The seventh numbered entry in the Final Fantasy franchise brings the series into 3D with a landmark title that set new industry standards for cinematic storytelling. Mercenary Cloud Strife joins the rebel group AVALANCHE in their fight against the power-hungry Shinra Company, but their struggle soon becomes a race to save the entire Planet from an impending cataclysm.
7 was awesome back in the day, but i fear it doesn't hold up strongly nowadays due to aging. If you're going to play any version of FF7, play the PC version.
@Turambar: IX was in development concurrently with VIII, post-VII. I don't know what you are thinking of otherwise. Unless it's time period/setting, in which case why the shit would that make a difference.
IX was a SNES era game made for the PSX era. It was far different in both tone and style than the two games that came before it.
It wasn't a SNES-era game, they just changed the setting/tone/style because they wanted to make something different than the futurist settings they had with VII and the in-development VIII. It's still a PSX game and, despite not being all that bad, is still just another FF game.
@QuistisTrepe Suuuure ya do. Cause saying that someone's opinion is laughably absurd sounds like somebody open to discussion. Why must I be so butthurt?? Anyway like I said I've been down this road with you and id rather not repeat it thanks. Cause ya know...butthurt.
I grew up with FFIV, and it's certainly one of my favorite RPGs, but damned if VII didn't confirm RPGs as (probably) my favorite genre. Games can mean different things to different people, and VII means a lot to me. Other people are allowed to dislike it, and that's fine. I don't much like VIII at all, but that doesn't mean everyone has to feel the same as I do.
Not everyone has to have the same opinion on a game, but VII almost certainly is the most divisive game in the series. It's tough for fans of VII to constantly have to hear about these opinions too; no one likes to hear the game they like so much get trashed on all the time. You just to have to learn to deal with it, and move on. I've certainly learned that people are going to laugh at my taste in games, but I have chosen to be happy with what I like and fuck anyone who wants to make me feel otherwise.
@Leptok: The moment that people stop holding FF7 in this messianic light of holy greatness that was bestowed upon this Earth and can do no wrong...and instead realize that it was the first Final Fantasy on PlayStation and people were naive as fuck when it was released...
...that's the moment the hate will stop. FF4 and FF6 are light years beyond FF7 in story, gameplay, and atmosphere.
@Turambar: IX was in development concurrently with VIII, post-VII. I don't know what you are thinking of otherwise. Unless it's time period/setting, in which case why the shit would that make a difference.
IX was a SNES era game made for the PSX era. It was far different in both tone and style than the two games that came before it.
It wasn't a SNES-era game, they just changed the setting/tone/style because they wanted to make something different than the futurist settings they had with VII and the in-development VIII. It's still a PSX game and, despite not being all that bad, is still just another FF game.
You misunderstand what I mean. That setting/tone/style is what makes it a SNES era Final Fantasy game. I'm not talking about development period, I'm purely talking about thematic elements.
Jeff has never liked Final Fantasy VII since its release. Brad has either been less public about his taste pre-GB or I simply don't know his previous tastes.
@Turambar: IX was in development concurrently with VIII, post-VII. I don't know what you are thinking of otherwise. Unless it's time period/setting, in which case why the shit would that make a difference.
IX was a SNES era game made for the PSX era. It was far different in both tone and style than the two games that came before it.
It wasn't a SNES-era game, they just changed the setting/tone/style because they wanted to make something different than the futurist settings they had with VII and the in-development VIII. It's still a PSX game and, despite not being all that bad, is still just another FF game.
You misunderstand what I mean. That setting/tone/style is what makes it a SNES era Final Fantasy game. I'm not talking about development period, I'm purely talking about thematic elements.
That's like saying Titanic is like a silent film because it's set in 1912. Its setting and tone was what it was because of the games that came before it.
@QuistisTrepe Suuuure ya do. Cause saying that someone's opinion is laughably absurd sounds like somebody open to discussion.
Oh thanks, I had quite forgotten your questionable reading comprehension from our last discussion. Thank for the reminder.
The quote in question was, "There's nothing objectively wrong or broken with it. I feel like they lay into for subjective reasons and spite for somehow denigrating the games before." The absurdity of the quote is self-evident. Am I to accept that FFVII is somehow beyond reproach? as the OP implies? Are you kidding me with this nonsense?
You don't go posting stuff like that on a forum of any kind and not expect some disagreement. That's not being argumentative for the sake of it, that's calling someone out on a bullshit premise. Again, I'm sorry for you that you take disagreement so personally.
I think that a lot of the people who dislike FF7 are fair-weather fans I bet you most the people who say they dislike it today loved it or at least were indifferent to it when it came out.
Not me. I've hated every FF game I've ever played, and I've played way too many of them because people keep telling me how great they are.
Next person who tries to get me to play one I'm punching in the fuckin' throat.
Some of the battle systems have been decent, but I've hated every character in every FF game, and the stories are some of the worst videogame stories ever, which is really saying something.
Convoluted nonsensical garbage. I also hate the giant hair and the stupid oversized swords. And the 25 minute summon cutscenes. Also draw magic. The series as a whole is indefensible garbage and only creepy fuck weeabos and people who love mediocrity has any love for it.
I like FF7 a lot but it does not bother me that it's a whipping boy for Brad, Jeff and Patrick. The thing I find interesting is that Brad and Patrick like 8 but dislike 7 for the changes it brought to the series. What is it about 8 that they like.
I think that a lot of the people who dislike FF7 are fair-weather fans I bet you most the people who say they dislike it today loved it or at least were indifferent to it when it came out.
Not me. I've hated every FF game I've ever played, and I've played way too many of them because people keep telling me how great they are.
Next person who tries to get me to play one I'm punching in the fuckin' throat.
I think that a lot of the people who dislike FF7 are fair-weather fans I bet you most the people who say they dislike it today loved it or at least were indifferent to it when it came out.
Not me. I've hated every FF game I've ever played, and I've played way too many of them because people keep telling me how great they are.
Next person who tries to get me to play one I'm punching in the fuckin' throat.
Some of the battle systems have been decent, but I've hated every character in every FF game, and the stories are some of the worst videogame stories ever, which is really saying something.
Convoluted nonsensical garbage. I also hate the giant hair and the stupid oversized swords. And the 25 minute summon cutscenes. Also draw magic. The series as a whole is indefensible garbage and only creepy fuck weeabos and people who love mediocrity has any love for it.
Or you could relax and play games you enjoy. Have you considered that?
I started FFVII for the first time a couple days ago. I'm 15 minutes in. I'll have an opinion when I finish it a year or two from now.
I was thinking about making a thread about this myself. I find it a lot in the games industry when there's talk of Final Fantasy people go out of their way to say 'FUCK VII', it just comes off as crotchety old men sitting on the porch 'back in my day, we had the good JRPGs, they don't make 'em like they used to' when in fact in all probability the last JRPG they actually played (looking at most of the GB crew) was in the 8 and 16 bit era so they just have some form of dated nostalgia. It's hipsterish at this point to hate on FFVII, just because its popular.
Now if you're going to have a constructive argument about WHY it isn't as good as the other's I'll hear you - 'Adding the materia system took away the job system and made all the characters feel the same and soulless.' There constructive criticism I could get into a conversation about. Not just blanket statement 'FUCK THAT GAME.'
In closing like for a certain age range of people Pokemon was their first RPG, my first was Final Fantasy VII and as such will always hold a special place in my development of game appreciation.
Yet at least Patrick and Brad like FFVIII as the better game, and given Patrick is much closer to the demo that would have been blown away by FF VII I don't see how that's at all a valid conclusion as to why they don't like FFVII. Given Jeff had long since divorced himself from the fandom by then I don't think he matters in this.
You trying to hold back a waterfall with your hands. 'A' for effort, but it just can't be done. You can't kill fanboys opinions, especially on the internet.
Fine, have an opinion, but don't talk like the game exploded your playstation and killed your dog with plastic shrapnel. Yeah, they don't like the way the series went after 7, but it's not the game's fault.
Except that Brad and Patrick both found FF VIII to be better. Said as much on the Bombcast.
I like FF7 a lot but it does not bother me that it's a whipping boy for Brad, Jeff and Patrick. The thing I find interesting is that Brad and Patrick like 8 but dislike 7 for the changes it brought to the series. What is it about 8 that they like.
I'd be interested to here that too. I don't see VII as the second coming that some seem to, but it was a pretty solid game, fantastic even. 8 on the other hand didn't have much going for it, besides some pretty impressive scenes at a few points. The combat was pretty broken and the story and characters were terrible. I find it hard to believe someone could hate VII but love VIII.
IX was a masterpiece though, I really hope XV goes back to basics and gives us a similar feeling game to that.
You trying to hold back a waterfall with your hands. 'A' for effort, but it just can't be done. You can't kill fanboys opinions, especially on the internet.
Fine, have an opinion, but don't talk like the game exploded your playstation and killed your dog with plastic shrapnel. Yeah, they don't like the way the series went after 7, but it's not the game's fault.
Except that Brad and Patrick both found FF VIII to be better. Said as much on the Bombcast.
Yes, but they've also gone on for a while about how the people who did 7 ruined FF.
I think that a lot of the people who dislike FF7 are fair-weather fans I bet you most the people who say they dislike it today loved it or at least were indifferent to it when it came out.
Not me. I've hated every FF game I've ever played, and I've played way too many of them because people keep telling me how great they are.
Next person who tries to get me to play one I'm punching in the fuckin' throat.
Some of the battle systems have been decent, but I've hated every character in every FF game, and the stories are some of the worst videogame stories ever, which is really saying something.
Convoluted nonsensical garbage. I also hate the giant hair and the stupid oversized swords. And the 25 minute summon cutscenes. Also draw magic. The series as a whole is indefensible garbage and only creepy fuck weeabos and people who love mediocrity has any love for it.
Or you could relax and play games you enjoy. Have you considered that?
I started FFVII for the first time a couple days ago. I'm 15 minutes in. I'll have an opinion when I finish it a year or two from now.
I do, all the time. Playing through Baldur's Gate 1+2 and the expansions using Tutu again at the moment. Fantastic games.
I just thought the whole "stop picking on FF7" thing popping up in the sidebar was funny, because my entire experience with FF is people trying to shove it down my throat and me hating every second of it.
You shouldn't care if someone doesn't like what you like, especially when it's something as insignificant as video games. My favourite FF games are V and VII, I'm sure many would say they're the worst ones, but I love them, and that's all that matters to me.
Truth is, I feel you. Watching the TNT a few weeks back when they were playing MUA, and listening to them pretty much bash on comics intermittently, and be totally off-base at times for about 2 hours was disappointing. However, I didn't feel immediately galvanized to run and make a thread bashing them for it. What difference would it make? Like they really care what we think. To each their own, man. I get your frustration though, I really do. You just wish you were in the same room so you can give your two cents. They're opinions are just as meaningless as ours are, so at the end of the day...who cares?
Again no ones opinions should be held on a higher ground who cares!. I cannot count how many times I've disagreed with those guys it shouldn't matter to anyone, did you like the danm game? good have fun with it and hang out with people who also liked it so you don't get pissed. Opinions : the only ones that matter are the ones that agree with yours.
@QuistisTrepe Ok let's simplify this then cause I clearly can't hang with you at your level. I think that game is great. In my opinion I don't think there's a thing wrong with it. If you're fine with that we don't have a problem an we can both be happy!
How about fuck the main series all together? Kefka was awesome, but that's all I really care about. Now Tactics, THAT'S a videogame.
@MarkWahlberg: Tactics Advanced was an abomination.
(Actually, I admittedly never beat it, got burnt out on sidequests years ago. As a game, it was just fine, but the world was ughhh. Maybe I was comparing it too much to the original Tactics, but that first snowball fight I think illustrates what I dislike about that game pretty well)
Tactics Advance is actually the only FF game I've ever played, so I just say that whenever this silly debate comes up. I mean, yes hoollly shit is that possibly the worst beginning to a game ever made - hooray 40 minute nonskippable tutorial/cutscenes! - but as far as turn-based combat stuff goes, it was pretty fun. The story/setting itself wasn't anything special, but I didn't think it was bad - especially not by video game standards- and I kinda liked the art style. Just out of curiosity, how is it related to the original Tactics? Remake, Spin-off, etc? I don't really know anything about how FF games relate to each other.
@QuistisTrepe said:
@MarkWahlberg said:
FF:TA or GTFO
That game was dog shit. That is all.
*Imagines dog shit stuffed into a GBA cartridge slot*
I think this is one of those times when it is better to let it go mostly because they aren't saying "FF7 is a horrible game!", they are instead saying "I've grown to think FF7 is a horrible game!" See the difference? That they aren't trying to push down the opinion as a fact (which they have done before many times); they are just voicing their own opinion on it. I don't think they would be completely shocked/angry/dissappointed or anything if someone were to tell them "I actually really like FF7 and believe it to not only be a great game in its own right but I also really loved the direction it took the series" because with this I think it is just them speaking on their own opinion (for instance, I think Jeff says these things as a barrier to just say "change the subject" because he is simply done with the series).
There is a clear difference between this and other times they have spoken about the Final Fantasy series where they have simply put out their opinion as fact (like when they talk about how they think the style of the characters needs to be changed or the numerous times Jeff has said non-jokingly how Final Fantasy IV is the best FF game and all other answers are wrong), this however is just them leaking out their bitterness for the series.
In the same way no Kingdom Hearts fan should get angry at them for each time they talk about how they hate the KH series, FF VII fans shouldn't get angry at their recent comments on that single game (or anyone who prefers any of the FF games from 7 onwards over the non-3D titles). Generally it is probably wise not to listen to them on anything related to JRPG's (or just react to them in the same way you would react if you heard a group of strangers talking about it across the street - because in reality that is the relation that their opinion on these things should be to you).
Sometimes people need to realise that things like Video Games are incredibly subjective and how someone thinks about them shouldn't affect you - you don't need validation for liking the things you like (or disliking the things that you don't). Seriously, even if every reviewer and other person in the world has one opinion on a game doesn't mean you also have to believe it too - and anyone that tells you otherwise can go fuck themselves.
Final Fantasy 7 has become like a religion. People who like it are constantly trying to shove it in your face, and the second you strike back by showing any of it's flaws, people cry victim and claim that you just need to leave Final Fantasy 7 alone! Naturally, this kills all debate, and it becomes easier to say "Fuck you" than bother with the histrionics.
Seriously. Do people get this upset about people who don't like Forza? Calm down.
Final Fantasy 7 has become like a religion. People who like it are constantly trying to shove it in your face, and the second you strike back by showing any of it's flaws, people cry victim and claim that you just need to leave Final Fantasy 7 alone! Naturally, this kills all debate, and it becomes easier to say "Fuck you" than bother with the histrionics.
Seriously. Do people get this upset about people who don't like Forza? Calm down.
Final Fantasy 7 has become like a religion. People who like it are constantly trying to shove it in your face, and the second you strike back by showing any of it's flaws, people cry victim and claim that you just need to leave Final Fantasy 7 alone! Naturally, this kills all debate, and it becomes easier to say "Fuck you" than bother with the histrionics.
Seriously. Do people get this upset about people who don't like Forza? Calm down.
Wait a few years when Forza 7 comes out, shit is going to go down like no other.
haha funny the people going after people who like FF 7 and are defending it as a good game. There's nothing wrong with saying a game gets too much hate. It's just annoying to have a good game called shitty by so many. Even if it's not to your taste, saying it's a bad game? A total force.
And also, people who like Jeff and Brad said it's the start of the "downfall" of FF, funny because it's a pretty traditional FF game in mechanics and 8 was the game that took it in a weird direction mechanics wise. These are the type of people that also criticize games for failing to change from iteration to iteration too...
It's not whining to say people go overboard hating on something. That's an opinion too. You can't defend your own opinion and then call others opinion whining.
If you played the Earlier games and just stopped playing them, I could see why FFVII could be where the series in some minds took a downturn. I believe Jeff has said on many times, that he liked a lot of the older JRPGs in the 16-bit era and just stopped playing them once we get into the PS1 era.
Final Fantasy 7 has become like a religion. People who like it are constantly trying to shove it in your face, and the second you strike back by showing any of it's flaws, people cry victim and claim that you just need to leave Final Fantasy 7 alone! Naturally, this kills all debate, and it becomes easier to say "Fuck you" than bother with the histrionics.
Seriously. Do people get this upset about people who don't like Forza? Calm down.
I'm conviced a lot of the people out there talking FF7 up never really played it, it's just your standard creepy internet forum groupthink thing.
I'm not saying there are no people who value good gameplay and story so little that they have thoroughly played FF7 and still thought it was good, but I have to believe most people have higher standards than that.
FFVII was great. It was just all the VII-stuff that came afterward that was crap. Advent Children, Dirge of Cerberus, even Crisis Core.
I'm one of those people that would love a remake of VII, but knowing how Square has treated the "franchise", they'd probably ruin it by including additional stuff from those later games.
Going back and playing FFVII, yeah, the graphics are pretty bad, but it still plays well. Believe it or not, the one thing that has aged enough to bother me is the lack of analog control.
@kashif1: It's not that there are typos or anything, the context is just poorly presented. It was in the earlier days of translation, and it just wasn't tight. Plot points are muddy that shouldn't be, and certain beats just don't hit right. Another good example of a game with a poor translation is Wild ARMS 2. When playing it, you can just tell that it's not what it's supposed to be. Translators today are infinitely better. Take, for example, the Persona series. They are super tight, perfectly understandable, and converted to clear English without losing some of its original flavor and plot. FFVII, along with a lot of early PS1 games, just doesn't have that. By the time FFVIII and FFIX rolled around, it was starting to get better. FFVII just missed it.
Yeah, well Final Fantasy XIII is my favorite. So what do you have to say to that!?
XIII probably has the best combat system out of all the ones I've played. Got a bit hectic at times. Just too bad everything around it was so awful.
Snow and Vanille both are just terrible characters, and the plot is complete nonsense. Also some of the worst pacing I've ever seen in a computer game.
Yeah, well Final Fantasy XIII is my favorite. So what do you have to say to that!?
Like the fighting system, finally decided to pick it back up. The thing that really bothers me is the no leveling up, I really would like to see a FF in the future learn from things from WRPGs like for instance being able to pick one off perks for each character when they level up like Fallout. Also you may be able to help me out with this, I've been stock piling all the materials for upgrading weapons, all my weapons are level 1, should I wait for a decent weapon and put all my materials into those or should I be upgrading the weapons I have now? Im on chapter 11
Who cares if they dislike it big deal opinion is opinion.
Granted some people dislike it just for the fact that its overrated instead of it actually being a bad game, whether or not that is a valid point for disliking it i do not know.
Guys, guys, can't we all just agree that JRPGs are universally terrible and move on to a less controversial topic, like why Mass Effect 3 had an amazing ending, or why Duke Nukem Forever is the best FPS since Duke 3D?
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