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Teran

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Ten and a Half Things I wish were in Dragon Age: Origins.

 Ten and a Half Things Dragon Age something something.

WARNING:  Minor Spoilers.

I've played Dragon Age for over 250 hours now and done multiple playthroughs.  The game isn't really built with infinite replayability in mind however the quality of the game has gone a long ways in keeping me from getting bored of it... however there are some things that really could have turned a great game into a legendary game.

I've narrowed my thoughts down into ten concepts that are easy to label.  Some of these things are simple and just a personal preference while some really should have been in the game.  They are in no particular order except that generally the closer to "1" they are the more I feel the feature should have been included.


10.  More Fatalities.  I know this is kind of a petty thing to mention but I have my reasons.  The fatalities currently in the game are generally reserved for Darkspawn Ogres and High Dragons and while these are a nice touch when the animation goes off correctly it kind of leaves me wanting more.

There are a few fatalities that can go off on normal human sized enemies like a decapitation but these aren't quite as interesting and don't seem as savagely brutal as leaping onto the chest of an ogre, stabbing it multiple times as it falls before finishing it with a blow to the head, or leaping onto the neck of a dragon, climbing it with your your blades before slicing the top of its head open in a massive gush of blood.

I don't need something quite that grand for standard enemies but more context sensitive (what spell/weapon got the kill, near walls, spikes, cliffs, etc) animations in the flavor of the "sync kills" in Dawn of War 2, or the Age of Conan fatalities (especially the magic based ones) would have been nice and gone a long ways in creating a darker feeling world... heck even just adding in some of the stuff we see in the Sacred Ashes trailer would have worked.


9.  Formations.  Dragon Age really would have benefitted from the ability to set your party into a preferred formation for out of combat movement and exploration.  As it is now your group is in a permanent diamond formation with whichever character you have selected always moving to the tip of the diamond.  This isn't game breaking but I often have my group's healer selected and I generally don't want her to be the closest person to the enemy when a fight starts.

I would have really liked the ability to choose between a few different formations but even if diamond were the only option, being able to set group mates into specific points of a formation and have them remain in that position no matter who the player has directly selected would have been very convenient.  I was actually a little surprised something like this wasn't included in the game considering several of their previous titles have this feature.


8.  More Character Variety.  Let me just say up front:  I love the characters in Dragon Age.  I love them all, each is unique, foreign, exotic, familiar, and cliche all at the same time.  This in my opinion is the best mix you can have because you generally know from a first impression what group of characters is going to fit the mood you want the game to have.  They are familiar enough that you know generally what you're going to get out of them dialog wise but exotic and foreign because there's a little secret or surprise about each character that you come to find out through interaction with these characters.  I've found that the most plain of the characters often have the biggest secrets.

After that paragraph I realize this doesn't sound like a game that needs more characters and really Dragon Age doesn't *need* them but would benefit greatly from just a little more variety.  Dragon Age lets you play it the way you want good or evil.  There are good and evil factions in the game.  On the other hand, there are no evil potential party members.  Some of your party members have done evil things to be certain but they do not have malice in their hearts.

In Dragon Age you have the choice of grouping with the saintly good to the chaotic neutral and while choosing the "evil" option can often cause party members to leave in certain situations, choosing the "good" option will at worse cause Morrigan to sigh and whine, Zevran to crack an annoyed joke, or Sten will try to take command of the group (because you are not efficient enough in hunting the archdemon) and kill you in a duel... if you win the duel he admits you are the stronger person and will rejoin the group and his approval of you will raise.  The one evil character you can recruit has a change of heart before being recruited and is no longer evil once in your party.

Let's take a closer look at our group options.  Assuming you bought the game new you have the opportunity to recruit ten characters.  Six are male if you count Dog.  Four are female if you count Shale.  Five out of ten are human.  One dwarf.  One elf.  One Qunari (giant).  One Dog.  One Golem.  Short of choosing elf or Dwarf as your protagonist race there is no way to get more than a single dwarf or elf in your group which really makes these races feel under represented.  I can understand the rarity of Qunari, Golems, and Dogs but having the option of a full dwarf or elf group would have been nice.  It was also a little disappointing to see city elves unrepresented and having only a single gender of each race present (qunari, dwarf, and elf are party members are all male).

I know this is a small gripe and as I said before I love the characters in the game I just wish I could have had an all dwarf or all elf group as an option.


7.  Cooperative Multiplayer.  Allowing two protagonist characters to join a group together and play through the game would have been a nice feature.  The game as it is now is not really balanced with something like this in mind and really a lot would need to be changed (like difficulty) but it would have given this game a bit more replayability and as we all know, playing a game with someone is usually more fun than playing alone.


6.  Harder Difficulty.  I'm pretty happy with where the game is at on the normal difficulty but I am extremely disappointed with it on nightmare.  The game actually feels easier on nightmare than it did on normal for me just because I now know the systems inside and out and know what is powerful and what is not.  I was hoping nightmare would be like Diablo's nightmare where every single fight had the potential to butcher you but the rewards were great.  This would go hand in hand with number seven.

Currently players who have mastered this game must artifically handicap themselves in order to create challenge.  Some folks are soloing their way through the game (when possible), others are setting tactics and not intervening in fights directly, still others are taking and using specs known to be inferior and weak.  A more nightmarish nightmare difficulty would have gone a long ways in adding significant replayability to DA:O.


5.  New Game +.  This also goes hand in hand with numbers six and seven.  At the end of the game it would have been nice to have the option to restart the game, choose a new class and origin and start up at the level you ended the previous game on and start from there.  This would ideally increase the difficulty and add a new dimension to the game.  Like number 7 though the game would need to be redesigned somewhat for this to be practical... but I still wish it had been planned for.


4.  Talent Synergy.  Talents are effectively pools of completely separate, utterly incompatible skills which just doesn't seem right to me.  The system is straight forward enough in that you choose the talents you want but it makes the whole process dull when you realize you're basically limited to 12-16 skills and after that anything purchased will essentially be useless.

I think in addition to giving spec related skills and passives they should also be of some general smaller use as well.  Let me write out an example of what I mean.

Momentum (current tier 3 dual wield talent):  While this skill is active and your character is dual wielding your attack speed is doubled.  This talent also passively increases your characters attack speed by 5% with all weapons.

Momentum still gives a very powerful sustained ability but now also has a minor passive buff perhaps to represent what your character has learned from momentum that they can apply to any combat situation (bow/2h/sword and shield).

Actual skills gained from talents would still be locked into use with the intended weapon set (ie momentum will still only work while dual wielding) but with the smaller passive bonuses you could fine tune your character rather than feel stuck buying a bunch of skills you don't intend to ever use (the entire punisher line in the dual wield tree for example).  Not saying these skills are useless per se, just not in line with what I have planned for the character.  This would have turned the relatively simplistic process of talent speccing for rogues and warriors into something as deliciously complicated and customizable as speccing is for the mage class.


3.  Unlocks.  I really wish they had handled their unlocks differently.  Rather than learning subclasses from manuals and and characters I would have preferred to see a more complex system of unlocks in general.  You would be awarded points for completing quests, finding tome unlocks, and any number of other things which you could then go into a menu and spend on things like subclasses, special side quests, tomes, perhaps even different "costumes" to skin your armor with or special gifts for your party members.  There's a lot that could be done with a system like this and it would feel more rewarding to me than buying a manual and reloading the game.

Any situation where a player is forced to follow an arbitrary set of rules in order to unlock the full potential of the game just doesn't feel right.  I hated that I had to side with lunatic cultists and then drink a cup of dragon blood to gain the reaver class because that act was simply out of character for me while being a reaver might not have been.  There's something to be said for convincing Zevran and Alistair to teach you their subclasses after building up their relationship but again it cheapened the process because at times I felt like I was just bribing them, I wasn't able to stay in character.

This would have also allowed them to incorporate things that count more as dm (dungeon master) type of tools once you reach certain points.  For example they could have added the ability to re-spec your characters into the game as an unlock after you beat the game once on a certain difficulty.  They could make certain cutscenes and character encounter "movies", conversation, and banter unlockable in some kind of theater type of setup accessible from the main menu.  I put into words how much I'd like the ability to just listen to all the different banter that goes on, I've missed so much do to loading and because it doesn't count as actual conversation it does not show up in the pseudo chat log they give you.

I understand why Bioware went this route with it, I just feel that a broader system with more rewards would have been more satisfying.


2.  Where's the balance?  This game is one of the single most exploitable rpgs I have ever played.  Talents are nowhere near balanced.  The entire 2h talent tree is easily surpassed in terms of dps with a mere 3 points in the dual wielding tree (momentum).  Archery was just straight bad on the pc version until the patch a day or two ago and it's still not fully fixed.  The fastest weapon is effectively the highest dps weapon in this game because buffs like fiery weapons do not scale with attack speed and larger weapons do not have any more enchantment slots than small weapons.

How is a 2h sword with a two second swing time, fiery weapon, and 3 enchantment slots supposed to compare to a dagger with a half second swing time, fiery weapon, and 3 enchantment slots?  Lets say a 2h sword hits for a little over twice as much damage per hit as a dagger of similar quality.  Per hit you've hypothetically got:

2h:  80 damage (base) + 15 (fiery weapon) + 15 (3x elemental damage runes) = 110 damage per hit.
Dagger: 35 damage (base) +15 (fiery weapon) +15 (3x elemental damage runes) = 65 damage per hit.

Both weapons benefit the same amount from runes and the mage spell but the dagger hits four or more times (dual wielding 2x daggers) for every single 2h sword swing so in ten seconds of combat (assuming no misses, no resists, no vulnerability/immunity to elemental damage) you end up with:

2h: 80(X5) damage (base) +15(X5) (fiery weapon) +15(x5) (elemental damage runes) = 550 damage (400 base, 150 from spell and enchants).

Dagger:  35 (x20) damage (base) +15(X20) (fiery weapon) +15(X20) (elemental damage runes) = 1300 damage.  (700 base, 600 from spell and enchants).

Dual wielding in this hypothetical situation is roughly 240% more dps.  Now if you run with a group of three dual wielders and a mage stuff dies so quickly a tank is no longer needed.  Before writing this blog post I killed the high dragon on nightmare difficulty with Sten, Oghren, and my protagonist rogue dual wielding daggers while Wynne healed.  The dual wield group build made killing this dragon pathetically easy even compared to my previosu two kills (once with two mages, rogue, and warrior tank and once with a 2h warrior, archer, mage, and shale tank).

Add to this that most debuffs that effect melee combat almost universally scale better with faster weapons and there is no contest as to which spec is better... even if you get warriors like Sten and Oghren with points pre-spent in the 2h line you only really need to get five talents in the dual wield line to put out these kinds of numbers (three to momentum, and the first two passives).

Now before I move on, I will say that yes this is the way I have chosen to play.  I did ignore these numbers on my first play through to fully enjoy the game without min maxing but I was really hoping that the nightmare difficulty would force us to sit down and min max just to survive but that is simply not the case.

1.  Three Words: Random Loot Generator.  The absence of this feature is the most surprising thing of all in the game for me.  How do you let a game this good get shown up by a flash game who's sole reason for existence is advertising this game?  Dragon Age: Journeys (the flash game prequel of sorts) has two huge things Dragon Age: Origins does not.  A random loot generator and stamina (basically rogue and warrior mana) potions.

A random loot generator similar to the likes of what we see in games like Diablo, Torchlight, and Dragon Age: Journeys (/facepalm) would have added so much to this game.  Instead we have a never ending stream of identical suits of armor and weapons of varying levels of quality with the occasional piece of armor that is part of a set but often has no special stats of its own (though there are exceptions).  This would have given the game a bit more replayability as players would no longer simply go straight to the location they know their favorite suits of armor are waiting for them.

.5  Optional challenge mode content.  This is something I wish the game had but not so much that I'd give it a whole number.  It's common for RPG's to have some option content specifically in place to challenge players.  Dragon Age has a couple dragons to kill but these things take very little time to complete.  Considering there is a fully functional arena in the game it was surprising to me that there wasn't some kind of massively challenging content built around that... I actually got my hopes up when I found the unsactioned (illegal?) matches but those hopes were dashed when I cleared five or so of them and got my reward... they actually were some of the more challenging fights in the game I had encountered up to that point which was perhaps why realizing the event was so finite hurt me so.

Well if anyone read this I certainly commend you.  This is quite long and just my opinion.  I'm sure many will agree and many will disagree.  If you feel I'm off base feel free to yell at me, I rather like discussion of this type.  Thanks for reading.

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Teran

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Edited By Teran

 Ten and a Half Things Dragon Age something something.

WARNING:  Minor Spoilers.

I've played Dragon Age for over 250 hours now and done multiple playthroughs.  The game isn't really built with infinite replayability in mind however the quality of the game has gone a long ways in keeping me from getting bored of it... however there are some things that really could have turned a great game into a legendary game.

I've narrowed my thoughts down into ten concepts that are easy to label.  Some of these things are simple and just a personal preference while some really should have been in the game.  They are in no particular order except that generally the closer to "1" they are the more I feel the feature should have been included.


10.  More Fatalities.  I know this is kind of a petty thing to mention but I have my reasons.  The fatalities currently in the game are generally reserved for Darkspawn Ogres and High Dragons and while these are a nice touch when the animation goes off correctly it kind of leaves me wanting more.

There are a few fatalities that can go off on normal human sized enemies like a decapitation but these aren't quite as interesting and don't seem as savagely brutal as leaping onto the chest of an ogre, stabbing it multiple times as it falls before finishing it with a blow to the head, or leaping onto the neck of a dragon, climbing it with your your blades before slicing the top of its head open in a massive gush of blood.

I don't need something quite that grand for standard enemies but more context sensitive (what spell/weapon got the kill, near walls, spikes, cliffs, etc) animations in the flavor of the "sync kills" in Dawn of War 2, or the Age of Conan fatalities (especially the magic based ones) would have been nice and gone a long ways in creating a darker feeling world... heck even just adding in some of the stuff we see in the Sacred Ashes trailer would have worked.


9.  Formations.  Dragon Age really would have benefitted from the ability to set your party into a preferred formation for out of combat movement and exploration.  As it is now your group is in a permanent diamond formation with whichever character you have selected always moving to the tip of the diamond.  This isn't game breaking but I often have my group's healer selected and I generally don't want her to be the closest person to the enemy when a fight starts.

I would have really liked the ability to choose between a few different formations but even if diamond were the only option, being able to set group mates into specific points of a formation and have them remain in that position no matter who the player has directly selected would have been very convenient.  I was actually a little surprised something like this wasn't included in the game considering several of their previous titles have this feature.


8.  More Character Variety.  Let me just say up front:  I love the characters in Dragon Age.  I love them all, each is unique, foreign, exotic, familiar, and cliche all at the same time.  This in my opinion is the best mix you can have because you generally know from a first impression what group of characters is going to fit the mood you want the game to have.  They are familiar enough that you know generally what you're going to get out of them dialog wise but exotic and foreign because there's a little secret or surprise about each character that you come to find out through interaction with these characters.  I've found that the most plain of the characters often have the biggest secrets.

After that paragraph I realize this doesn't sound like a game that needs more characters and really Dragon Age doesn't *need* them but would benefit greatly from just a little more variety.  Dragon Age lets you play it the way you want good or evil.  There are good and evil factions in the game.  On the other hand, there are no evil potential party members.  Some of your party members have done evil things to be certain but they do not have malice in their hearts.

In Dragon Age you have the choice of grouping with the saintly good to the chaotic neutral and while choosing the "evil" option can often cause party members to leave in certain situations, choosing the "good" option will at worse cause Morrigan to sigh and whine, Zevran to crack an annoyed joke, or Sten will try to take command of the group (because you are not efficient enough in hunting the archdemon) and kill you in a duel... if you win the duel he admits you are the stronger person and will rejoin the group and his approval of you will raise.  The one evil character you can recruit has a change of heart before being recruited and is no longer evil once in your party.

Let's take a closer look at our group options.  Assuming you bought the game new you have the opportunity to recruit ten characters.  Six are male if you count Dog.  Four are female if you count Shale.  Five out of ten are human.  One dwarf.  One elf.  One Qunari (giant).  One Dog.  One Golem.  Short of choosing elf or Dwarf as your protagonist race there is no way to get more than a single dwarf or elf in your group which really makes these races feel under represented.  I can understand the rarity of Qunari, Golems, and Dogs but having the option of a full dwarf or elf group would have been nice.  It was also a little disappointing to see city elves unrepresented and having only a single gender of each race present (qunari, dwarf, and elf are party members are all male).

I know this is a small gripe and as I said before I love the characters in the game I just wish I could have had an all dwarf or all elf group as an option.


7.  Cooperative Multiplayer.  Allowing two protagonist characters to join a group together and play through the game would have been a nice feature.  The game as it is now is not really balanced with something like this in mind and really a lot would need to be changed (like difficulty) but it would have given this game a bit more replayability and as we all know, playing a game with someone is usually more fun than playing alone.


6.  Harder Difficulty.  I'm pretty happy with where the game is at on the normal difficulty but I am extremely disappointed with it on nightmare.  The game actually feels easier on nightmare than it did on normal for me just because I now know the systems inside and out and know what is powerful and what is not.  I was hoping nightmare would be like Diablo's nightmare where every single fight had the potential to butcher you but the rewards were great.  This would go hand in hand with number seven.

Currently players who have mastered this game must artifically handicap themselves in order to create challenge.  Some folks are soloing their way through the game (when possible), others are setting tactics and not intervening in fights directly, still others are taking and using specs known to be inferior and weak.  A more nightmarish nightmare difficulty would have gone a long ways in adding significant replayability to DA:O.


5.  New Game +.  This also goes hand in hand with numbers six and seven.  At the end of the game it would have been nice to have the option to restart the game, choose a new class and origin and start up at the level you ended the previous game on and start from there.  This would ideally increase the difficulty and add a new dimension to the game.  Like number 7 though the game would need to be redesigned somewhat for this to be practical... but I still wish it had been planned for.


4.  Talent Synergy.  Talents are effectively pools of completely separate, utterly incompatible skills which just doesn't seem right to me.  The system is straight forward enough in that you choose the talents you want but it makes the whole process dull when you realize you're basically limited to 12-16 skills and after that anything purchased will essentially be useless.

I think in addition to giving spec related skills and passives they should also be of some general smaller use as well.  Let me write out an example of what I mean.

Momentum (current tier 3 dual wield talent):  While this skill is active and your character is dual wielding your attack speed is doubled.  This talent also passively increases your characters attack speed by 5% with all weapons.

Momentum still gives a very powerful sustained ability but now also has a minor passive buff perhaps to represent what your character has learned from momentum that they can apply to any combat situation (bow/2h/sword and shield).

Actual skills gained from talents would still be locked into use with the intended weapon set (ie momentum will still only work while dual wielding) but with the smaller passive bonuses you could fine tune your character rather than feel stuck buying a bunch of skills you don't intend to ever use (the entire punisher line in the dual wield tree for example).  Not saying these skills are useless per se, just not in line with what I have planned for the character.  This would have turned the relatively simplistic process of talent speccing for rogues and warriors into something as deliciously complicated and customizable as speccing is for the mage class.


3.  Unlocks.  I really wish they had handled their unlocks differently.  Rather than learning subclasses from manuals and and characters I would have preferred to see a more complex system of unlocks in general.  You would be awarded points for completing quests, finding tome unlocks, and any number of other things which you could then go into a menu and spend on things like subclasses, special side quests, tomes, perhaps even different "costumes" to skin your armor with or special gifts for your party members.  There's a lot that could be done with a system like this and it would feel more rewarding to me than buying a manual and reloading the game.

Any situation where a player is forced to follow an arbitrary set of rules in order to unlock the full potential of the game just doesn't feel right.  I hated that I had to side with lunatic cultists and then drink a cup of dragon blood to gain the reaver class because that act was simply out of character for me while being a reaver might not have been.  There's something to be said for convincing Zevran and Alistair to teach you their subclasses after building up their relationship but again it cheapened the process because at times I felt like I was just bribing them, I wasn't able to stay in character.

This would have also allowed them to incorporate things that count more as dm (dungeon master) type of tools once you reach certain points.  For example they could have added the ability to re-spec your characters into the game as an unlock after you beat the game once on a certain difficulty.  They could make certain cutscenes and character encounter "movies", conversation, and banter unlockable in some kind of theater type of setup accessible from the main menu.  I put into words how much I'd like the ability to just listen to all the different banter that goes on, I've missed so much do to loading and because it doesn't count as actual conversation it does not show up in the pseudo chat log they give you.

I understand why Bioware went this route with it, I just feel that a broader system with more rewards would have been more satisfying.


2.  Where's the balance?  This game is one of the single most exploitable rpgs I have ever played.  Talents are nowhere near balanced.  The entire 2h talent tree is easily surpassed in terms of dps with a mere 3 points in the dual wielding tree (momentum).  Archery was just straight bad on the pc version until the patch a day or two ago and it's still not fully fixed.  The fastest weapon is effectively the highest dps weapon in this game because buffs like fiery weapons do not scale with attack speed and larger weapons do not have any more enchantment slots than small weapons.

How is a 2h sword with a two second swing time, fiery weapon, and 3 enchantment slots supposed to compare to a dagger with a half second swing time, fiery weapon, and 3 enchantment slots?  Lets say a 2h sword hits for a little over twice as much damage per hit as a dagger of similar quality.  Per hit you've hypothetically got:

2h:  80 damage (base) + 15 (fiery weapon) + 15 (3x elemental damage runes) = 110 damage per hit.
Dagger: 35 damage (base) +15 (fiery weapon) +15 (3x elemental damage runes) = 65 damage per hit.

Both weapons benefit the same amount from runes and the mage spell but the dagger hits four or more times (dual wielding 2x daggers) for every single 2h sword swing so in ten seconds of combat (assuming no misses, no resists, no vulnerability/immunity to elemental damage) you end up with:

2h: 80(X5) damage (base) +15(X5) (fiery weapon) +15(x5) (elemental damage runes) = 550 damage (400 base, 150 from spell and enchants).

Dagger:  35 (x20) damage (base) +15(X20) (fiery weapon) +15(X20) (elemental damage runes) = 1300 damage.  (700 base, 600 from spell and enchants).

Dual wielding in this hypothetical situation is roughly 240% more dps.  Now if you run with a group of three dual wielders and a mage stuff dies so quickly a tank is no longer needed.  Before writing this blog post I killed the high dragon on nightmare difficulty with Sten, Oghren, and my protagonist rogue dual wielding daggers while Wynne healed.  The dual wield group build made killing this dragon pathetically easy even compared to my previosu two kills (once with two mages, rogue, and warrior tank and once with a 2h warrior, archer, mage, and shale tank).

Add to this that most debuffs that effect melee combat almost universally scale better with faster weapons and there is no contest as to which spec is better... even if you get warriors like Sten and Oghren with points pre-spent in the 2h line you only really need to get five talents in the dual wield line to put out these kinds of numbers (three to momentum, and the first two passives).

Now before I move on, I will say that yes this is the way I have chosen to play.  I did ignore these numbers on my first play through to fully enjoy the game without min maxing but I was really hoping that the nightmare difficulty would force us to sit down and min max just to survive but that is simply not the case.

1.  Three Words: Random Loot Generator.  The absence of this feature is the most surprising thing of all in the game for me.  How do you let a game this good get shown up by a flash game who's sole reason for existence is advertising this game?  Dragon Age: Journeys (the flash game prequel of sorts) has two huge things Dragon Age: Origins does not.  A random loot generator and stamina (basically rogue and warrior mana) potions.

A random loot generator similar to the likes of what we see in games like Diablo, Torchlight, and Dragon Age: Journeys (/facepalm) would have added so much to this game.  Instead we have a never ending stream of identical suits of armor and weapons of varying levels of quality with the occasional piece of armor that is part of a set but often has no special stats of its own (though there are exceptions).  This would have given the game a bit more replayability as players would no longer simply go straight to the location they know their favorite suits of armor are waiting for them.

.5  Optional challenge mode content.  This is something I wish the game had but not so much that I'd give it a whole number.  It's common for RPG's to have some option content specifically in place to challenge players.  Dragon Age has a couple dragons to kill but these things take very little time to complete.  Considering there is a fully functional arena in the game it was surprising to me that there wasn't some kind of massively challenging content built around that... I actually got my hopes up when I found the unsactioned (illegal?) matches but those hopes were dashed when I cleared five or so of them and got my reward... they actually were some of the more challenging fights in the game I had encountered up to that point which was perhaps why realizing the event was so finite hurt me so.

Well if anyone read this I certainly commend you.  This is quite long and just my opinion.  I'm sure many will agree and many will disagree.  If you feel I'm off base feel free to yell at me, I rather like discussion of this type.  Thanks for reading.

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Bansheesdie

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Edited By Bansheesdie

What in the world is "2h"? 
 
And you answered something for me, of whether or not loot is random. And no, I don't understand why it is not random either.

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Edited By Draugrim

Wow I pretty much agree with all the points here. When you make an RPG these days and don't take into account class balance, you weaken your product considerably. With that said, I still love this game, but I'm glad it doesn't have multiplayer because it would be a shit storm.

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chirotera

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Edited By chirotera
@Bansheesdie said:
" What in the world is "2h"?  And you answered something for me, of whether or not loot is random. And no, I don't understand why it is not random either. "
2h stands for 'two-handed'
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Edited By keyhunter

Random loot is something I would like to never see ever again.

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Bansheesdie

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Edited By Bansheesdie

My main complaint against the game is inconsistent difficulties, I've noticed certain circumstances were battles are incredibly difficult and others that seem too easy

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Edited By mordukai
@Teran:  
I have no idea what came over Bioware when making this. It's not like it's their first RPG game. I think that by trying to distance themselves from their D&D past they might have went just a little bit too far.  
#4- AMAN to that. They had it in Mass Effect (though you could only use the Character you already had) so I was extremely surprised when they left it out of this game.  
 
If you please I want to add a number 11.  
10. Better DLC management. I should not pay extra to have a storage chest that should have been present in your home camp. Even you do want to charge for it why put it in a place you have to travel to every time you want to use it and not put it right in your camp.  
 
@Bansheesdie said:

" My main complaint against the game is inconsistent difficulties, I've noticed certain circumstances were battles are incredibly difficult and others that seem too easy "

RIGHT ON! I thought I was the only one who thinks that. The game's borderline schizophrenic. The difficultly curve on this game makes the uncanny valley looks like a straight line.  
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I like that they didnt cater to the pencil and paper D&D players. The game showcases the evolution of the genre. Granted, there are some glaring balance issues in the game, but when it comes down to it, it's fun; plain and simple. I don't think I ever had a moment during the game where I went, "Wow, this is tedious and boring". I think the whole experience was just enjoying.

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biggblack86

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Edited By biggblack86

very valid points teran. really shit that bioware should have looked into come the end game in their development of the title. but i guess not all developers are perfect, and thats why god invented mods. so it seems.... >_>

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Edited By atejas

I postulate that there is no such thing as a balanced singleplayer RPG. 
I do agree that some elements feel a bit unpolished, though. Good points.

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xionpunk

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I agree, except on the part about the difficulty. Then again I only have a few Rpg's under me belt. I'm on the last battle and having a tough time once the swarm hits. I can only get the dragons health down to half  : (

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Edited By galiant

I agree with your points (and the one mentioned about poor DLC), but if there were to be any multiplayer I would have killed for some local split-screen action (despite the difficulties that may cause). This game is too good to be enjoyed alone.
 
I also wish that they would have killed more bugs before release, I've come across far too many.
 
...and what's with the ridiculous time it takes for everything to be "out of combat"? After everyone has sheathed their weapons, I have to run around in circles for far too long before the corpses start to sparkle so I can pick up the loot, or before the scripted events happen to move the story along or unlock those otherwise unlockable doors. It just feels like poor design.

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@BigLemon said:
" I like that they didnt cater to the pencil and paper D&D players. The game showcases the evolution of the genre. Granted, there are some glaring balance issues in the game, but when it comes down to it, it's fun; plain and simple. I don't think I ever had a moment during the game where I went, "Wow, this is tedious and boring". I think the whole experience was just enjoying. "
Huh. Almost the whole time I was playing it I was thinking "Wow, this is tedious and boring."
 
Don't get me wrong, I love RPGs (I still get ridiculed for making spreadsheets for RPGs to better manage grinding.), but that game just felt like work.
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Alphawolfy

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Edited By Alphawolfy

I agree with most of these points, but I guess you have quite a lot of experience with RPGs, because I find some of the fights pretty challenging. And I'm playing on Normal...

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Edited By Venom09

Sounds like a lot of stuff you pointed out are found in Baldur's Gate. I agree with you and wish they would have included these options as well. Hopefully, if a sequel is released we can hope for these things.

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MichaelBach

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Edited By MichaelBach

Good points, i agree with a lot of them.

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sixghost

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How about a fucking move command in the console version.

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The only thing I have a problem with is your complaint about there not being any evil characters. The main plot doesn't really allow you to be "evil". You can be a fucking bastard and a son of a bitch, but you still can't really be evil.
 
Also, Shale is a dwarf. How dare you.

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Edited By BigLemon
@PureRok said:
" @BigLemon said:
" I like that they didnt cater to the pencil and paper D&D players. The game showcases the evolution of the genre. Granted, there are some glaring balance issues in the game, but when it comes down to it, it's fun; plain and simple. I don't think I ever had a moment during the game where I went, "Wow, this is tedious and boring". I think the whole experience was just enjoying. "
Huh. Almost the whole time I was playing it I was thinking "Wow, this is tedious and boring."  Don't get me wrong, I love RPGs (I still get ridiculed for making spreadsheets for RPGs to better manage grinding.), but that game just felt like work. "
And I think that shows that this game may cater to a different audience. Unlike you, I have little to no experience with RPGs. Even the vernacular and jargon that you all use confuses me most of the time. I think the first RPG I played was Bioware's Mass Effect. So that may explain a lot, too.
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Teran

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Edited By Teran
@LordXavierBritish said:

" The only thing I have a problem with is your complaint about there not being any evil characters. The main plot doesn't really allow you to be "evil". You can be a fucking bastard and a son of a bitch, but you still can't really be evil.  Also, Shale is a dwarf. How dare you. "

I disagree.  Convincing werewolves to go butcher a village full of elves (even children) isn't just a bastard thing to do, it's evil.  You can laugh about it afterwords and basically admit the only reason why you did it was that werewolves were more useful to you than elves.  Defiling the ashes is another case of going beyond bastard behavior.  My over all point is that the game punishes you for doing evil things in front of certain characters (Wynne and Leliana attack if you defile the ashes in their presence, Shale attacks if you side with Branka in his presence) but there are no instances (that I know of) where choosing to do the good thing will cause a party member to leave.  Morrigan might have a hissyfit but that's not quite the same thing.
 
 

@Venom09

said:

" Sounds like a lot of stuff you pointed out are found in Baldur's Gate. I agree with you and wish they would have included these options as well. Hopefully, if a sequel is released we can hope for these things. "

You know, I've heard that from more than a few people.  I actually didn't like Baldur's Gate a whole lot back in the day, so I don't really remember the finer points of the game but I'm really thinking about replaying it to see if it is something I've grown into.
 
 

@PureRok

said:

Huh. Almost the whole time I was playing it I was thinking "Wow, this is tedious and boring."  Don't get me wrong, I love RPGs (I still get ridiculed for making spreadsheets for RPGs to better manage grinding.), but that game just felt like work. "

To each their own.  I couldn't disagree with you more on this point.  Right now I am carving my way through nightmare without using any activated abilities and basically only right clicking the mouse.  It feels like cheating but definitely not work.
 
 

@Galiant

said:

...I also wish that they would have killed more bugs before release, I've come across far too many.  ...and what's with the ridiculous time it takes for everything to be "out of combat"? After everyone has sheathed their weapons, I have to run around in circles for far too long before the corpses start to sparkle so I can pick up the loot, or before the scripted events happen to move the story along or unlock those otherwise unlockable doors. It just feels like poor design. "

What puzzles me about the whole situation is that the console versions in general had less bugs.  I don't know that I'd call the time it takes look to appear on bodies ridiculous though you may be having a radically different experience than mine.  As far as I can tell loot appearing on corpses is unrelated to whether you're in combat or not however it does tend to take longer to appear while there is fighting going on and I suspect this may just be because the engine is dedicating its resources towards keeping the fight smooth.
  
@BigLemon said:

" I like that they didnt cater to the pencil and paper D&D players. The game showcases the evolution of the genre. Granted, there are some glaring balance issues in the game, but when it comes down to it, it's fun; plain and simple. I don't think I ever had a moment during the game where I went, "Wow, this is tedious and boring". I think the whole experience was just enjoying. "

As a pen and paper D&D player I think I would agree that the game isn't catering to those tastes and I would also agree that this is probably a good thing.  My main issue about balance is that the issues go beyond glaring, they are so obvious it's like staring into the sun.  I don't know what they were thinking when they added a subclass like shape shifter to the game and then made it utterly and completely incompatible with every other mage ability... or allowing daggers to have the same number of enchantment slots as 2h weapons... or not having mage buff spells scale with attack speed (example: the slower the attack speed the more effect the spell has.  Daggers with their much faster swing timer might only get 5 damage added per hit from fiery weapons whereas a 2h sword might get 15 per hit).
 
I only felt one part of the game was tedious, and this was only on my second and third play throughs.  The fade section of the mage circle quest is just not fun the second time around because there is no puzzle to solve you know exactly what to do, where to go, and you also know you're basically going to spend the next hour running errands.  I liked it the first time but I could definitely pass on doing it again.  Bottom line is though that you're right, it is just a fun game.  That's why I still play it nearly every day.
 
 
Everyone else:  Thanks for your comments, a lot of good points have been raised.  I would like to say though that my list here is made up based on my experience with the pc version of the game.  If it's true that there's no "move" command in the console version I feel really bad for you folks but I have to ask... are you certain there's no move command?  Check the manual, it just seems really unusual that something like that would be left out of the console version just because of how simple and easy it should be to put something like that in the game... it's here in the pc version and every other game of theirs I can think of off the top of my head.
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Edited By xyzygy

I agree with mostly everything here, except the difficulty. I find I get too frustrated with the difficulty because I really don't like picking tactics for my characters. I will do it just to get by but I hate that sort of management.

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Edited By Cerza

I agree with the co-op suggestion. Even if it was just local that would be badass.

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Edited By Teran
@xyzygy: In my play throughs the only thing I use tactics for is setting the sustained abilities I always want on top to bottom, top being most critical.  My tactics look like:
 
Rogue:  (assassin bard)
Self any activate mode momentum.
Self any activate mode song of courage.

Warrior: (berserker/reaver) 
Self any activate mode berserking.
Self any activate mode momentum.
Self any activate mode precise striking. 
Self any activate mode threaten.  (usually keep this one turned off though)
 
Any ability that consumed mana or stamina I had to specifically activate.  I didn't mind this level of micromanagement because of the strategic depth involved in building a group designed to work together was just a lot of fun.  If you are finding things difficult I'd recommend more micromanagement because odds are you'll have better judgment than the computer on when to use certain abilities and just how you want to approach a fight.
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Edited By Jimbo

It did feel like archery was very gimped.  No weapon enchantment on bows and even with a full archery tree I still felt like I could switch to a single dagger at any time and be just as effective (though I usually kept my Weapon 2 empty to avoid that happening).  The one good thing about archery is Arrow of Slaying, which (on Normal at least) pretty much guarantees you a one-hit kill on an enemy mage the second a fight begins - I think my highest damage with AoS was about 430 or so.
 
Dual-wielding and offensive mages both seemed extremely overpowered, so I avoided using them in my party.
 
I didn't particularly enjoy any of the characters other than Sten, who is totally awesome.  So he flipped out and slaughtered an innocent family that was trying to help him, just because he lost his sword - we've all been there.  The Mabari is also awesome (try and have him fight the duel against Loghain), but not really worth a place in the party unfortunately.

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Teran

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Edited By Teran
@Jimbo said:

" It did feel like archery was very gimped.  No weapon enchantment on bows and even with a full archery tree I still felt like I could switch to a single dagger at any time and be just as effective (though I usually kept my Weapon 2 empty to avoid that happening).  The one good thing about archery is Arrow of Slaying, which (on Normal at least) pretty much guarantees you a one-hit kill on an enemy mage the second a fight begins - I think my highest damage with AoS was about 430 or so. Dual-wielding and offensive mages both seemed extremely overpowered, so I avoided using them in my party.  I didn't particularly enjoy any of the characters other than Sten, who is totally awesome.  So he flipped out and slaughtered an innocent family that was trying to help him, just because he lost his sword - we've all been there.  The Mabari is also awesome (try and have him fight the duel against Loghain), but not really worth a place in the party unfortunately. "

It's funny how you can't get a weapon enchant on a bow but Dog and Shale get the effect all over their body... yes that's right, you can have a flaming/icy/telekinetic dog or golem in your group.  I think the special arrow types were meant to fill this gap but arrows are so poorly implemented in the game it's sad... that's another thing Dragon Age: Journeys did better, you got a quiver with stats on it that would modify your bow attacks, far superior to the system in Origins. 
 
As for arrow of slaying, my main problem with it is that it misses a lot at long range and is terrible when compared to spells that do the same thing.  In nightmare difficulty Crushing Prison is a guaranteed kill on any white con npc and a ~10 second hold on any yellow.  I've never seen it actually work on an orange so this might be where arrow of slaying has the advantage.  Crushing Prison cannot miss and is only rarely resisted.  

Sten is by far my favorite character.  I have him in my party even though he is the weakest of the warriors you can have being stuck at only one specialization but his dialog and banter is worth the slight cut in efficiency.   He earned a permanent spot in my group when Alistair asks Sten how long he was locked in the cage and what he did to pass the time and Sten says:   
 
(click here for youtube video of the conversation)


Sten:  "On good days I posed riddles to the passersby offering them treasures in exchange for correct answers." 
Alistair:  "Really?" 
Sten: "No."
 
 
On dual wielding and offensive mages... I found offensive mages to be really weak... but then everything is compared to a good dual wield party setup... though from what I understand Archery actually is even worse with a certain setup on the console versions.
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Edited By BigLemon
@Teran said:
 I only felt one part of the game was tedious, and this was only on my second and third play throughs.  The fade section of the mage circle quest is just not fun the second time around because there is no puzzle to solve you know exactly what to do, where to go, and you also know you're basically going to spend the next hour running errands.  I liked it the first time but I could definitely pass on doing it again.  Bottom line is though that you're right, it is just a fun game.  That's why I still play it nearly every day.
 
You know what, I will completely agree with you on that. The Fade section was rather tedious, even on just one play through.
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Edited By endaround

See I found the fade fine the first playthrough.  Second playthrough about the only value was that I had two new part members so I could get different dreams.  I think the lack of random high level loot is a good thing.  The biggest issue is that amny "name" items get trounced by regular items later on.  But you still can pick up decent ramdom loot, I got a verdium dagger with three slots randomly first playthrough.   That said there seems to be a lack of decent rings, belts and staves outside of the 100 sovereign type items.  As for evil, I guess it depends.  If you're playing as an atheist or a heathen, do you really care about some urn?  As a dwarf or dhalish you couldn't get a rat's ass about some made up human religion. 

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Edited By axman36

What I want is something that I will never expect to see in any Bioware game. Respawning enemies. 
 
Maybe not an entire area respawning after your done with it, I mean only for a select few extra areas like the non main quest area of the deep roads, or for there to be another group of Darkspawn and a new batch of soldiers fighting infront of Redcliffe after you take a while. But, especially out of all of them, and if they only added this feature I'd be happy, respawning random events.
 
I mean there are just so many generic ones that they could just repeat aside from the Dwarven Merchant. I know that Bioware didn't add respawning enemies so that people won't grind, but they already made it so that enemies level with you and there's a level cap, so what kind of grind could they possibly put aside from equipment and gold grinding?Or is that the grind they wanted to prevent? With the way you can manipulate the prices of potions and buying their ingredients, the gold grind still exists, and people save before killing certain enemies so they drop their wanted weaponry, so in the end it wouldn't make too much of a significant difference for those. 
 
But even then the game is excellent without it.

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Edited By Ferginator4k

I can see a new game plus mode and co-op being tricky to implement but agree with talent synergy issues.

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@BigLemon: Ugh, I'm dreading that stupid section on my second playthrough.
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@Metalideth: Yeah, the biggest drag for me was that I kept thinking, "Oh, it's gotta be over now" and then there was more shit. I wasn't paying much attention to the layout or the cutscenes, so it just kept dragging on when I thought it was supposed to be over.
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Evilsbane

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Edited By Evilsbane

I just wanted more inventory space, I completely disagree with you about the random loot, its sounds good but no I liked the abundance of special armor much more.

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Pinkshley1

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You lost me when you went into the math comparing 2h with whatever the fuck. But yes, I am saddened to hear there is no game+, I subconsciously expected there to be one after playing ME. 

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Edited By FireBurger
@sixghost said:
" How about a fucking move command in the console version. "
This.
 
I would try and move someone away from a battle, only for me to switch characters and have them go running straight back into it. It's impossible to control the movement of more than one character on the consoles, and it can be very frustrating.
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Teran

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Edited By Teran
@axman36 said:
 I know that Bioware didn't add respawning enemies so that people won't grind, but they already made it so that enemies level with you and there's a level cap, so what kind of grind could they possibly put aside from equipment and gold grinding?Or is that the grind they wanted to prevent? With the way you can manipulate the prices of potions and buying their ingredients, the gold grind still exists, and people save before killing certain enemies so they drop their wanted weaponry, so in the end it wouldn't make too much of a significant difference for those.   But even then the game is excellent without it. "
Is there a level cap?  I haven't hit it in any of my games.  In concept though I do agree with you that certain areas would be appropriate.  I don't know that Bioware doesn't include it for fear of players grinding but most of the time it's just inappropriate given once you clear an area you've basically completely eliminated the opposition in it so there's no explanation for respawns.  Certain random encounters, deep roads, and the area around Lothering and Redcliffe on the other hand respawns could be easily explained. 
 
As for the gold grind, last I checked the system they put in for selling items is extremely exploitable.  If you want to remove gold from the equation it's pretty easy.  You can sell a hypothetical item with a hypothetical sell value of 5 sovereigns twice and then buy it back once.  In this example you end up gaining five gold per rotation.  This kind of goes hand in hand with "Where's the balance" but I didn't include this in my list because I'm honestly confused  There are exploits like this in the game that are so blatantly obvious I can't imagine it made it into the game without Bioware knowing and it seems possible that they may have overlooked this exploit on purpose.
 
Buying the good items doesn't really make the game easier in any noticeable way... well I guess spell resistance gear is the exception to that but even then the best spell resistance gear is found not bought.

  @endaround said: 
" See I found the fade fine the first playthrough.  Second playthrough about the only value was that I had two new part members so I could get different dreams.  I think the lack of random high level loot is a good thing.  The biggest issue is that amny "name" items get trounced by regular items later on.  But you still can pick up decent ramdom loot, I got a verdium dagger with three slots randomly first playthrough.
You can sell name items to the vendor in soldier's peak and come back later and buy them back at a higher tier.  Finding that dagger though isn't really random because late game you can go buy them from just about any weapon merchant.  As your character levels up the quality of loot you find will increase proportionately.  I'm not talking about random drop rates like a chest has X% chance to give you an armor or weapon item, or each humanoid npc killed has an X% chance to drop something, a system like that is already in place.  The randomness I am talking about is more that those items would have random magic stats like the 100 sovereign items scaling from barely better than a blank copy of the same weapon to comparable to the 100 sovereign items. 
 
Something like this would add a bit to the game in my opinion.  

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Edited By sixghost
@Teran said:
" @axman36 said:
 I know that Bioware didn't add respawning enemies so that people won't grind, but they already made it so that enemies level with you and there's a level cap, so what kind of grind could they possibly put aside from equipment and gold grinding?Or is that the grind they wanted to prevent? With the way you can manipulate the prices of potions and buying their ingredients, the gold grind still exists, and people save before killing certain enemies so they drop their wanted weaponry, so in the end it wouldn't make too much of a significant difference for those.   But even then the game is excellent without it. "
Is there a level cap?  I haven't hit it in any of my games.  In concept though I do agree with you that certain areas would be appropriate.  I don't know that Bioware doesn't include it for fear of players grinding but most of the time it's just inappropriate given once you clear an area you've basically completely eliminated the opposition in it so there's no explanation for respawns.  Certain random encounters, deep roads, and the area around Lothering and Redcliffe on the other hand respawns could be easily explained. 
 
As for the gold grind, last I checked the system they put in for selling items is extremely exploitable.  If you want to remove gold from the equation it's pretty easy.  You can sell a hypothetical item with a hypothetical sell value of 5 sovereigns twice and then buy it back once.  In this example you end up gaining five gold per rotation.  This kind of goes hand in hand with "Where's the balance" but I didn't include this in my list because I'm honestly confused  There are exploits like this in the game that are so blatantly obvious I can't imagine it made it into the game without Bioware knowing and it seems possible that they may have overlooked this exploit on purpose.
 
Buying the good items doesn't really make the game easier in any noticeable way... well I guess spell resistance gear is the exception to that but even then the best spell resistance gear is found not bought.

  @endaround said: 
" See I found the fade fine the first playthrough.  Second playthrough about the only value was that I had two new part members so I could get different dreams.  I think the lack of random high level loot is a good thing.  The biggest issue is that amny "name" items get trounced by regular items later on.  But you still can pick up decent ramdom loot, I got a verdium dagger with three slots randomly first playthrough.
You can sell name items to the vendor in soldier's peak and come back later and buy them back at a higher tier.  Finding that dagger though isn't really random because late game you can go buy them from just about any weapon merchant.  As your character levels up the quality of loot you find will increase proportionately.  I'm not talking about random drop rates like a chest has X% chance to give you an armor or weapon item, or each humanoid npc killed has an X% chance to drop something, a system like that is already in place.  The randomness I am talking about is more that those items would have random magic stats like the 100 sovereign items scaling from barely better than a blank copy of the same weapon to comparable to the 100 sovereign items. 
 
Something like this would add a bit to the game in my opinion.  
"

There's more of an artificial level cap, like most Bioware RPGs, since at a certain point, there's really nothing left to kill, and no more quests to do.

Do item's really scale with you if you sell them in soldier's peak? That's crazy.

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endaround

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Edited By endaround

You never run out things to kill, they just are meaningless when you need 100k for you're next level and each one you kill gives 40 XP.

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YoThatLimp

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Edited By YoThatLimp
@BigLemon said:
" @Metalideth: Yeah, the biggest drag for me was that I kept thinking, "Oh, it's gotta be over now" and then there was more shit. I wasn't paying much attention to the layout or the cutscenes, so it just kept dragging on when I thought it was supposed to be over. "
One of the parts I actually just used a walk through to mindlessly get through it with all the bonus experience in hopes it would be over s quickly as possible. Really not looking froward to doing it again!
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Sinkwater

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Edited By Sinkwater
@Teran: I'm so glad you don't work at Bioware.
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Teran

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Edited By Teran
@endaround: This is my thought exactly.  The level cap is technically soft but it is there because eventually killing enemies yields virtually no experience and because enemies in Dragon Age seem to stop scaling at a certain point so the act of leveling becomes pointless.  Add to this shallow talent trees that you can generally have maxed by level 20 and the act of leveling becomes even more pointless. 
 
@Sinkwater: Your trolling is appreciated.  A brief look at your posting history revealed that you either do not have thought processes blasting through your mind longer than a sentence, or you are utterly incapable of communicating with other human beings.
 
I don't ask that folks agree with me, all I ask is they not waste space in my blog and on my forum posts with generic internet meme quips, one sentence troll comments, or other forms of idiocy.  Everyone else in this thread who disagrees with my comments do so civilly and some even offer insight into why they disagree.
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Sinkwater

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Edited By Sinkwater
@Teran: Wow, take the internet more seriously.  I'm sorry, I'll elaborate.  Your ideas are not what I want in this game.  Therefore, if you were to have a hand in making Dragon Age, I probably would not have enjoyed it as much.  However, I would like to thank you for taking the time to post such a thoughtful and inspiring blog post.  May the internet gods shine down upon you.
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Crocio

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Edited By Crocio

 @Teran
Good points. Since the end of the first playthrough, I found myself most wanting the point 10.  i.e. More finishing moves! A bloodlust I can't satisfy.
Overall these are all very good points I though of them myself and I'm glad someone was able to write them down so well.

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Teran

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Edited By Teran
@Sinkwater:   I appreciate your elaboration.  As I said multiple times in my blog I doubted everyone who read it would agree with my comments and I also mention that a redesign of certain game elements would be necessary for some of those changes to be implemented.
  
@Crocio: I'm glad I'm not the only one who has an insatiable bloodlust!
 
@mrcool11:  This blog isn't called "ten things I love about dragon age".  If it was, I'd probably rant about all the things the game does well and there are a lot more of these than ten.  This blog isn't called "ten things in dragon age that detracted from my experience" either.  Again, if it was I'd probably have a different, smaller list.  You ask me how I could play the game for 250 hours and post these comment.  You tell me that rational people don't sit down and waste time on things they hate.  My question to you is this:  How could you assume I would play a game for 250 hours that I hate?  Did it not occur to you to ask before making such an observation?
 
I will concede that my opening paragraph wasn't very clear on my position on the over all game, in one of my earlier drafts I did mention that more specifically in the first paragraph but I cut it out because it didn't flow with the rest of the post and instead decided to insert signs of my approval in the individual points.
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Hailinel

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Edited By Hailinel

No, no multiplayer please.  I do not need multiplayer in my RPGs.  If I wanted that, I'd play WoW.

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Edited By Ubiquitous

Hey, I agree on a lot of points. But like you said, coop would COMPLETLY change the game, and the way the game is played. I for one love the game the way it iss so i wouldnt want that to have happened to it. (I hope SW:TOR turns out good)
 
BUT I reeeaallly do want a really good new coop rpg. Just like I reeeeaally want a really good new 64 player fps. But after so many years of two of my favorite types of games being pretty much completly and totally absent I'm starting to think its a pipe dream.
 

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Cefka

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Edited By Cefka
@sixghost:  I totally agree. A Ghost Recon style command interface with move, defend and follow on the directional pad would have been handy. Mass Effect uses something similar.
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Edited By sixghost
@Hailinel said:
" No, no multiplayer please.  I do not need multiplayer in my RPGs.  If I wanted that, I'd play WoW. "
Why would you care if it was an option if you never planned to use it? Would other people being able to play it 4 player coop effect your experience in any way?
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Teran

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Edited By Teran
@mrcool11:  Well I made this list outside of the bounds of what I'd realistically expect them to add.  This isn't a list of features I hope they add via dlc, these are just things I wish had made it in looking back.
 
  @Hailinel: WoW is not an rpg, WoW is a mmorpg.  There is a huge difference.  Considering the player controls four characters that can function completely independently of each other I do not see what the problem would be. 
 
@Ubiquitous: I haven't been able to faithfully play a fps since Tribes 1, I know how you feel there.  My comments on a co-op rpg though may not have been specific enough.  Some basic things would need to change to allow it but fundamentally the game could remain the same... but then it wouldn't be fully taking advantage of the co-op nature of things so I can see what you're saying.