling millions more. On the other side we have people claiming piracy is overblown and that it isn't as bad as the big dogs claim. Sadly though, it's not the user that gets to make the choices here, it's the companies. Due to the ease of piracy on the PC we are are seeing less exclusives, less multiplatform games getting ported over from the consoles and heavy and ridiculous forms of DRM such as Ubisoft's that forces users to stay connected to an online server constantly, even when playing single player. Other kinds have only 3 installs allowed. This kind of treatment makes the honest buyers seem like the criminals. But is it necessary to keep trying these radical kinds of copy protection in order to keep the games getting released? Is every download a sale lost? Well, my survey helps to try and figure that out and tries to get down to the facts(or as close as within reason).
 
I went to the source of the problem and asked 253 rum-swelling, saber swinging, treasure hunting pirates about how much of an industry destroyer they truly are. And to answer the question probably going through your mind, yes, I am aware 253 pirates isn't close to the many millions around the world but as I found out this topic is a hell of a lot more taboo than even I thought. I scoured the internet for sites I could post my survey at but it wasn't as easy as going in and watching the people click away. It turns out piracy...kinda a touchy subject around gamers. NeoGAF refused me to even ask people to participate. Gamespot closed my thread down(after it somehow ended up on the subject of Crysis' sales). Even some piracy forums instantly banned me, closed or ignored my thread. Geez, thanks guys...
Thankfully though, some sites were happy to help out and thus my survey began.
 
The survey consisted of 6 questions. Each one a multiple choice.

Do you pirate all of your games?


No Caption Provided
 
The first question is pretty simple. And pretty unanimous. Over 88% of the responses said that they don't pirate all of their games. A pretty good start to the survey, and remember this is answers from pirates, not just any gamer, so it was a little surpring. I actually expected a lot more people to say they 'yes' to this question.
 

If No, would you say you buy 50% or more of your games?



No Caption Provided

So this question was aimed at the people who don't pirate every game they own. It might not be as big of a difference as the last question but with 65% saying Yes, that is still in favour of people buying the game, rather than pirating it.
 

What is the main reason you pirate games?


No Caption Provided
Now this question is where we get down to the nitty gritty. And amazingly, with 34% is the answer I least expected to come out on top: 'Trying a game to see if they can run it, or like it before buying'. Maybe if developers bothered releasing more PC demos(I'm looking at you Ubisoft) then maybe people wouldn't do this kind of thing? It's easier with console games because not only do most have demos ready and waiting before the games launch but if you do buy it and find out you don't like it, you can return it to the store or sell it to get some money back. Hell, many gamers these days use sites such as Gamefly so they don't even have to buy the game. You can't do any of that on a PC. So if you buy and the game doesn't run very well, or isn't what you expected, then tough shit, you just lost $50(or $60 as the trend seems to be, again, I'm looking at you Ubisoft). 
 
Coming in second with 30% was "Can't afford to buy games". Well, I have to ask how did you afford the PC or console to begin with? I can see where they are coming from though. There are times when too many games come out and with limited money(and time) you have to pick what you want to get. I never ended by buying Fable 2 because there were just so many games coming out and buying another one of top one the eight or so I had bought would be crazy. However, if I got it for free, I'd probably throw it in and try it out from time to time. Maybe to help combat this they should stop going nuts on releases? Remember when games took 3 or 4 years to come out? These days 2 years seems like a long time! With games like Call of Duty pumping out a new game, plus several pricey map packs every year how can you keep up? They aren't the only series that does it though. Halo is another who released ODST last year and Reach this year. Left4Dead is the same. And God knows how many 'Hero' games have been release, what is it? Like 6 in one year? No wonder people can't afford games! I think it's safe to say as well that if they couldn't pirate all of these games they sure as hell wouldn't be buying them all, we'll get to that point a bit later though in question 5.
 
Coming in third with 25% was "It's free". Honestly, I thought this would be by far the most voted answer. Isn't that the core reason people pirate to begin with? I thought so. I guess it isn't like that for many people.
 
And finally, at exactly 10% we have "Easier to pirate than buy". This is kind of a broad answer. It covers reasons such as older games that are hard to find, countries that might not release the game or online games that people can't buy because they have no credit card. Things like that.
 
 

If a game had a copy protection that was hard to crack would you wait for the game to finally be cracked(Eg: several months) or just buy it?


No Caption Provided


 DRM is never impossible to crack. There are times however when it can be harder to get around. Some games can have a crack in 24 hours of release. Some can take a few months. One such game was The Sims 2. Sure there were cracks out for it soon after release but none really worked that well. The main issue was you couldn't enter any build mode so basically half the game was broken. Would that stop the pirates though? Would they go out and buy it instead? Well...kinda? As you can see the clear winner of the question(with 63% of the votes) is: "Depends on the game". So it really boils down to the big names or not. The Call of Duty's and the Half-Life's. Games that people must have ASAP and they simply can't wait. 
Another deciding factor of this could be how bad the DRM of the game is. Games with terrible DRM such as Ubisoft games would probably push quite a few of those "Depends" into "I'd wait for the pirated version". The other 2 answers are pretty close together with "I'd buy it" just getting ahead by a few percent. So overall a good kind of copy protection could help sales and ward off piracy but it actually NEEDS to work and without the customer being made to feel like a criminal. Sadly, no such DRM exists yet. As for the games that aren't big releases, they probably wouldn't have any kind of effective DRM anyway.
 
 

If for some reason all piracy stopped today and it was impossible to pirate any game(retroactively too) what would you do?

No Caption Provided

So what would I pirate do if he couldn't be a pirate anymore? Well, the answer is: Cut back on gaming. I think this question out of all of them shows that not every pirated copy is a sale lost. Something many developers and publishers think is true. With just under 60% the main answer was they'd buy more games but not all the games they would have downloaded. So if piracy was cut out, then yeah, we'd see an increase in sales. Is it as much as we'd think though? The other two answers are very, very, close. One getting 19% of the votes. and the other getting 20%. The winner? Buying all the games. While 20% isn't huge, it's a sizable number. Imagine if this survey had a million pirates fill it out and the results were the same. If they bought all the same games that's 200,000 extra copies per game. 
Now, I know, it's imposable to tell how this question would have turned out if a million pirates had filled it out rather than 253 but it's something to think about. Whether or not piracy is the devistating monster some people claim it to be, one thing is for sure. We have to find ways to stop it. And no, I don't mean stop releasing PC games. I mean find a way to fix it rather than including these insane forms of copy protection that don't do shit and then jack the price up to $60US. 
 

If a game was $5 - $10 would you buy it?


No Caption Provided

I added this question after reading an article which was claiming that a recent Indie pack, which included 5 indie games that you could pay whatever you wanted for them had been pirated a large amount if times. 25% of all downloads of the indie pack were a pirated copy. Now that's pretty sad not even paying $1 for 5 great indie games. The developers are people who need the money. Not only that but a sizable chunk of the money was going towards charity. That's pretty low to pirate something like that. The victim isn't a multi-billion dollar company. It's people like you and me, and sick children. It's not on and people who do that are worse than a regular pirates, they are scum. On the other side on things though, Runic Games has just come out to reveal that Torchlight has sold over 200,000 copies and making it one of steams best-sellers. The game has also seen on sale several times for $5 and $10 giving it huge sale boosts.  
I think that combined with the answers of this question show that most people probably will fork out money for a cheap game. It's only those few who want something for nothing, no matter who they effect that really hurt the small developers. Sadly with pirates number in the millions around the world, those few can seem pretty big sometimes.
 
So that's it. End of the survey. So what have we learned? Well, I think it shows piracy might not be as bad as people say...but things could be better and have a possibly of being better if someone can invent an effective form of copy protection. I think the gaming industry needs a bit of a restructure too to help with the cause. It's just getting too big and too chaotic for it's own good. With many series releasing a game every year and the holiday seasons getting so crowed it's starting to make the normally quiet Q1 season into an extension of Q4.
Simply put, there are too many games getting release that it's going to start turning against the industry and I think it already has. Medium budget games have no room anymore and each new release needs to out do the one before it. Budgets are through the roof and the prices of games might even reach $70 next-generation as some analysts claim.  
To the industry it hurts the smaller guys who try and make a game only for it to bomb because any one of a dozen big titles are released around it. It hurts creativity because companies are to scared to risk $50 million on a game that may or may not sell. Which is why we have a painfully large amount of FPS and TPS'ers this generation. They sell, so everyone sticks with them.    
But when are people going to get sick of it? Modern warfare is tired and played out. WW2 themed games are pretty much dead. Zombies games are on it's last legs for many people. Even the classic sci-fi and fantasy theme's are getting worn out. MMO's are just trying to copy WoW and failing because of it. I mean, what the hell is left? With the huge number of games being released and the high prices, it makes people turn to piracy, a free and easy way to try out these games without requiring a second mortgage. 
 Not only that but in this day and age these titles should be getting world wide release dates. Yet they don't. Many countries have to wait for games, sometimes even up to a few years, before it's available in their country. Sure they can import but why should they have to? It should be there at the game store or on steam.
 
At the end of the day, you can say piracy is wrong, flat out. And you'd be right.. However, I think the industry by sorting itself out a little bit could help the situation. Along with that, they should either use a good, workable form of DRM or don't use it at all as it doesn't help them one bit and in fact makes people who never pirates games start thinking about pirating the superior, DRM-free version of the game. In the end though, it's down to the person who pirates the games. They don't need to play them and in life if you can't afford something then you can't have it and it should be like that for video games too. All the honest buyers of games can do it keep supporting the games you like and hope the companies don't come up with even crazier DRM's that hurt us more than they hurt the pirates.
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Meowayne

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#2  Edited By Meowayne

Pac-Man!

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#3  Edited By Codeacious

Very nice. Awesome that you took the time to go out and see what the numbers were like. I do disagree with one point though- I don't think that medium budget games are being pushed out at all. If they're at a lower price, then your survey itself shows that people will buy it (of course, I'm assuming that a medium budget game is something like Torchlight, but if I'm wrong, then just disregard that). 
 
For anyone else that wants a bit more info, Kotaku published an article by David Rosen, who was a part of the Humble Indie Bundle.  http://kotaku.com/5533615/another-view-of-video-game-piracy

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#4  Edited By yinstarrunner

Very interesting stuff. I appreciate the work you put into this.

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HitmanAgent47

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#5  Edited By HitmanAgent47

This was one of the best thread i've read in a while, interesting statistics. I'm glad for steam deals when it's cheap, more ppl are more likely to buy games then. Also it seems DRM makes ppl not want to buy a game or they have to really think about it. Only a fraction of the ppl will buy it right away with drm, ppl like me.

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#6  Edited By Afroman269

Nice survey. I have pirated games but I am a lazy pirate,  so if I had to jump through hoops to get a game I would just say fuck it and buy it. I'm also not going to mod my consoles so I can pirate because once again I'm too lazy to.

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Skytylz

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#7  Edited By Skytylz

Other than mame use, the only game I've ever pirated was simgolf and I couldn't really find a place to buy that!

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#8  Edited By metal_mills
@isnipeyoudie said:
" Very nice. Awesome that you took the time to go out and see what the numbers were like. I do disagree with one point though- I don't think that medium budget games are being pushed out at all. If they're at a lower price, then your survey itself shows that people will buy it (of course, I'm assuming that a medium budget game is something like Torchlight, but if I'm wrong, then just disregard that). 
 
For anyone else that wants a bit more info, Kotaku published an article by David Rosen, who was a part of the Humble Indie Bundle.  http://kotaku.com/5533615/another-view-of-video-game-piracy "
What I meant is it's harder for the medium budget games at full price or close to. I don't mean ones like Deadly Premonition but decent games but don't have $40 million developing + $10 million advertising and a big name behind them. Someone like Activision would much rather CoD17 rather than a new IP with a whole lot of creative and unique ideas even if it costs half as much as CoD would because CoD can sell simply by name alone and it's a safe bet. 
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#9  Edited By Faint

PS3 and X360 games come out here in Australia sometimes at a whopping $119 dollars. Now for you Americans, keep in mind that our Aussie dollar is around 90 - 95 cents to the American dollar these days, so when you are paying 50-60 for a new game we should be paying maybe 70 at most. For this reason, I'm pretty reluctant to buy games brand new at launch and could understand why thousands upon thousands would stick up the two fingers and just pirate games.

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thatfrood

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#10  Edited By thatfrood

AAAAAAAAAH! PIE CHARTS! 
Pie charts are awful man, don't use them. Use bar charts. 
Pie charts have been proven to misrepresent information.

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#11  Edited By superfriend

Interesting read. My guess is that not a lot of people are honest about them pirating games, since it is illegal and all. I can only tell you that where I come from (Europe), piracy is a big issue, especially on the PC. Most of my friends pirate a LOT of their games on PC.
 
 I will talk about a game with friends and a few days later they have already downloaded it from somewhere and are playing it. I always thought this attitude would eventually disolve once people reached a certain age (and steady income), but that doesn´t really seem to be the case. Guess a lot of people just don´t value games like me.

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#12  Edited By fallen_elite
@Meowayne said:
" Pac-Man! "
Pac-Man! Pac-Man!
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#13  Edited By Spoonybard37
@fallen_elite said:

" @Meowayne said:

" Pac-Man! "

Pac-Man! Pac-Man! "
Pac-Man!  Pac-Man!  Pac-Man! 
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#14  Edited By Jadeskye

 WAKA-WAKA!
 WAKA-WAKA!
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#15  Edited By armaan8014

I love you! Great article.
Yeah, the solution would be for companies to take a breath, release lesser and more innovative titles, and drop the prices drastically. And stop making this a business.

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#16  Edited By The_A_Drain

There is absolutely no excuse for piracy. I don't care what the situation, or what a persons views are about the product/industry/developer/publisher/etc. They are non-essential luxury products, boo-fucking-hoo if you don't want/can't afford them, tough shit. I would absolutely support you stealing food if you could not afford that, but that is an essential item you need in order to live. And no, before anybody jumps on that attack plan, I am not rich. I'm a penniless student who spends money on games instead of alcohol/nights out. Trust me, when you're paying £3 ($5) for a fucking pint, and £3 for the bus ride to the pub, £45 ($70?) doesn't seem at all unreasonable for a game.
 
For non Americans (of which I am one, before anybody jumps down my throat) the increase in price to your local currency is not entirely gouging. Americans pay tax at the register, in the EU we have it included in the price of the game. Once you account for that, there is only a small discrepency, a discrepency nonetheless however. Which I do not agree should be there. 
 
The only excuse I will even hear as valid is A) No demo for a game. B) Already bought the game elsewhere, but the DRM/other factors make it unplayable/unstable. 
 
If you disagree with how a product is handled, or you want to vote with your wallet, stealing it does not get your point across effectively. And if you simply think they should be cheaper, then you are living in a dreamworld, game prices have risen slower than inflation, and quality is always going up, pretty soon they will have to rise to 70 bucks a pop. So get used to it. If you just plain can't afford them , however, then that is your problem. You can't afford a car but you don't go out and steal someone elses. And on, I will not listen to the argument that just because the product is digital it is somehow a victimless crime. It's utter rubbish. 
 
That said, I would like to see developers putting out ad-soaked versions of games via torrent websites that people can freely play rather than having to pirate the games. The question remains however, will ad-companies consider that a viable investment (viable enough to make the game free...) and will whiny pirate bitches actually latch onto it? Or will they continue to steal the paid version. 
 
I will freely admit that not all pirates are bad, and nowhere near every download =  a lost sale, that's just fantasy. But that small portion of pirates who have no intention of buying, or have this fantastical belief that games should be the price of DVDs, need a good hard kick in the behind.

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metal_mills

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#17  Edited By metal_mills
@Faint said:
" PS3 and X360 games come out here in Australia sometimes at a whopping $119 dollars. Now for you Americans, keep in mind that our Aussie dollar is around 90 - 95 cents to the American dollar these days, so when you are paying 50-60 for a new game we should be paying maybe 70 at most. For this reason, I'm pretty reluctant to buy games brand new at launch and could understand why thousands upon thousands would stick up the two fingers and just pirate games. "
Actually, I am Australia. I was just saying $60US because from people here are American. Try JB or Myers for cheaper games by the way. Those $120 can be found for like $89. Or import from the UK for like $65. :)
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#18  Edited By BeachThunder

Very interesting; some surprising results. How many sites did you actually post the survey on?
 
@ThatFrood: How so?

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#19  Edited By The_A_Drain
@armaan8014 said:
" I love you! Great article. Yeah, the solution would be for companies to take a breath, release lesser and more innovative titles, and drop the prices drastically. And stop making this a business. "
1) It is a business... That is never going to change. 
2) The prices on these massively budgeted "AAA" titles cannot come down any further, in order to do so you need to take it up with Sony/MS/Nintendo. They take $10 from every single disc sold, regardless of the price the publisher sets as the SRP. Ontop of that it costs more money that you would think to actually press and package the disc (no, it's not pennies, it's actual whole dollars) and then of course the store gets a markup of between 6 and 12 dollars depending on how much they expect to sell. 
 
The publisher actually only brings in between 20 and 30 dollars per sale, which is not an awful lot when you have between 5 and 35 million dollars to recoup (more for you massive Gears or MW releases) before they can even think about making a profit. 
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#20  Edited By metal_mills
@The_A_Drain said:
"  The only excuse I will even hear as valid is A) No demo for a game. B) Already bought the game elsewhere, but the DRM/other factors make it unplayable/unstable. 
I know that. Which is why near the end I said there is no excuse for piracy. I do think those kind of things are contributing factors to piracy in general though, whether it's an excuse or not. 
 
@BeachThunder said:
" Very interesting; some surprising results. How many sites did you actually post the survey on?
 
Like...9 or 10? Something like that. Mostly warez/piracy sites but I posted on here as well.
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armaan8014

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#21  Edited By armaan8014
@The_A_Drain: seriously, they could drop the prices a lot if they didn't make the packaging so.. Royal
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#22  Edited By thatfrood
@BeachThunder said:
"Very interesting; some surprising results. How many sites did you actually post the survey on?
 
@ThatFrood: How so? "

In a lot of different ways. Because the slices of the pie chart converge at the center, smaller percentages have smaller angles, making them appear exceptionally narrow. This means that percentages as large as 10 or 15% nevertheless look like nothing. 
More notoriously, pie charts are often preferred by businesses to show in their presentations. This is because the pie chart can be made "3-D". This change in perspective, though, is rarely an attempt to make the presentation more visually engaging but instead just a trick to distort perception. For instance.
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#23  Edited By SilentCommando

Nice, comprehensive survey.

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The_A_Drain

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#24  Edited By The_A_Drain
@armaan8014 said:
" @The_A_Drain: seriously, they could drop the prices a lot if they didn't make the packaging so.. Royal "
I'm not going to deny that there are ways of dropping the costs. However, in order to delay further price increases, companies have already been doing that. Sure, you can argue that ActiVision is the devil, blah blah blah, and I wouldn't disagree with you. But even smaller more well respected publishers are starting to pull back on the quality of things like manuals and extras. Even the plastic on the cases has gotten thinner since 2005, they are almost as shitty as regular cheapo DVD cases. 
 
When you look at the picture as a whole, it's a burgeoning dam waiting to burst. Something has to give, either consumer expectation has to level out slightly rather than ever increasing, or the price has to go up. As much as i'd like it to as a consumer, it cannot go both ways. I've been saying this since 2005 :) but prices will hit $70 before the end of this, or at the beginning of the next generation.
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#25  Edited By Gaff
@Metal_Mills said: 
Actually, I am Australia.
Wait, you're Queen Liz? (Commonwealth and all that) 
  
But yeah, as you mentioned, I think the only "problem" is the limited demographic. I would really like to see how the data would be from the non-forum population (anecdotal evidence only goes so far), but the only ones with the means and motivation to do that would be the game publishers. And let's face it, they're not that impartial.
 
And yeah... PAC MAN!
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#26  Edited By FirePrince

Dude,awesome survey! 
In the end,developers could just stop bitching about piracy,eh?
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#27  Edited By ryanwho

This of course assumes they're not lying to you as many often lie to themselves. Pie chart 5 would basically validate DRM if it could be substantiated in a real polling (2 thousand plus). 

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#28  Edited By ryanwho
@FirePrince said:
" Dude,awesome survey! In the end,developers could just stop bitching about piracy,eh? "
That's not really the conclusion at all, kid.
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#29  Edited By BeachThunder

I'd be interested to see the results of a music and movie version of this. There seems to be a bizarre piracy double standard here from what I've seen. A lot of people will flippantly talk about how they download all their music, how music isn't worth paying for and how they have a bajillion albums that they've pirated. But then the topic of pirating games comes around, people tend to have a disproportionately more adverse reaction.
 
@ThatFrood said:

[...] For instance. "

Oh, wow that's awful D: But to be fair, these pie charts didn't include any small percentages nor did they use 3D effects/ perspective.
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Brunchies

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#30  Edited By Brunchies

Great survey, honestly though we can all agree that piracy will never go away but companies like activision can stop releasing games every year like what they are doing with COD and the Hero franchise. Also finding the right DRM would help but again that won't happen in a while to.

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davidwitten22

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#31  Edited By davidwitten22

I understand that piracy is evil and all that, but in some cases piracy can be a positive. 
 
Bear with me here. 
 
If I wouldn't have downloaded Bioshock on a whim, then I wouldn't have bought it when I got my Ps3. The same thing is going to happen with Dead Space, which I downloaded for PC a year ago but I enjoyed what I played of it so much that I'm going to buy it (new, btw) for PC. I'm sure this sort of situation is relatively uncommon, but it does exist and in that way it isn't completely "evil". 90% of the games I pirate are old Pokemon games for the gameboy and gameboy advance, and Dragon Warrior Monsters (games in which I owned years and years ago). 
 
Just my opinion and my situation.

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#32  Edited By Meowayne

 Also finding the right DRM would help  


 No. The very idea that there will be a time when company's coders will in any way triumph or become superior to the combined efforts of scene coders is completely ridiculous. 
Popular software will always be pirated. Period. Full stop. The End. Fact. Battling piracy is not a question of how to "copy protect" your intellectual property. That's impossible. 
 
Good, working and effective piracy prevention is making the purchase of your product more attractive. That's it. There is nothing more to it.
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#33  Edited By ryanwho

You can't really make the "blind download" argument for files 10 gig strong.

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#34  Edited By The_A_Drain
@davidwitten22 said:
" I understand that piracy is evil and all that, but in some cases piracy can be a positive.  Bear with me here.  If I wouldn't have downloaded Bioshock on a whim, then I wouldn't have bought it when I got my Ps3. The same thing is going to happen with Dead Space, which I downloaded for PC a year ago but I enjoyed what I played of it so much that I'm going to buy it (new, btw) for PC. I'm sure this sort of situation is relatively uncommon, but it does exist and in that way it isn't completely "evil". 90% of the games I pirate are old Pokemon games for the gameboy and gameboy advance, and Dragon Warrior Monsters (games in which I owned years and years ago).  Just my opinion and my situation. "
I disagree that this is a positive, and instead argue that developers should make more effort into making readily available demo versions of all games.  
 
As for downloading old stuff, as much as I am starkly opposed to piracy, I honestly believe that (unless the game has received a re-release!!!!) it doesn't really apply to anything that is at least 2 generations behind. I mean, seriously, the only person making money off of Pokemon Red/Blue for example right now are eBay re-sellers, so, really, who cares? There is no logical argument for loss of sale/profit if the company is no longer actually selling the game in question.   
 
If they were selling the game still, that would be a different matter. But very few older games are actually being sold anymore outside of the ones released on WiiWare (which, as much as I find myself defending the corporate/business side of things most of the time, I will not make purchases on WiiWare. If my console dies, I cannot re-download those games on another console, that, for me, is the line. I'm not going to pirate them however, just not buy them)
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#35  Edited By Crono

There is always a huge difference between what people say and what people actually do.  This has been proven numerous times and one of the studies I can think of off the top of my head is the Tucson Garbage Project in which an anthropologist surveyed people about their alcohol consumption.  Most people claimed to have drank drastically less than what an analysis of their garbage proved - put another way they were drinking far more than they admitted to and this was an anonymous survey btw.  Point is, the results of this survey, no matter how comprehensive, have to be taken with a grain of salt, unfortunately.

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#36  Edited By TreeHouse

i find it really hard to believe that people pirate a game, install it, play it for a bit and then while they still have a working copy of the game on their computer stop playing and go out to buy a new legit copy. The argument sounds more like an excuse for people asked about their illegal dealings to me.

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#37  Edited By BetonneTom

Really nice, read the whole thing. I think that it really is time for the business to change a little. 
They are making the same mistakes as the music industry was making in the early 00's. only trying to prevent people from pirating and not looking at the problem internally. 
 
When games are clearly being pirated because of price issues, why on earth would you then also try and cripple the used-games industry? Of course they are not making money off of used sales, but surely that would alienate the consumers even further from the businesses, and alienation leads to not giving a fuck about faceless company's and that would lead to more pirating.  
 
I think this blog post should be featured on the home page!  

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#38  Edited By davidwitten22
@The_A_Drain: Well yeah they should have more demos for PC games, but they don't. Honestly when I downloaded Bioshock I had no idea what it was and had no intentions of ever buying it. If I hadn't of downloaded it, I would have never bought it for PS3. Same with Dead Space. I'm sure in this case that these companies are glad I pirated because it made them money later when I bought that game. 
 
That being said, this situation is firmly in the minority and I understand your objection. 
 
And hell yeah, I owned Pokemon Red twice, I'm not buying it again, especially since I no longer have a gameboy. They got my money for that game already.
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#39  Edited By theduke

i think it works like the music industry 
as Steam and other DD services get bigger like Itunes in the music industry, piracy won't be a huge of a problem
those that pirate wouldn't have bought it in the 1st place and many people that do pirate start buying once they have a job that can support their hobby

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#40  Edited By metal_mills
@BetonneTom said:

" Really nice, read the whole thing. I think that it really is time for the business to change a little. They are making the same mistakes as the music industry was making in the early 00's. only trying to prevent people from pirating and not looking at the problem internally.  When games are clearly being pirated because of price issues, why on earth would you then also try and cripple the used-games industry? Of course they are not making money off of used sales, but surely that would alienate the consumers even further from the businesses, and alienation leads to not giving a fuck about faceless company's and that would lead to more pirating.      "

That's a good point but buying a used game at somewhere like EB is normally about $4-5 cheaper than the new copy so it probably won't alienate potential pirates too much. I think there is more pros than cons if there war against used-games. I just hope they don't push too much like the talk of making the end of a game DLC or stuff like that. 
 

 I think this blog post should be featured on the home page!

Thanks. :)
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Equal_Opportunity_Destroyer497

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Very interesting article. It's damn tough to have a level-headed discussion about this nowadays.

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#42  Edited By Diamond

Between the problems of people lying and sample selection, it's basically impossible to get real 'statistics' on piracy.  Hardcore pirates would be more likely to alter their vote on such a poll to influence opinion.  I find one polled question laughable, the Pac Man graph.  Why?  Lots of people don't buy $5-$10 games.  100% of $5-$10 games aren't bought by everyone.  It's too general of a question.
 
Kudos for the effort, but without proper polling techniques it's kinda useless :X   Sorry.

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#43  Edited By ArbitraryWater

Very nice pie charts you have there. I freely admit to having pirated old games that would have been impossible to find otherwise, but I didn't touch any new stuff and I don't do it anymore. Sure, some of those old games are still on my computer, but most likely the company that made them went out of business 7 years ago.
 
I'm also sure that this kind of piracy has given certain old games more popularity than they would have had otherwise. For instance, I doubt the majority of people on the internet who praise games like Planescape or the Japanese Fire Emblems bought them legitimately. Am I justifying this kind of behavior? I'm not quite sure. Does that make me a lawbreaker?

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#44  Edited By Faint
@Metal_Mills: 
 
I usually do look into the prices at JB HiFi etc, but my point was that because you do see the games going for 119 at stores here in Australia, highly inflated above what they should be costing, it is understandable to me why piracy would be a solution for people at least in our region.
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#45  Edited By Kazona

Publishers like to exagarate about these kinds of things. Not just game publishers, but movie and music related ones as well. 

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#46  Edited By metal_mills
@Diamond said:
"  I find one polled question laughable, the Pac Man graph.  Why?  Lots of people don't buy $5-$10 games.  100% of $5-$10 games aren't bought by everyone.  It's too general of a question. Kudos for the effort, but without proper polling techniques it's kinda useless :X   Sorry. "
I never said they have to buy the $5-$10 or pirate it. I'm saying if a game that they wanted showed up for $5 - $10, would they buy it or still pirate the game.@Faint said:
" @Metal_Mills:   I usually do look into the prices at JB HiFi etc, but my point was that because you do see the games going for 119 at stores here in Australia, highly inflated above what they should be costing, it is understandable to me why piracy would be a solution for people at least in our region. "
Ah. Yeah I get what you mean. Australia gets ripped off royally for everything.
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#47  Edited By dbz1995
@jadeskye said:
"
 WAKA-WAKA!
 WAKA-WAKA!
"
After reading one of the most interesting and thoughtful threads in my time here in Giantbomb, I see this. And I laughed pretty damn hard.
 What this seems to be saying is that by making demos and establishing the Cloud system thing which is supposedly the 'revolution of worldwide gaming', we're cutting down piracy by about half. That sounds pretty damn great, but I fear that even if it is unanimous, pirates are still putting down lies to convince themselves that them pirating is valid.
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#48  Edited By jakob187

Great survey and a great read.  Very informative.  I would like to see this kind of survey done with a wide-scale audience.

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deactivated-5a1a3d3c6820c

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Someone posted a link to this earlier in the topic, but I think it's worth highlighting as it's a great article.
 
 
http://blog.wolfire.com/2010/05/Another-view-of-game-piracy

We've been hearing a lot about game piracy recently, with big developers inflicting draconian online-only DRM systems on their users, and blaming their declining PC game sales entirely on piracy. I'm not questioning that piracy is common, since even honest, DRM-free, indie developers like 2DBoy report a 90% piracy rate. I am, however, questioning what this means. How much revenue are developers actually losing to piracy?

The common industry assumption is that developers are losing 90% of their revenue. That is, pirates would have bought every single game that they downloaded. From personal experience, I know this is not possible -- most pirates that I've met have downloaded enough software to exceed their entire lifetime income, were they to have paid for it all. A more plausible (but still overly optimistic) guess is that if piracy was stopped the average pirate would behave like an average consumer.

This means that to calculate the worst-case scenario of how much money is lost to piracy, we just need to figure out what percentage of the target market consists of pirates. For example, if 50% of the market is pirates, that means that it's possible that you've lost 50% of your revenue to piracy. So how do we calculate what percentage of the market consists of pirates? Do we just go with 90%?

iPhone piracy

iPhone game developers have also found that around 80% of their users are running pirated copies of their game (using jailbroken phones) This immediately struck me as odd -- I suspected that most iPhone users had never even heard of 'jailbreaking'. I did a bit more research and found that my intuition was correct -- only 5% of iPhones in the US are jailbroken. World-wide, the jailbreak statistics are highest in poor countries -- but, unsurprisingly, iPhones are also much less common there. The highest estimate I've seen is that 10% of worldwide iPhones are jailbroken. Given that there are so few jailbroken phones, how can we explain that 80% of game copies are pirated?

  

The answer is simple -- the average pirate downloads a lot more games than the average customer buys. This means that even though games see that 80% of their copies are pirated, only 10% of their potential customers are pirates, which means they are losing at most 10% of their sales. If you'd like to see an example with math, read the following paragraph. If word problems make your eyes glaze over, then I advise you to skip it.

Let's consider the following scenario. Because game pirates can get apps for free, they download a couple new games every day -- or about 500 games in a year. On the other hand, normal gamers tend to play the same game for a longer time -- buying an average of 5 games per year. If this seems low to you, then consider that you are also reading a post on an indie game developer blog. You are probably more hardcore than the average gamer. Anyway, given these statistics, if the market consists of 10 million gamers, then there are 500 million pirated game copies, and 90 million purchased game copies, From the perspective of every individual game, 80% of its users are using pirated copies. However, only 10% of the market consists of pirates.

PC game piracy

Does this also apply to PC (Windows/Mac/Linux) gamers? Many PC game developers find that about 90% of their users are running pirated copies -- does this mean that piracy is killing PC games? Let's try our alternative explanation, and see if these statistics are possible even if only 20% of worldwide PC gamers are pirates. The average PC gamer worldwide only buys about three games a year, and plays them for a long time . I buy many more than that, and you probably do too, but again, we are not average gamers! On the other hand, game pirates might download a new game every few days, for a total of about 125 games a year. Given these numbers, games would see 90% piracy rates even though only 20% of gamers are pirates.

Are these numbers accurate? The NPD recently conducted an anonymous survey showing that only 4% of PC gamers in the US admit to pirating games , a number that is comparable to XBox 360 piracy statistics . However, since piracy is inversely proportionate to per-capita GDP, we can expect piracy rates to increase dramatically in places like Russia, China and India, driving up the world-wide average. Let's say to 20%.

This means that if all pirates would otherwise buy as many games as the average consumer, then game developers would be losing 20% of their revenue to piracy.

But would pirates really buy games?

Anecdotally and from studies by companies like the BSA, it's clear that pirates for the most part have very little income. They are unemployed students, or live in countries with very low per-capita GDP, where the price of a $60 game is more like $1000 (in terms of purchasing power parity and income percentage). When Reflexive games performed a series of experiments with anti-piracy measures, they found that they only made one extra sale for every 1000 pirated copies they blocked . This implies that their 90% piracy statistic caused them to lose less than 1% of their sales.

Why are PC games really losing sales?

While many game developers blame piracy for their decreasing PC game sales, it is clear that this is not the problem -- relatively few gamers are pirates, and those that are would mostly not be able to afford games anyway.

However, it's easier for these developers to point their fingers at pirates than to face the real problem: that their games are not fun on PC. The games in question are usually designed for consoles, with the desktop port as an afterthought. This means they are not fun to play with a mouse and keyboard, and don't work well on PC hardware. Their field of view is designed to be viewed from a distant couch instead of a nearby monitor, and their gameplay is simplified to compensate for this tunnel vision.

Blizzard is one of the most successful game developers in the world, and it develops exclusively for desktop computers. Why do they succeed where everyone else fails? They create games that are designed from the beginning to work well with the mouse and keyboard, and with all kinds of desktop hardware. If developers spent more time improving their PC gaming experience, and less time complaining about piracy, we might see more successful PC games.

With the Humble Indie Bundle promotion we've seen that when we treat gamers as real people instead of criminals, they seem to respond in kind. Anyone can get all five DRM-free games for a single penny, and pirate them as much as they want -- we have no way to find out or stop it. However, in just the first two days, we have over 40,000 contributions with an average of $8 each! Would we have seen this much support if the games were console ports that only worked when connected to a secure online DRM server? We'll never know for sure, but somehow I doubt it.


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iBear

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#50  Edited By iBear

lol at "To try out the game before buying it"