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KaosAngel

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#101  Edited By KaosAngel

Not to bring up other sites that offer similar stuff: 
 
TWIT gives me a live chatroom, live video each record, and over 20 podcasts on a weekly/daily basis (all of them being at least 1 hour long).
 
I also have given $50 to them this year to keep up the great work.  GB needs to up the content or something, because other sites that are geared like this give much more back.

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Undeadpool

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#102  Edited By Undeadpool
@snide: You've already won my subscription for the next year, but seeing Will and Norm trashed and mucking about with some insane bit of tech is completely worth it! Also hearing podcasts that can actually say what they think rather than what some corporate a-hole THINKS they should think is excellent and I'm willing to pay for that to continue as well. 
So in other words: keep up the great work.
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meteora

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#103  Edited By meteora

It sounds pretty generous and a good way to attract more people into subscribing. Its like sampling a product before committing to it. Of course I'm not a subscriber so I don't really have any say in this, other than its probably a good idea.

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ajamafalous

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#104  Edited By ajamafalous

I'm completely okay with archiving the free live show, but I'd say only one free every other month at the most often. 1 out of every 8 doesn't feel like a ripoff, whereas 1 out of every 4 is in very questionable territory.

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TwoLines

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#105  Edited By TwoLines

I'm okay with this, hopefuly more users will subscribe.

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LiquidPrince

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#106  Edited By LiquidPrince

Every couple of months, or anytime the Bastion team comes on seems fine to me.

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sodiumCyclops

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#107  Edited By sodiumCyclops
@KaosAngel: That's a pretty huge ask though. I can see possibly 1 or 2 of the WM sites doing more stuff, but most of them are crazy busy. 
 
I think the content is fine, for now until the site maybe gets bigger.
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Branthog

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#108  Edited By Branthog

I was actually thinking about this idea a few weeks ago. Seems like a great idea, to me. I don't subscribe so that I can have something other people don't. I subscribe to help the site.

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Branthog

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#109  Edited By Branthog
@Wunder_ said:
" Whoa wait, so the Happy Hour will be free for everyone? Looks like I have no reason to pay then! "
You do realize that there are four weeks in a month, right? 
 
Also, I don't subscribe just so I can have something others don't. If my subscription helps support them so they can pump out more content to more people, then awesome. 
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Darksnughero

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#110  Edited By Darksnughero

 
Obviously,  I don't pay.  But you asked, so as a longtime lurker, I am stating. (take note time of post)  Keep in mind, my opinion is in the minority and I haven't seen the payed shows, yet.
 
It makes sense to open monthly shows up, when your after the bucks.  The awkward tension between Sara and everybody else was funny, especially with Ryan.  Anyone else think the flirting between Brad and Sara is childish?   Aren't they both in relationships?  Maybe I'm jelly.
 
Anyway.  I liked the show for the most part.  Even if it lacks greatly in real content, and struggles to extend past it's Quick Look source. The conversation with the developers was nice to watch, really liked the video, but I felt it was to much like a mock local cable set up.  I get that your low budget, but I felt you guys had a lot of heart in the beginning.  You were working on something you really felt deeply about.  But every-time I see you live, that feeling seems to decay.
 
I didn't feel any real connection between your office and the Indi-devs.  They seemed out of place, uncomfortable, and passive aggressive towards Ryan.  IMO, they are making you into the exact thing you claim not to be.  They are forcing you to sell them.  
 
Now, I like the idea of seeing the in's and out's of indie game development and I think you guys are trying to actually show that.  Just not so sure your conveying that vision to us half-wits very well.  And I imagine its damn hard to do, while not demonizing those kids and trying to make friends at the same time.  Your speaking your poison with two tongues.    (they came off a kids, their real intellectual side was not tapped into.)
 
Basically, the whole thing was a live Quick Look.  Not bad.  An improvement! Just not something I want to pay for.  Especially when Ryan is constantly plugging the other WM sites and your subscription plan.  Getting the message across is one thing, but it comes off greedy.  I don't want you, to tell me who Will and Norm are, make me want to find out on my own.   I kept expecting a flashing banner at the bottom of my screen.   
 
I come off harsh and self absorbed, because I care and am. 
 
It was nice to see less on-air drinking.  There are kids watching, a lot of them, and I'm not going to support reckless drug abuse.  Have fun, do what you want.  But it's wrong to go overboard with to much, too often and then act like its ok in front of children.  Obviously yours and mine definitions of "children"  varies.  But you get my concern.  You have to trip, before you can fall and I don't respect instability.
 
All in all, your coming along.  I was really hoping Giant Bomb would be more of a mature Vidya community and not just 4chan runoff.  But thats a little bit of my own self delusion and a completely different thread.   But then again, I'm a 30 year old hobby gamer.  I have a set-up, I have a library of "titles."  I game like an adult, who enjoys Vidya.  I get that from you guys, at times... But I'm really not into the vegging on the couch, playin geyms stoooned like a high schooler.    Didn't grow out of it, just added structure and gave it meaning.  Which I see some of, in Giant Bomb. 
 
To the point, I've been here for 2 years and I don't know shit about any of the crew's rigs.  Accept that Jeff has a Aquos?  Your specs tell me how you experience the worlds you critique.  People experience games in different ways, we game differently and I know that.  Sitting on the couch is very different from sitting in your gaming room.  Whats your audio like, what kind of lighting are you into?  Do you watch the hours or watch the sun rise?    You come off as people who pass those worlds by, while sitting at a desk.   Not asking you to be like me, just want to know where your coming from. 
 
How serious are you?   More structure  More meaning.  Know your peoples limits.  Maybe these videos are the type of thing, that us the audience, will look back on and laugh.  "Can't believe they were that unprofessional, all over the place."  But where is that 5 year plan.   I don't see Giant Bomb as a fixture in my future.  Because I don't see stability.
 
Rory said it perfectly, even if I can't quote him perfectly.  "I don't know what I'm doing next week, let along next month."   
 
But maybe your right.  Maybe there is pattern to the chaos.  
 
 
 
 
  

  
 

 
There is to mine and I try to work with it.  Look forward to seeing where you guys go next. 
 
Edit:  Its about Ryan and Vinny working together.  At the start, we saw mostly Vinnie's videos/production?  That impacted my views of GB.  Now we get to much aggressive Ryan.  He's good at speaking and handing out questions/hosting.   But Vinnie's videos set a pace and tone that isn't concurrent with Ryan's segments.  Along with the site's design.  They clash.    
 
Then you shoot over to Will and Norm. Desperate Tested.com.  With Sara willing to literally whore herself out for a paycheck.  IMO, WM should let Vinny and Jeff run the show.  Handle Ryan for the team.  Who ever came up with those videos.  They/he has the good stuff and is going to end up somewhere else, if they take that for granted or don't let him shine.    
 
Your coming off as salesmen, not personalities. The videos add style and flow.  But human interactions are labored and struggling.  A lot of tension in the mix.  Reminds me of that guy that always wanted to hang out, but not smoke the blunt.  Then he just sat there staring and killing everyone's buzz.  
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tofford

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#111  Edited By tofford

Mixed feelings really. I want more subscribers but don't want to lessen what we have. I think its fine really I won't be mad either way

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beej

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#112  Edited By beej

 @Darksnughero: I can comfortably state that for the most part I disagree wholly with everything you suggest, and that I'm glad that the happy hour doesn't run the way you want it to. The "barely controlled chaos" as Ryan puts it is part of what keeps me interested in the happy hour it feels infinitely more real that way. Additionally I enjoy Ryans role as a host for the show.
I've got a few other responses to some of your more frustrating statements.  I'm super sorry that the Happy Hour that was given out for free to get non paying members to subscribe involved a request for subscriptions. Oh no wait I'm not sorry at all what did you think this whole thing was for? Do you imagine that if you subscribed the paid happy hours would be full of them plugging a subscription that everyone already has? Thanks for that marvelously coherent argument.
The less on the air drinking argument confused me as well, to what are you comparing their drinking rates? To continue, I enjoy them getting trashed on the camera. It's those kinds of actions that give the happy hour the "heart" that you seem to enjoy.  Removing the drinking, craziness, and semi low budget feel would ruin the heart.
Would knowing their rigs really change that much for anybody? Their experience with most games will probably be more colored by other similar games,  than what the specs are on their machines. Also I'm not sure what part of the happy hour has given you the idea that Giantbomb is about getting high and playing video games. Jeff's formspring even has him saying that he's never smoked marijuanna, but to hell with consistency or reason!
In your long semi-focused request for a more 'mature' site did you ever stop to consider the immaturity inherent in assuming that your desire for, and opinion on what is, professionalism is shared by everyone?  Also nice parting shot about Sara whoring herself out, that combined with your super sick weed analogy does a lot to help us get away from the 4chan mentality you profess to hate. 
I may have come off as rude and assuming but that's because you are.

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gunslingerNZ

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#113  Edited By gunslingerNZ
@Darksnughero said:
" I didn't feel any real connection between your office and the Indi-devs.  They seemed out of place, uncomfortable, and passive aggressive towards Ryan.  IMO, they are making you into the exact thing you claim not to be.  They are forcing you to sell them.  

      
"
Entirely disagree, comes across to me more like the guys are doing a favour to their friend who's got a really great product.
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AnotherDuder

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#114  Edited By AnotherDuder
@DerekDanahy said:
" I think making the Happy Hour show free to non-subscribers every other month instead of every month is a better idea. But I think archiving it to free users is a good idea. "
Agreed :)
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wunder_

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#115  Edited By wunder_
@Branthog: Great, thanks for being a White Knight. Why don't you donate more of your salary to them then? And before you jump all over me, you'd realize this thread was needless ambiguous.
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PJ

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#116  Edited By PJ

The best way to get new subscribers is to coin alot of jokes or just do some funny ass shit during the members only Happy Hour and then reference it on the site alot without explaning it.

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Azteck

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#117  Edited By Azteck

See it like this. The free show sold me on a subscription, although I was planning on getting to that anyway. There's just the issue of not being able to, still..

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GunslingerPanda

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#118  Edited By GunslingerPanda

I only get to watch the archive because I live in the UK. If that was free for everyone every week I'd feel a bit cheated. Once a month seems a bit too often too tbh. I think once every two months would be fair though.

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Branthog

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#119  Edited By Branthog
@Wunder_ said:
" @Branthog: Great, thanks for being a White Knight. Why don't you donate more of your salary to them then? And before you jump all over me, you'd realize this thread was needless ambiguous. "
 
I didn't jump all over you. I simply pointed out how it's kind of shitty for people to act like something is devalued, because more people get to enjoy it. Yes, there's a fine balance to be struck between "give as much as possible to as much of the community as possible" and "reserve something that's just a little special for those who do subscribe" (though, no mistake about it, the subscriptions are all about supporting a site that does something you benefit from in general rather than directly paying for X, Y, and Z feature) -- but how am I at all impacted by everyone else getting to watch the hour long weekly show? Much less getting to watch it once per month -- and then the archives, after a certain period of time. 
 
It's not like they're not going to ever produce some other additional content for subscribers and it's not like those who subscribed were somehow impacted by the GiantBombcast being kept open for the whole community (and almost everyone who subscribed was loudly supportive of keeping that open for the community). I wouldn't care if they opened everything up, but I would definitely understand if people who subscribed were a little upset (even though they presumably subscribed to support the site, primarily). However, that isn't the case here. It's one show a month and then (apparently) the archived versions . . . at some point.
 
Maybe their plan is to introduce things to subscribers, first. Then some things will remain for subscribers while other things are folded into the community after a trial with the subscribers. Whatever they do, I'm sure they're keenly aware of needing to provide an incentive for subscriptions and extending themselves to the overall community, alike. It's just the "No, that's not fair! Only I'm supposed to get to have that!" attitude I've seen some people with.
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ajamafalous

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#120  Edited By ajamafalous
@PJ said:
" The best way to get new subscribers is to coin alot of jokes or just do some funny ass shit during the members only Happy Hour and then reference it on the site alot without explaning it. "
Also, this.
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Branthog

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#121  Edited By Branthog
@KaosAngel said:
" Not to bring up other sites that offer similar stuff:  TWIT gives me a live chatroom, live video each record, and over 20 podcasts on a weekly/daily basis (all of them being at least 1 hour long). I also have given $50 to them this year to keep up the great work.  GB needs to up the content or something, because other sites that are geared like this give much more back. "
GB has live chat during the shows and some shows are live (not sure why that's important). Also, TWIT has half a million viewers and is sponsored by *heavy* advertising. They also aren't producing the level of online content (outside of videos) that GiantBomb does. They've also been building the network for the better part of the past decade, on top of a widely distributed terrestrial radio show. GiantBomb is about two years old and just starting out. Doesn't really seem feasible to expect the same maturity in product this early in the game, when they're still figuring out how all the pieces are going to fit together.
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wunder_

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#122  Edited By wunder_
@Branthog: I realize their need to gain more subscribers, but the fact of the matter remains that ever since the subscription service started, there have a lot of shaky moves made by WhiskeyMedia. I really, really, hated the decision to split the bombcast and I even held off my subscription until it was announced it was going to be free, since there wasn't any point to withhold it anymore. When GiantBomb began, they were adamant about their advertising policy and how they didn't want ads permeating throughout the site with overlays and disturbing pop-ups. Although I never received any ads, it still made me feel good that the site cared for their users. 
 
With the advent of the subscription service, it's beginning to seem as if they're expecting a greater inflow of income, while still remaining non-chalant about everything. When there's money involved with your consumer base, one has to sometimes be serious and really talk about the situation with the customers instead of laughing it off and continuing with their ulterior motives. I'm not saying Whiskey is some evil mastermind company, but I've tried to 'support' them in any way possible by buying the GiantBomb App, donating to them a couple times a year and there's absolutely no recognition. They literally stopped developing the Giantbomb App after a couple of months. An app that was paid for. What's that say about a subscriber based service? It seems that the subscribers are slowly getting less and less content removed from them, in an already limited service. I don't even get to participate in the Live shows because I live in Singapore and would have to wake up pretty early to get to participate, and see that none of my questions get answered, I don't get picked for TNT, this one week especially important, since I actually have the game, and I watch everything from the archive. Hell, I haven't even gotten my t-shirt and I'm a day 1 subscriber. It took me 2 or 3 weeks just to get HD streaming to work and I received almost no confirmation except for a couple word answers in the actual thread. So tell me, what's the point of 'subscribing' or 'supporting' Whiskey Media if I'm not getting anything out of it? The Happy Hour is literally the only thing I have that's keeping me from renewing my subscription next year as it's the only thing that's actually new content. If a once-a-week sitdown with the Whiskey crew is cut by 25% to 3/month, maybe the once a month Bastion talk is enough for me. 
 
And just to close, I really don't understand how people can say, let's "support" the site by subscribing. Other than the podcast which was being threatened to be split, why don't people just send them monthly tithes? If they're determined to support whiskey, I don't see why simply donating to them is worse than getting HD video and the Happy Hour.
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Milkman

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#123  Edited By Milkman

Do it every other month. Once a month seems like way too many free shows.

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NathHaw

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#124  Edited By NathHaw
@Wunder_: How were you a day one subscriber if you held off on the Bombcast news?
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ThePickle

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#125  Edited By ThePickle
@Milkman said:
" Do it every other month. Once a month seems like way too many free shows. "
Agreed. Members should have some incentive to join. 
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NathHaw

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#127  Edited By NathHaw
@RiotBananas: I think it's a good opinion.
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beej

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#129  Edited By beej
@RiotBananas: I can see your point, and the part of me that likes seeing some value totally agrees. Not to say that there isn't a part of me that wants to see the most awesome for the most people. That's why I hoped the bombcast would stay free, but I see the point that this is a feature designed for subscribers as a way of saying thanks for helping out. Obviously I can't disagree with tasters, and I think that the bastion content should be available for everyone. I just feel that the better way to provide that is to separate the bastion coverage from the happy hour. Also I'm not sure how necessary the once a month tasters are. The site has a lot of people in it for the long run, and if this one is archived then they have most of what they need to decide if it's worth it or not. Special occasions obviously are an exception but I feel like there's enough taster as it is.  Also your point about the best content being saved for the free shows is actually starting to worry me.
God but at the same time looking at what I wrote I feel like some absolute D-bag who's jealously guarding my exclusivity.
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234r2we232

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#130  Edited By 234r2we232

The apparent mentality of 'To hell with new site features, just put it in the live show' kinda surprises and disappoints me. *slowly wanders off conufsed*

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NathHaw

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#131  Edited By NathHaw
@beej: I think it's perfectly fine for us to expect that these free shows are somewhat infrequent.  Once a month is too much for me; I am OK with every other month, but I'd prefer the free shows to happen with special events that come along every few months.
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Jayzilla

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#132  Edited By Jayzilla
@snide said:
 

 

  1. It helps us show off the benefits of subscription... which apparently is a drunk Tested team.
    
^ makes it easy for people to see if they want to subscribe or not. 
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VicRattlehead

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#133  Edited By VicRattlehead
@RiotBananas: I agree with you good sir 
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MikkaQ

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#134  Edited By MikkaQ

Fine to hear the archive is free. It could attract more people to subscribe after the fact, so yeah!

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beej

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#135  Edited By beej
@sofacitysweetheart: While that would be confusing I'm not entirely sure where that viewpoint is apparent.
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Animasta

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#136  Edited By Animasta
@RiotBananas said:
 
It seems like you're slightly stepping back on what these where originally about, a chance for subscribers to get a bit of one on one time with you guys, and some developers and special guests. All I'm saying is, please be careful. (If anyone disagrees, please don't flame me, this is just my opinion) "
What developer is going to want to come on to an audience that isn't even the full audience that you could get? that free show got into the 2000's, while normal happy hours get into maybe 700-800.
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234r2we232

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#137  Edited By 234r2we232
@beej:  I'll leave you to quietly consider it, then :)
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beej

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#138  Edited By beej
@sofacitysweetheart or you could explain what you mean?
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deactivated-6050ef4074a17

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@Axxol said:
" I canceled my subscription. No offense, but the Big Live Show just isn't enough for me to keep paying.  I need a more than just a shiny medal and The Live Show to make this subscription worthwhile. "
 
I'm just a mostly-lurking non subscriber, but, I feel like it should be mentioned that the reason I haven't subscribed is because of this same feeling. It seems like the only benefits to subscribing are live shows that aren't really all that hot (and seems to be glorified Paid Programming at times. If you're doing a show for subscribers why do you have to plug shit for people handing you money already?), a T-Shirt that people seem to not actually be getting, a meaningless medal to go under your avatar, and HD videos that don't really impact my ability to watch stuff if I can't access it anyway. (The quality is fine and where I live, I doubt I could load an HD video that fast anyway.)
 
Just speaking for myself here, but I would subscribe if there was some actual serious site content added just for subscribers on the level of some sort of consecutive video series, instead of just optional trinkets and a live show I probably wouldn't watch anyway.  I really want to subscribe because I love GiantBomb, but I haven't really seen any serious reason for me to do so yet. I feel like all GB has right now on offer is the equivalent of those small-time political organizations that offer you a little laminated card for 40 dollars, or something.
 
It's a tired old cliche, but it applies: "Play to your strengths." Giant Bomb's strengths is it's video game content (like Quick Looks and the ER, etc) and the natural chemistry between Ryan, Vinny, Jeff, and Brad. I feel like if GB wants to maintain consistently rising numbers of subscribers (a meaningful consistent increase) then you've got to actually work to get people's attention and not hope that they get roped in by a few trinkets into locking themselves into a one year subscription.  
 
This thread is called "Subscriber Democracy." That's a good title for a thread, and it is how things should really be considered. Before subscriptions, I think it was kind of okay for Jeff and the rest of GB to sort of be dismissive to some community demands, but now, in some way, Giant Bomb is a business and should to some small extent be held accountable to it's (for lack of a better word) customers, and sometimes the way to get your loyal followers riled up and get more people involved is a little fan service. As I said, play to your strengths. Hopefully there's some big "subscriber only" thing someday that makes me think "Oh DUDE, I NEED to see this! *subscribe*" So far I haven't had that moment yet, but I really want to.
 
(And the big-ass GameSpot-esque distracting background ads aren't exactly a confidence inspiring move for the site in general, just as a sidenote.)
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the8bitNacho

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#140  Edited By the8bitNacho

Since it was open to everyone to begin with I can't see any reason why the archived version of the show shouldn't be available to everyone. And honestly I handed over my subscription fee to support Whiskey Media, not to acquire any of the subscriber benefits. You could make the entire Happy Hour free for all I care.

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Red12b

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#141  Edited By Red12b

@Marokai 
 
I agree on every point you brought up.
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Jimbo7676

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#142  Edited By Jimbo7676
I'd say once every two months. Either that or whenever the Bastion team is there because they should get all the attention they can. Also you should broadcast widely when the free show will happen so as many people can get in as possible. I'd say limit the chat to subscribers only just to throttle the spam so we don't have to have huge cool downs and that way the subscribers are still getting something extra. I think making some shows free is great to get more subscribers. They have been missing out on these awesome shows.