To anyone who is being affected by the immigration ban my thoughts are with you right now.

@sysyphus: Well not that it matters much but Swedens problems aint that they are letting everyone in but rather how they do it. Sweden let everyone in but you have to get there by illegal trafficking and once youre there you are just placed in what can be described as prisons and refugeecamps with nothing done to make sure you can adjust to the society. Sweden has the economic means and resources to properly welcome these people but it aint happening.

The chaos in Sweden are about a political stalemate where the leftwing wanna continue "open borders" and the rightwing wanna close it (or "limit it") but noone of them actually wanna take responsibility and pay for it. Meanwhile an populistic opposition party gains more votes each election, surprise surprise.

Political stalemate and an populist gets more votes has anyone heard about that before?

That's not really the same thing, but I do agree that I wouldn't change my stance if GB changed theirs. If they were pro-Trump, I'd still be against him and his principles. At the same time, it's totally okay to at least be swayed by something to rethink your stance. In fact, if anything, people should rethink what they are doing more often.

@rethla: the dude went on an apology tour. We saw the spread of isis and the extreme reach of Russia during his term exactly because he was weak. I'm sorry but nobody took him seriously because no one thought of him as a threat so of course they liked him.

I think you have been living in that bubble, because people have been actively fighting for women's rights in a lot of countries that you seem to be unaware of. There are organizations that work for equality every day. Just because you don't see a protest march every day doesn't mean people aren't working for equality worldwide.

I find it disingenuous that it took this sleaze of a president for some people to all of a sudden bring up women's issues in other countries.

I didn't catch that bit till days after and I'm still amazed. Like, I don't know the words to describe my shock. People can call it a fib, or white lie or wishful thinking but openly lying about something that is clear and evident to every single person at the speech, watched it live or to ever watch it again as a recording. That's mental disorder and instability. That needs attending to; instead we grant it the highest office in the US.

@vortextk:

http://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2017/jan/26/hillary-clinton-received-800000-votes-from-nonciti/

That's only when you want healthcare or labor protections or if you want to protect the environment or something. Then you have to calm down and let the slow wheels of government move incrementally in your direction.

If you want to do something that will increase the misery of powerless people, it moves like a greased-up sled on a steep hill.

It's almost like we've been had.

@newhuman: ah yes, group-think and cultism. Always great ideas. That you stop reading comments because 90% of people agree with you instead of 100% is more scary than anything I've ever read on this site.

I think Trump took it too far but changing vetting rules is probably a good idea.

@vortextk: One of the priests talking at his inauguration litteraly called out the rain and said "The rain is a blessing from god and a sign of well meaning for Trump and America" or something along that line.

I don't think I watched that speech. What are you guys referring to?

@jimbo: Do you really need political expertise to be able to weigh in on this specific issue, you reckon?

Isn't there an old adage that, the problem with good government is nobody will be sure you've done anything?

I respect that alot of people don't want to talk politics on Giant Bomb, but when shit like this happens something has be said. Banning people from a country based on vague ethnic or religious lines is terrible.

This stuff needs to be talked about.

@zevvion: His inauguration speech. It rained during. He said it didn't, insisted it didn't, not while he was talking.

Copy and pasting some quotes

"First, on inauguration day at the Inaugural Ball, Trump announced, “The crowd was unbelievable today. I looked at the rain, which just never came, you know, we finished the speech, went inside, it poured then we came outside. The helicopter scene was an incredible scene, and then, amazingly it rained—like God was looking down on us.”"

"Fourth, the day after the inauguration he kept insisting that the rain ceased for his speech, even though he had already been called out for that falsehood. “The rain should have scared them away. But God looked down and he said, ‘We’re not going to let it rain on your speech.’ In fact, when I first started I said, “Oh no.” First line, I got hit by a couple of drops. And I said, ‘Oh, this is, this is too bad, but we’ll go right through it.’ But the truth is that it stopped immediately. It was amazing. And then it became really sunny, and then I walked off and it poured right after I left.”"

http://occupydemocrats.com/2017/01/23/trumps-five-biggest-lies-since-taking-office/

If someone wants to get up in arms about that site because of it's name it's literally just the first link I came upon that had statements.

Courtesy of a kotaku photoshop contest, I would do anything to get even this man back in office at this point.

Talking about consecutive terms is honestly nonsense, factor in suffrage, jim crow, how many times political parties "switched sides", and how many coincide with the annual recession(which whatever party in charge will be blamed for when it's a part of how the economy is set up) you can't factor in which party is "better".

Honestly that's the whole issue with the 2 party system itself, they have basically become borderline cults on both sides. It's become more about "team red" "team blue" then actual policies and progressive thinking, which led to someone as unqualified as Trump being the president. It shouldn't be about what "party is better" it should be about the best people with the best policies and ideas getting in office.

I expect those of you who are fine with this EO to have no problem with any limitations on your ability to move about the world when inevitably your American citizenship results in bans for entry into other countries. Hell, Iran already has done so, to which I say, good on them. Turnabout is fair play.

Some people get their news from very questionable sources with a mentality that I'll just say is very 'old-school' circa, shall we say, the 1930s. Those news outlets are really keen to report on anything scarybad that might involve somebody with a little more melanin than the majority population so you can't be surprised if their readers are convinced that perfectly pleasant countries like Sweden have turned into the movie Gremlins by migrants.

I imagine "murica first, fuck everyone else" is basically the response you would get from them anyway so they probably wouldn't care. "Why go anywhere else?" But I'd love to see minds changed

The 18-24 month long, very stringent ones the USA had under Obama weren't enough? The USA already was taking in a shockingly small amount of refugees.

And I didn't stop reading comments on philisophical reasons, the brexit thread was also infested with anti-immigrant garbage and people taking said garbage seriously and it was honestly depressing.

You saw the "spread of Isis" because it is a splinter group that came from the fall of al-queda after it was toppled during Obama's administration. I didn't see much difference in Obama and Bush's foreign policies honestly

As we just said recently, there's a reason why most political threads end up locked, and this thread is already on the same path.

Please try to keep things on track. Keep your comments civil and respectful.

@rethla: Thanks for your reply, to be honest I was unaware they were largely illegals.

As for your other comment, it seems more and more like people are either 100% for open borders or they are 100% for closed borders with no room for nuance, and both sides demonising anyone that doesn't hold their views. No wonder there's no compromise or understanding.

I personally think that a blanket ban on everyone is stupid, as there are decent people that need help, but you also need to screen everyone to make sure that no one is infiltrating the refugees that will end up bringing with them the very problem the decent people are trying to escape.

I just hope those who are fleeing war and suffering find a place they can call home where they are safe.

As an Israeli citizen i'm already banned from these following countries: Algeria, Libya, Sudan, Somalia, Saudi Arabia, Yemen, Lebanon, Syria,United Arab Emirates, Iran, Pakistan, Bangladesh, Malaysia and Brunei.

Just so you understand how this part of the world works.

It's really more of a splinter group of the Baathists who were thrown out of power en masse by the Bush administration. You have a bunch of veteran soldiers and officers who were used to being at the top of Iraqi society and all of a sudden, they're not only out of a job, they're pariahs in the new order. What do they do? They exploit the trend of extremist terrorism, link up with former al-Qaeda people and what emerges is a much more organized, militaristic and propaganda-savvy version of what came before. It's almost like this is some kind of quicksand scenario where the more we thrash around and struggle, the faster we sink.

Refugees already go through an 18-24 month vetting process. The idea that people are just pouring into the US unvetted and unchecked is a complete lie that Trump and many other Republicans have attempted to drill into the heads of the public for months.

The USA already did that before this EO, and much more harshly than other developed nations. Much like how the number of Mexican undocumented immigrants has been stable/decreasing for years yet now we need a wall to keep them out !!

^^This please. I want the energy we spend fighting to instead be focusing on the victims instead of fighting for who has the higher moral compass. Right now, I just hope those who are suffering find happiness.

I think everyone may be forgetting that the majority of this ban is temporary. Along with the immigration executive order, Trump signed an another order that requires a plan to defeat ISIS within the next 30 days. I don't think that's a coincidence.
I'm not anti-immigration, but I do believe America's safety should come first.

@betterley: Then you should be against an order that pits the populace against eachother, hurts our standing and recognition around the world and keeps people out of our country that -deserve- to be here through the already rigorous processes we have and they have undergone. Tell someone who is going back to a country that looks like a set for the next modern war shooter game that it's only temporary.

Or, to bring it down from the abstract, we've stopped immigration from countries that have not caused terrorism in the US and are continuing to allow immigration that have caused terrorism in the US. Where's the safety in that?

Totally. The American process for taking in refugees is already incredibly strict to the point of being cruel.

One thing that has disappointed me about the debate on this subject has been liberals defaulting to the position of saying that everything about how America treated refugees pre-GOP dominated gov't is fine. In reality, America lets people sit in limbo for an incredibly long time when the process could easily be expedited to take half the time or less. And everyone ought to keep in mind that America is a gigantic country fretting over a minuscule number of refugees, many of whom are from countries engulfed in conflicts in which America herself participated! Iraq, Syria, Somalia, Yemen. America is bombing these countries right now. It seems to me that ought to come with a responsibility to help the people whose lives have been shattered by those conflicts. Instead, that burden is shifted to countries like Germany who have had minimal if any involvement (by the way, it's not really a burden. Refugees are an economic net benefit to their host countries).

And when you look at a country like Iran, politicians will talk until they're blue in the face about what an awful, repressive regime they have and oh, how the people suffer! But God forbid we should let the people persecuted by an Islamic theocracy we vehemently oppose find comfort in our country.

@owack6: And I am as sorry for that as I am for what those wrongfully targeted by this EO are going through. Race, religion, nationality, gender, sexual orientation, etc, should never be a deciding factor in limitations on someone's freedom. Maybe someday we'll get to a world where that's the case.

@betterley: The people who were hoping to gain asylum in the US don't have 120 days. They already went through a 18-24 month vetting process.

My wife's boss doesn't have 120 days, her dad might be dead by then.

But hey, why not throw millions of people's lives into disarray until we "figure this all out". It's not like the current system was working, what with 0 terrorist attacks by people from countries covered by the ban.

@horseman6: I don't really care whether the President was acting out of a cynical attempt to appease his base or whether he really believes in this ban. I care that this ban is already having a disastrous effect on people's lives and it has already damaged the US's image around the world. And he's only been in power for a week! How the fuck do you pass an EO without running it by any of branches of government that it impacts? How do you just release an order this broad without more planning? It's one thing to be reckless with a personal company, it's another to be reckless with the most powerful country in the world.

90-120 days.

Yes it is temporary but it was poorly planned. Which is why families were separated and detained. What would have happened to those families, sit in the airport for 3 months? Be forced to fly back to countries that are not really their homes since the people detained were green-card holders and permanent US residents.

Because we expect more from America. Pretty simple actually. I find these sorts of statements ridiculous.

http://www.cnn.com/2017/01/29/politics/trump-travel-ban-green-card-holders-priebus/index.html

Green card holders will be allowed into the US.

I can't argue that this didn't cause a lot of confusion, but I think there has been some misinformation going around also.

Green card holders from the seven banned countries, when they land, will undergo additional security screening, including an interview and having their fingerprints checked, sources told CNN. If there are no red flags, then they would be allowed entry.

Green hold holders will be allowed into the US except when they're not.

@zevvion: People care about America, because America is still one of the most powerful countries in the world. And now it is ruled by a loose cannon, whom has no political experience and is accompanied by an extremely polarizing cabinet. Why should we not care? He's a bigger moron than George W. Bush and, much like the former president, now also has his finger on the nuclear button.

Trust me, we (in my case: Germany) have our problems and know about it. But behind a thick layer of cynisism we do expect the US to be among the beacons of Democracy in the world. And with whats happend latetly to you guys it's hard to not see the clear pathway towards fascism the US is walking towards. Am I conviced thats whats going to happen yet? Nah, not yet ... but neither were people in pre-nazi-germany. It's healthy for any society to keep an eye on their leaders and, since the world has gotten smaller, it's healthy for everyone to keep an eye on everyone else. And your newly elected leader has given the world plenty of reasons to be concerned.

It should. So why are you deporting people into unsafe territories? You're forgetting that this ban is 100% anti-democratic and puts lives at risk. Not to mention the emotional damage it already caused. This ban does not give anyone safety, in any sense. It generates risk and hate. Nothing else.

The Iraq war was sold to the public on it lasting for six weeks to six months and then they fought tooth and nail to keep troops there indefinitely.

Besides, the ban doesn't become more constitutional or humane by being temporary. Even a temporary ban will do permanent damage to the lives of many people.

I'll bet my house to your hundred bucks that ISIS isn't 'defeated' by any metric in 300 days, let alone 30.

Daesh puts Trump's quotes in their recruiting material. Belligerence towards any group makes them more hostile and therefore more of a potential danger. Want to make people safe? Do something about climate change or guns. Give people proper healthcare access. That'll make them more safe. Stop hydraulic fracturing, start replacing people's lead pipes, adequately fund Amtrak, send inspectors to chemical storage facilities. I could name literally dozens of things that endanger Americans more than hypothetical Daesh sleeper agents.

My heart goes out to all the innocents affected by this horrible injustice. None of this should have ever happened.

I'd love to reassure you that we will fix it and say this isn't who we are, but I'm not so sure America is the land of the free anymore. God help us all.

@slag: Not to derail this discussion, but the US was never the most free country on earth. You're still a democratic country which means this will be overturned in time by the good people there.

just checking in to show my support of those affected by this executive order, and to express my utter dismay at the president's actions.

this is one of the most powerfully un-american government actions i've borne witness to in my lifetime. as a resident of nyc, it's inescapable to recognize that we are a country of immigrants. the statue of liberty (in close proximity to historic ellis island) stands as a testament to that ideal: that if you show up, believe in our values, and are law-abiding- you are welcome here.

the tricky part of ideals is, if you're a true believer- you need to deal with the positive aspects as well as the negative. in this case- it means opening our doors as a sign of trust to those who would potentially do us harm. you don't get to pick and choose. you either hold to that ideal- and whatever inherent risks are involved- or you compromise your fundamental values and don't get to call yourself the thing you profess to be.

this president's actions are complete horseshit and cowardly. if we're shutting our doors on the basis of imaginary political lines (meaning, countries of origin)- then we're not the country we pretend we are.

(@milkman - thanks for posting @danryckert's bit- dude made it personal in a way that's important).